General Discussion

Jake Stern

(3,146 posts)

73. There is a world of difference

Thu Apr 30, 2020, 06:48 PM

Apr 2020

between killing someone who is locked away in a high security facility with very little chance to escape and shooting someone who is part of an armed mob and acting violently at that moment.

I am opposed to capital punishment but I am not opposed to taking down an insurrection. I sincerely wish it can be done peacefully but if they escalate then they need to be met with force.

The Bundy protestors had weapons openly pointed at Federal law enforcement and the government just tucked tail and walked away. There is a direct line between the Bundy standoff and the invasion and occupation of Malheur refuge.

The blood at Waco was on Koresh's hands. He could have surrendered at any time and stopped the standoff. Janet Reno made some blunders but at the end of the day Koresh decided their fate for them.

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If armed people storm a state Capitol building, [View all] MineralMan Apr 2020 OP

Absolutely right. n/t CaliforniaPeggy Apr 2020 #1

We are not for state murder. jimfields33 Apr 2020 #15

For once I agree with you. marble falls Apr 2020 #22

Yeah! Very glad. jimfields33 Apr 2020 #66

Apparently sarisataka Apr 2020 #44

It's not State murder. Glamrock Apr 2020 #58

Ignorant statement ripcord May 2020 #130

You are absolutely right Glamrock May 2020 #136

Don't let anything including the facts get in the way of your personal outrage? ripcord May 2020 #141

You are absolutely correct. Glamrock May 2020 #165

If you see what he said, they should be ordered to put down their weapons, if not.... George II Apr 2020 #62

Murder's defined by who draws first and intent. In this case, the state uses defensive force. ancianita Apr 2020 #79

I can see all sorts of charges - terrorism, kidnapping (people held at gunpoint), harassment, etc. George II Apr 2020 #94

Absolutely. There's probably enough video footage of it all to support any of those charges. ancianita Apr 2020 #95

As a poster already pointed out, they are not breaking any laws doing what they're doing. oldsoftie May 2020 #151

Many of the images floating around are from other locations and other times as well. SQUEE May 2020 #155

There is a standing Executive Order in Michigan prohibiting gatherings of more than several people.. George II May 2020 #156

I agree. The first step should be to tell them they're under arrest.. Volaris Apr 2020 #103

Do you think... Newest Reality Apr 2020 #2

Fuck them. Enough. MineralMan Apr 2020 #6

Now that I can get behind whole heartedly. Disarm them and enter them onto the "no guns' list. marble falls Apr 2020 #25

I agree. smirkymonkey Apr 2020 #38

They should be arrested Rebl2 Apr 2020 #74

As a person that will be doing that murder FOR you... SQUEE Apr 2020 #105

Thank you. nt dware Apr 2020 #110

Gonna be kinda dangerous to try to pass such a law with rifles in the gallery. moriah May 2020 #177

Will letting them get away with that behavior encourage more of it? Flaleftist Apr 2020 #23

Look what avoiding confrontation got us with the Bundy assholes Jake Stern Apr 2020 #55

The fact that they are there protecting the Governor makes the police "fascist" in the eyes of ehrnst Apr 2020 #64

In a word: Yup. old guy Apr 2020 #3

It is legal in MI to open-carry a weapon in the Capitol, which is nuts The Velveteen Ocelot Apr 2020 #4

Not if you are threatening anyone, it's not. MineralMan Apr 2020 #10

If those people had been black it would have been a whole different story. The Velveteen Ocelot Apr 2020 #11

Black people are too smart to do such things. MineralMan Apr 2020 #13

Well, not really.... former9thward Apr 2020 #43

Really ? You're using events from 60 plus years ago, Haggis for Breakfast Apr 2020 #50

Maybe you should have read the posts. former9thward Apr 2020 #52

I commented on YOUR post. Haggis for Breakfast Apr 2020 #54

Actually considering how bad it's today yes they would have been rockfordfile Apr 2020 #99

Poster is using the comparison that this is a legal form of free expression. AtheistCrusader May 2020 #145

Thanks. For post and link. Reading now. RestoreAmerica2020 Apr 2020 #53

(many) White people are threatened by black people just existing anywhere near them. MH1 May 2020 #132

It was legal in California, too, until this event happened Brother Buzz Apr 2020 #30

And the NRA rode shotgun on passing "gun control" laws...nt Wounded Bear Apr 2020 #39

Curious how that worked back then Brother Buzz Apr 2020 #89

This is part of the reason that lots of gun owners can't stand the NRA. AtheistCrusader May 2020 #147

yep llashram Apr 2020 #5

This is a show of paramilitary force against the government Maven Apr 2020 #7

Since when do Americans follow the rules if (R)? Brainfodder May 2020 #143

Here's a story about the armed Black Panthers invading the California HeartachesNhangovers Apr 2020 #8

