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iverglas

(38,549 posts)

22. I just served on a jury for a post in this thread

Sat Jan 7, 2012, 03:26 PM

Jan 2012

It was allowed to stand 2 to 4.

My vote was:

Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT and said:
oh god - a thread about a BEAUTY PAGENT CONTESTANT at DU? I don't give a toss whether she's lesbian, straight, paraplegic, an undocumented immigrant, short, tall -- what the fuck is this doing at DU? Have we not quite settled on the concept that women are human beings and not cattle yet? A pox on all their houses. But ranking of women by their appearance is beyond the pale. Begone. - iverglas

Hey, juror #5 -- "I guess some would find it slightly sexist to rate a woman" (and I applaud your decision to sign you reasons, as I do, but I'll delete the name here) -- ya THINK??

I can see the posting of the item as news, I suppose. But dog almighty, can I not expect some critical analysis at this site?

I feel the same way about this as I do about same-sex marriage -- why anyone wants in on a phenomenon/institution that has oppressed and degraded women throught history is pretty much beyond me, but they have as much right to do it as I do or anyone else does. So I'll fight to the death for their right to do it, while reserving my own right to criticize their choice.

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This message was self-deleted by its author [View all] William769 Jan 2012 OP

awesome...she is beautiful handmade34 Jan 2012 #1

Yes she is. William769 Jan 2012 #2

I give her a 7 itsrobert Jan 2012 #4

What?? handmade34 Jan 2012 #5

I was basing on outer appearance only itsrobert Jan 2012 #13

You're going to get a lot of shit for it from the feminists here Eliminator Jan 2012 #41

There are no 'Tens' until I meet them. The Doctor. Jan 2012 #53

on second thought 8-9, closer to 9-10 on outlook and diversity Demonaut Jan 2012 #12

7 seems about right. Jean V. Dubois Jan 2012 #61

Come on. She's gorgeous. FloridaJudy Jan 2012 #169

I do see something there itsrobert Jan 2012 #178

but 7 is gorgeous also, it's above average JI7 Jan 2012 #202

The "1 to 10" rating is a bell curve. Jean V. Dubois Jan 2012 #213

yes she is beautiful... one_voice Jan 2012 #28

Natural? itsrobert Jan 2012 #49

not all of us women with full lips had them injected. Maine-ah Jan 2012 #56

Why do you assume she's had... one_voice Jan 2012 #88

she doesn't have the pageant look JI7 Jan 2012 #36

I bet she is very smart and funny and charming Eliminator Jan 2012 #50

Miss California! iverglas Jan 2012 #148

and here's a collector's item! iverglas Jan 2012 #179

"Maybe Mollie here will do us proud and do the same." redqueen Jan 2012 #197

She looks a bit like the woman in the bottom picture of this post. (pic heavy) Zorra Jan 2012 #194

I've never been much of a fan of those things but I hope she wins! MADem Jan 2012 #3

I didnt think Lesbians would have any interest in a puerile sport. WingDinger Jan 2012 #6

Lesbians like to get laid too. nt justiceischeap Jan 2012 #7

That is achievable even without joining a meat contest. WingDinger Jan 2012 #10

Would she be getting the publicity she's getting now to work with LGBTQ youth? justiceischeap Jan 2012 #11

Again, mixed feelings. Same as the Santorum thing. Not that I'm gay, but I care about their dignity. WingDinger Jan 2012 #14

She only loses dignity if she's forced into it or she allows herself to act undignified justiceischeap Jan 2012 #15

If you joined the Tea Party, and were not forced into it, do you retain your full dignity? WingDinger Jan 2012 #16

I don't see the correlation to the Tea Party and a beauty pageant. justiceischeap Jan 2012 #18

when i see the men struttin acoss the stage in next to nothing, and we judge him on his looks seabeyond Jan 2012 #38

but he's not just a piece of meat, dammit!! getdown Jan 2012 #91

yes he is. Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #158

I was in the castro, for holloween and entered the contest. WingDinger Jan 2012 #212

