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DFW

(60,170 posts)
10. I wish I had had your chance to talk to him
Fri Feb 28, 2020, 07:10 AM
Feb 2020

I'd bet anything that he knew of Unamuno and his speech to the Spanish Fascists (you will conquer, but not convince). Because of the play on words it forms in Spanish (vencer/convencer=conquer/convince), I can imagine Unamuno speaking, emphasizing that one syllable "con" that made the meaning of the two words so different. "Vencer" meaning to conquer physically, and "convencer" meaning to conquer intellectually. I find it interesting that in English, the direct descendant of "vencer," i.e. "vanquish," has become almost obsolete in daily use, where the direct descendant of "convencer," i.e. "convince" has remained current.

In Spain, even today in big cities like Madrid and Barcelona, they still usually close down for about three hours at lunchtime. Obviously, few people want or need three hours for lunch. So they talk about almost anything BUT work. It gives them time to air their views with others, talk about things happening in the world other than their own personal lives. As you have seen with Spain's history, especially of the last 150 years, it has not led them to divine insight on how to solve the problems of their country or the world. Far from it. But maybe what it DOES do is give them insight into how others (both pro and con) feel about issues that concern them all.

When I am in Barcelona, I usually take lunch with a Catalan friend I have known for many years. Not only does it give me the chance to speak Catalan for hours uninterrupted, thus keeping the language fresh in my mind, it also refreshes my awareness on what they are thinking about down there. We occasionally talk about the Catalan separation movement (my friend, a dedicated Catalan patriot, is dead set against it, as he is also a pragmatist, knowing what it would mean for Catalunya on a practical basis). We talk about the USA (their pronunciation comes out, appropriately enough, as "Tramp" ). And we talk about our families, and most anything else.

It never changes anyone's mind, of course, but it sometimes DOES let you in on how others think, especially if there are three or four at the table. To some extent, I sense that in the USA, particularly on the right, but we are not immune, either, everyone wants to think they know what the other side is thinking, but in reality they no earthly clue.

Of all people, my friend from the right wing lunatic fringe (he thinks the same of me on the left, of course), Richard Viguerie, likes to attend gatherings where he is a minority of one. If you don't know the name, he is easy to find. He is so far to the right, if he takes two steps in the wrong direction, he'll fall off the edge of this flat earth. I asked him once why he would even consider hanging around "kommanists" like us. He says it helps him to know how we think. What it does is help him formulate the frothing-at-the-mouth crap he puts out on his website and in his publications. But he does it cleverly, knowing in the back of his mind how WE see things. He is nonetheless convinced HE's right, of course, and thus doesn't hesitate to let us in on his view of the world. It is maddening, but it is also INFORMATIVE. Infuriating as he is, he also radiates a certain charisma, something most on the radical right do not even attempt to do to anyone outside their own bubble.

As for your encounter--that really IS timely. Beyond random? David Ben Gurion was reputed to have said that anyone who does not believe in miracles is not a realist.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

Good read! Alliepoo Feb 2020 #1
Thanks! DFW Feb 2020 #2
Thank you I hope people will heed. ... Hekate Feb 2020 #3
I think you're waiting for Godot with that DFW Feb 2020 #4
Ain't that the truth Hekate Feb 2020 #5
Thank you...much appreciated, believe me!❤ Karadeniz Feb 2020 #6
Glad to hear it, thanks! n/t DFW Feb 2020 #23
I feel like this needs to be put into a Star Wars crawl. Initech Feb 2020 #7
People would probably walk out before the opening credits were over! n/t DFW Feb 2020 #22
Unfortunately, Spain's story may repeat, they have chosen people to lead them who were involved Perseus Feb 2020 #8
Franco became a pragmatist early on, a realist only toward the end DFW Feb 2020 #11
I wish you were teaching history somewhere nearby. I'd enroll in the U just for it. erronis Feb 2020 #20
I've never taught a class. It might not go well. DFW Feb 2020 #21
DFW- I met a man today. I recognized a certain, common spiritual awareness about him, NBachers Feb 2020 #9
I wish I had had your chance to talk to him DFW Feb 2020 #10
I knew it was Spain by the end of the first sentence. panader0 Feb 2020 #12
Good to hear that some still know that more happened in the 20th century than the Beatles DFW Feb 2020 #13
Bookmarked for closer reading when I have time. Thank you, my dear DFW! n/t CaliforniaPeggy Feb 2020 #14
Just my usual rambling. Make sure you are good and bored! DFW Feb 2020 #15
You are NOT rambling! It's a very intelligently written treatise. CaliforniaPeggy Feb 2020 #16
very cleverly written! Lionel Mandrake Feb 2020 #17
For much of the year, I practically commute between the two former enemies DFW Feb 2020 #18
A few minor points ... Lionel Mandrake Feb 2020 #19
True about Guderian, but DFW Feb 2020 #24
Yes, and Hitler's micromanagement lasted until the end. Lionel Mandrake Feb 2020 #25
I guessed Spain until the paragraph about the money from their PatrickforO Mar 2020 #26
I am confident we will vote Trump out of office. After all, we never voted him in. DFW Mar 2020 #27
Holy cow! You've told me something I never, ever knew, but that PatrickforO Mar 2020 #28
Fascinating thread. n/t Liberal In Texas Mar 2020 #29
Ended up going off on a few side tangents. DFW Mar 2020 #30
Side tangents were also very interesting. n/t Liberal In Texas Mar 2020 #31
Brilliant. And it lead me to think of this. Javaman Mar 2020 #32
Thanks for the kind words! DFW Mar 2020 #33
then they don't know what they are missing. :) Cheers! nt Javaman Mar 2020 #34
Oh, I think they know what they want, and I think they understand me fine. DFW Mar 2020 #35
Thank you for one of the most rewarding threads I have read. dixiegrrrrl Mar 2020 #36
Even before that DFW Mar 2020 #37
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