So? MineralMan Apr 2020 #14

I hate bloothirsty exhortations from Internet tough guys. Vinnie From Indy Apr 2020 #16

The job of the State Police is to protect MineralMan Apr 2020 #19

Should the state police have opened fire first? Vinnie From Indy Apr 2020 #27

Did you read my post? MineralMan Apr 2020 #34

Not surprised you trivialize it... LanternWaste Apr 2020 #24

.. MineralMan Apr 2020 #37

So it's a good thing that cooler heads than yours prevailed that day. HeartachesNhangovers Apr 2020 #40

So? AtheistCrusader May 2020 #146

AND they threatened no one, at a time cops were shooting them in their beds & unarmed on the street. marble falls Apr 2020 #26

Correct! Alacritous Crier Apr 2020 #28

Of all of the times to engage in whataboutism... Politicub Apr 2020 #61

Their causes are different. And I would argue, the Black Panthers comported themselves much AtheistCrusader May 2020 #149

No comparison Jake Stern Apr 2020 #63

I know, those armed white terrorist snowflakes have a history of being murdered, right? 58Sunliner May 2020 #135

"They are mass murderers." Who did they kill, and which protester(s) killed them? friendly_iconoclast May 2020 #178

The gun culture has spawned many killers. 58Sunliner May 2020 #179

Nice deflection! friendly_iconoclast May 2020 #182

They don't have to be mass murderers. 58Sunliner May 2020 #184

To your knowledge, which ones at the demonstration were killers? friendly_iconoclast May 2020 #183

If armed people in a red state stormed in demanding everyone shelter in place ...... rickford66 Apr 2020 #9

It happened in the Kentucky State House last month Sugarcoated Apr 2020 #102

Believe me, if they were Black, they would be instantly shot dead by cops Blue_true Apr 2020 #12

yeppers AllaN01Bear Apr 2020 #17

Agree with you 100%. Paladin Apr 2020 #18

I'd settle for tased and incarcerated. panader0 Apr 2020 #20

But Mineral Man...they weren't doing anything wrong. Caliman73 Apr 2020 #21

+1 dalton99a Apr 2020 #33

Not taking action will only embolden the next group of disgrunted white men Mr. Ected Apr 2020 #29

Absolutely. Anything less is Un-American. Ferrets are Cool Apr 2020 #31

Gotta wonder why bluestarone Apr 2020 #32

This is a riot!!!! mfcorey1 Apr 2020 #35

If they were black or brown they would have been shot immediately without ordering them to drop arms Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2020 #36

Absolutely!!!!!!!!!!! WyattKansas Apr 2020 #41

I agree a hundred percent. They would be the first to wet themselves when bullets start flying yaesu Apr 2020 #42

i don't understand how you can carry a weapon into a building where weapons are not allowed...... Takket Apr 2020 #45

Should never have allowed the Bundy ranchers to drawdown on federal agents. Hoyt Apr 2020 #46

Does the name David Koresh ring a bell? MicaelS Apr 2020 #47

Not even similar to that. MineralMan Apr 2020 #71

There is a world of difference Jake Stern Apr 2020 #73

Seems to me this has been the RW playbook since the Bundys got off. Now it's in capitol buildings dameatball Apr 2020 #48

Covid-19 will be issuing Darwin Awards to some of these yahoos... artemisia1 Apr 2020 #49

But are they black and selling loose cigarettes? ehrnst Apr 2020 #51

They're mostly or all white males uponit7771 Apr 2020 #56

Agree 100 percent. It is an assassination attempt Politicub Apr 2020 #57

Most of those armed at the protests couldn't run up the steps without dropping dead of a heart Pepsidog Apr 2020 #59

Photos of this incident vapor2 Apr 2020 #60

Yes. warmfeet Apr 2020 #65

These are mostly musicman65 Apr 2020 #67

Steps: Red Mountain Apr 2020 #68

But they're white. That makes it okay. Iggo Apr 2020 #69

insurrection and sedition DENVERPOPS Apr 2020 #70

My recall is not clear. . . Collimator Apr 2020 #72

What you say should have happened zentrum Apr 2020 #75

Except that they might not have had an opportunity to MineralMan Apr 2020 #76

They wouldn't have made it all the way up the front steps Jake Stern Apr 2020 #77

Very possibly. MineralMan Apr 2020 #78

I witnessed unarmed Vietnam War protestors tear gassed at the Pentagon eleny Apr 2020 #80

Yes. So did I. Enough, already. MineralMan Apr 2020 #82

Yes, it's now clear to anybody paying attention where these fascist terrorists want to go. hadEnuf Apr 2020 #81

A little blast of tear gas out of a cannon might give them a taste of reality - as a first step eleny Apr 2020 #84