Ask, and you shall... Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #92

are they gay? getdown Jan 2012 #162

I don't know, or care Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #163

that's a good point getdown Jan 2012 #164

um....I guess in your little bubble you've never heard of.... zappaman Jan 2012 #94

the whole concept of beauty pageants is undignified getdown Jan 2012 #89

Need to make some corrections to your point justiceischeap Jan 2012 #17

Outgroup communities are similar. I would not call gays mainstream. WingDinger Jan 2012 #19

Yeah but comparing the LGBTQ community to the Tea Party or the porn industry justiceischeap Jan 2012 #23

Mainstreaming gays is a new trend. They had to wait for minorities and women. WingDinger Jan 2012 #24

um iverglas Jan 2012 #25

CHURCH!! WingDinger Jan 2012 #26

I don't know that I understood that, iverglas Jan 2012 #27

Church. Urban slang word. Similar to WORD, in the seventies. WingDinger Jan 2012 #29

omg iverglas Jan 2012 #51

"Why would anybody want to do any of those things?" I dunno, maybe because they're NOT YOU. Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #69

I suspect that you ... iverglas Jan 2012 #82

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #93

oooh, "frothy" iverglas Jan 2012 #124

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #129

retract iverglas Jan 2012 #133

why the fuck would I retract? Your words are in this thread, for all to see. Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #144

filth iverglas Jan 2012 #156

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #161

as Samuel Clemens said iverglas Jan 2012 #166

Twain had little use or patience for puritannical would-be censors. nt Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #252

True. n/t zappaman Jan 2012 #254

He evidently had zero tolerance for liars iverglas Jan 2012 #255

As do I Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #257

And people who have a problem with Sasha Grey need to grow the fuck up Eliminator Jan 2012 #43

who leak the info she was in porn? she made sure it got out. because it was about reading to kids? seabeyond Jan 2012 #59

who knows who leaked it? zappaman Jan 2012 #60

cute... since parents dont sit around for people to read to the kids. how about HER twittering seabeyond Jan 2012 #63

The whole damn point of twitter is to tell people stuff, like what you did today. Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #71

it is also to get attention. she got it. so? nt seabeyond Jan 2012 #77

so? zappaman Jan 2012 #80

Way to miss the point Eliminator Jan 2012 #72

odd iverglas Jan 2012 #98

"she makes movies for grown-ups", that's what you say. And you're done. Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #135

And, the issue shouldn't even come up obamanut2012 Jan 2012 #149

I give her props for volunteering to help out at a school. Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #152

Me too obamanut2012 Jan 2012 #159

hahahaha iverglas Jan 2012 #175

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #176

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #102

I doubt very much she leaked it obamanut2012 Jan 2012 #154

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #83

Sasha Grey is no longer a porn star obamanut2012 Jan 2012 #95

Yes but she is no longer a virgin Eliminator Jan 2012 #97

Plus she might enjoy sex zappaman Jan 2012 #100

lol obamanut2012 Jan 2012 #106

Sasha Grey isn;t a porn star anymore obamanut2012 Jan 2012 #103

how is endorsing the meat contest getdown Jan 2012 #87

just look at the sacrifices she is making iverglas Jan 2012 #104

yes getdown Jan 2012 #112

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #116

where'd ya get that, Rush Limbaugh? getdown Jan 2012 #119

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #145

well getdown Jan 2012 #147

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #150

wait getdown Jan 2012 #153

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #155

yes you must getdown Jan 2012 #160

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #165

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #185

with all due respect your position on Ms. Grey dsc Jan 2012 #198

Whats different about lesbians? SaintPete Jan 2012 #20

some do , some don't. just like hetero women JI7 Jan 2012 #37

Cool tawadi Jan 2012 #8

think of the children! noiretextatique Jan 2012 #9

Ha ha, I thought the same thing! Initech Jan 2012 #21

It isn't just the "christofacists" who will lose their minds. Behind the Aegis Jan 2012 #208

I just served on a jury for a post in this thread iverglas Jan 2012 #22

Hey I was a juror on this thread too! zappaman Jan 2012 #30

Did the alerter give a comment what was wrong this this thread? William769 Jan 2012 #31

yes zappaman Jan 2012 #33

omg obamanut2012 Jan 2012 #34

the alert wasn't about news being discussed iverglas Jan 2012 #39

there were multiple juries for different alerts, one was for 'rating' looks, others for a beauty stockholmer Jan 2012 #120

I don't like the rating concept treestar Jan 2012 #235

Ah here we go... Eliminator Jan 2012 #40

yeah, there goes the mouthy humourless feminist iverglas Jan 2012 #44

sit down and shut up woman, dontcha know. let a man tell you what sexism is. nt seabeyond Jan 2012 #47

so a woman who voluntarily competes in a beauty pageant zappaman Jan 2012 #57

my post was about a man telling us what sexism is and to STFU. seabeyond Jan 2012 #62

ok how's this? zappaman Jan 2012 #64

hysterical? so if i, a woman, address a post, i am hysterical? games. fuckin childish, immature seabeyond Jan 2012 #73

no, you're hysterical iverglas Jan 2012 #108

nope, sorry women, but you don't own that word. Men can be hysterical too. n/t zappaman Jan 2012 #118

never studied ancient Greek, did you? iverglas Jan 2012 #137

uh huh zappaman Jan 2012 #143

it would certainly explain the ear hair. Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #146

nope, hysterical for putting words in other posters mouth. n/t zappaman Jan 2012 #115

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #66

well, some people love to clutch those pearls. n/t zappaman Jan 2012 #70

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #74

a woman can not say anything on the issue, without name calling to denigrate her? nt seabeyond Jan 2012 #76

well, when a poster makes things up and complain that posters are saying things zappaman Jan 2012 #85

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #107

gosh, "hysterical", "pearls" iverglas Jan 2012 #110

yes it is. it is also sexist. lets see, stfu, hysterical, bent out of shape, freak out, seabeyond Jan 2012 #75

it's a discussion zappaman Jan 2012 #78

no pearls getdown Jan 2012 #84

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #109

you bet your sweet ass they're here somewhere! n/t zappaman Jan 2012 #111

yes, a man told the woman wasnt sexist and to stfu... hysterical again? games again? nt seabeyond Jan 2012 #86

no one told anyone to STFU. zappaman Jan 2012 #90

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #113

that's quite a piece of work iverglas Jan 2012 #231

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #251

I am unaware of beauty pageants for cattle. zappaman Jan 2012 #253

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #256

Beauty Pagents for Cattle Vanje Jan 2012 #292

because she chose to join in getdown Jan 2012 #96

More accurately mythology Jan 2012 #136

actually getdown Jan 2012 #142

no, actually, ... iverglas Jan 2012 #232

I wish her luck. Sexual orientation should not even enter into this contest. n/t RebelOne Jan 2012 #32

Self delete. William769 Jan 2012 #35

the thread wasn't alerted iverglas Jan 2012 #42

Thank you. Someone sent me a PM to explain what happened. William769 Jan 2012 #45

I'm sure women don't do it. At all. Eliminator Jan 2012 #46

excuse me iverglas Jan 2012 #52

have you ever seen a beauty pageant getdown Jan 2012 #99

of course we have zappaman Jan 2012 #105

no getdown Jan 2012 #114

please explain why is that not equivalent? zappaman Jan 2012 #121

take a stereotypical beauty pageant with all the trimmings getdown Jan 2012 #122

ok, how about this one? zappaman Jan 2012 #125

no getdown Jan 2012 #127

Sorry, you're wrong. zappaman Jan 2012 #128

in evening gown and high heels? getdown Jan 2012 #130

men don't wear those...women do. zappaman Jan 2012 #132

yes the point is laughable getdown Jan 2012 #138

that's cool. zappaman Jan 2012 #170

when you have time getdown Jan 2012 #171

Um she is going to be scored on her appearance (hence, beauty pageant) The Straight Story Jan 2012 #48

"If she did not want to be scored on how she looked" iverglas Jan 2012 #54

bwahahahahahahahahahahahahaahahaha getdown Jan 2012 #101

Correct and sorry if my post created confusion zappaman Jan 2012 #58

damn iverglas Jan 2012 #65

Hey, I'm not a 9.5. zappaman Jan 2012 #67

She's very lovely. The Doctor. Jan 2012 #55

I'll give her a 10. She's incredibly hot, and I wish her luck. Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #68