Yes that would be hilarious! hadEnuf Apr 2020 #86

Snowflakes are meltng - beware of the tsunami! eleny Apr 2020 #88

We did that with the Bundy crew Jake Stern Apr 2020 #97

The Bundy terrorists aiming guns at law enforcement was breaking the law. hadEnuf Apr 2020 #119

All of these protests at state capitals are a rehearsal LuvNewcastle Apr 2020 #83

If a frog had wings... Bonx Apr 2020 #85

You know how bad killing these idiots would look, correct? jmowreader Apr 2020 #87

I'd prefer a more aggressive approach Red Mountain Apr 2020 #91

Not crazy about that idea... gristy Apr 2020 #90

The first step in arresting a person bearing firearms is MineralMan Apr 2020 #93

ok, fair enough gristy Apr 2020 #96

Was what they were doing illegal? Red Mountain Apr 2020 #101

The police have no authority to disarm them ripcord Apr 2020 #104

Message auto-removed Name removed Apr 2020 #114

Message auto-removed Name removed Apr 2020 #118

Agreed samplegirl Apr 2020 #92

Well at least the nutbags know where they can easily kill a bunch of politicians Marrah_Goodman Apr 2020 #98

Discharge Smackdown2019 Apr 2020 #100

I expect the state police knew what was going on Steelrolled Apr 2020 #106

There are cameras everywhere. The armed people should not be surprised when the FBI NoRoadUntravelled Apr 2020 #107

FBI? Really? dware Apr 2020 #109

Discretion is the better part of valor Locutusofborg Apr 2020 #108

No. roamer65 Apr 2020 #111

Arrested for what? dware Apr 2020 #113

That will end when Dems take control in November. roamer65 Apr 2020 #116

I agree that it should be illegal, dware Apr 2020 #117

Message auto-removed Name removed Apr 2020 #112

Carrying weapons in the Michigan State Capitol is not a violation of the law, dware Apr 2020 #115

That's EXACTLY what those armed douches are hoping will happen. progressoid May 2020 #120

The SWAT team should of been called in. sellitman May 2020 #121

This is no time to be wishy washy dlk May 2020 #122

At Most State Facilities,... NCDawg May 2020 #123

Apparently, the Michigan state legislature has passed no such law MineralMan May 2020 #124

Hope I'm wrong about this, but l too see it as a rehearsal by the Enoki33 May 2020 #125

Yes, perhaps so. MineralMan May 2020 #126

Hmm. I don't know if a slaughter is the right response. fescuerescue May 2020 #127

That's why you order the armed men to put their guns down and step MineralMan May 2020 #128

Well I'm just glad that there wasnt a shootout fescuerescue May 2020 #164

"Lawful people would comply." What they did was legal, like it or not (and I don't, btw) friendly_iconoclast May 2020 #167

Agree. They put many lives in danger. It was an armed assault no 2 ways about it. Fla Dem May 2020 #129

Unfortunately, under Michigan law... MrModerate May 2020 #131

exactly Locrian May 2020 #134

That's exactly how I feel about these terrorists. 58Sunliner May 2020 #133

Agree somewhat Catherine Vincent May 2020 #137

MinMan and other commentators - How would you square this discussion with "Stand your ground.... EarnestPutz May 2020 #138

I agree Proud Liberal Dem May 2020 #139

She should call in the armed state police and arrest anyone who does this. lark May 2020 #140

This is disgusting. demmiblue May 2020 #142

Historical precedent. AtheistCrusader May 2020 #144

Darned right. Roll in the tanks. PatrickforO May 2020 #148

And give them this optic? SQUEE May 2020 #154

Roll in the tanks? dware May 2020 #170

I hate to say it but.. paparush May 2020 #150

Michigan has a National Guard. LastLiberal in PalmSprings May 2020 #152

Arrest them for WHAT???? dware May 2020 #171

I have been advocating that the 'stand your ground' laws should apply randr May 2020 #153

Applies only lsewpershad May 2020 #157

Can we spray them with some sort of sticky stinky disinfectant instead? hunter May 2020 #158

There is no logical argument Dukkha May 2020 #159

How about moral arguments? sarisataka May 2020 #161

How about insisting that they disarm? MineralMan May 2020 #162

They do not need to, legally sarisataka May 2020 #163

Your questions are excellent (if awkward), and will be studiously ignored friendly_iconoclast May 2020 #169

And if they don't? dware May 2020 #172

That is my feeling too. They went too far by going in armed. LiberalFighter May 2020 #160

We have bdamomma May 2020 #166

Again, arrested for What? dware May 2020 #173

You advocate murder, and such an action would give the RW their Kent State friendly_iconoclast May 2020 #168

I'm having a hard time coming to grips with what I'm reading here. dware May 2020 #174

They shot and killed a young woman just for driving near the Capitol ecstatic May 2020 #175

Who shot and killed a young woman? MineralMan May 2020 #176

Yes. ecstatic May 2020 #180

According to the article, she did considerably more than tht. MineralMan May 2020 #181