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #79

holy shit getdown Jan 2012 #81

She works well with animals: struggle4progress Jan 2012 #117

an excellent thread with example how sexism is approved on du, namecalling allowed, out of control seabeyond Jan 2012 #123

I think that this is a good thing (open LGBT contestants in traditionally 'straight' events) stockholmer Jan 2012 #131

well, thank you man, for once again putting me in my place, a couple names and lecturing me on seabeyond Jan 2012 #134

Again, you must magically see words no one else does. zappaman Jan 2012 #140

What names did I use? This is getting to be a bit bewildering. I do not not even know stockholmer Jan 2012 #151

thanks for the solidarity iverglas Jan 2012 #139

+1 n/t zappaman Jan 2012 #141

Is someone doing that? getdown Jan 2012 #168

i am not a big fan of beauty pageants, but i think being openly gay and a beauty pageant La Lioness Priyanka Jan 2012 #204

yes, the discussion was so progressive, scoring the woman on her looks seabeyond Jan 2012 #205

167. you might read rep and my conversation. it was ACTUALLY a conversation about exactly this. seabeyond Jan 2012 #206

Its a very second wave way of being a feminist which is why I reject it in favor of third wave stevenleser Jan 2012 #229

aren't you wonderful iverglas Jan 2012 #245

Thanks for noticing. Too bad you aren't. stevenleser Jan 2012 #266

From the TOS: Eliminator Jan 2012 #209

i wanna hate on some wemmenz. dont take my fun away. whaaaaah. tough shit. nt seabeyond Jan 2012 #210

Who is hating? Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #260

when you dehumanize a woman, that is hating. seabeyond Jan 2012 #262

No, it's not. See, you've decided to define what constitutes "dehumanization" Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #265

when you treat a PERSON like a thing, that is dehumanizing. and yes, that is hate. seabeyond Jan 2012 #269

And I never said you were the one who insulted her. Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #273

To many people, constant objectification isn't "fun". redqueen Jan 2012 #221

So why the fuck is the woman that the OP is about not allowed to make up her own mind? Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #259

Some of us hope for meaningful discussions. Not ratings. redqueen Jan 2012 #274

You're having a meaningful discussion now, just with someone who doesn't agree with you. Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #276

When you're accusing me of making this issue about me, redqueen Jan 2012 #282

Actually, the vast majority of people DON'T agree with you. Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #287

Who said there was anything wrong with beauty? redqueen Jan 2012 #291

Again, where is hatred of women espoused in the OP, or any of the replies of admiration Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #296

actually there are TWO open lesbians running in the contest, btw stockholmer Jan 2012 #126

Yes, but one of them is pretty, and the other one isn't. Jean V. Dubois Jan 2012 #157

here is an in-depth interview with Jenelle Hutcherson (Donald Trump personally invited her to run) stockholmer Jan 2012 #173

She's my hairdresser! taught_me_patience Jan 2012 #218

I'm happy for her but have mixed feelings REP Jan 2012 #167

She's under no obligation as a woman...to speak out against one...ways women are judged and devalued seabeyond Jan 2012 #172

you said it getdown Jan 2012 #177

Did you read my post or just pick out phrases? REP Jan 2012 #181

actually, i got the delicateness of your post and hear what you are saying seabeyond Jan 2012 #182

No criticism of you meant either REP Jan 2012 #184

The fault may lie with me seabeyond Jan 2012 #186

We are used to women kissing their chains but shocked when true minorities do it REP Jan 2012 #187

i am glad she is the one to win, breaking that glass ceiling of norm seabeyond Jan 2012 #189

A minority, in the sociological sense (not the dominant group), is not a numerical concept. redqueen Jan 2012 #201

"It's just a little weird that a quest for equality on one front (sexuality) involves diminishing redqueen Jan 2012 #200

I think the same crap goes on in the lesbian community as in the straight community. Dreamer Tatum Jan 2012 #240

" I don't see why an openly gay woman in a pageant would merit any raised eyebrows at all" redqueen Jan 2012 #275

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #174

snork iverglas Jan 2012 #180

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #183

what didn't take long iverglas Jan 2012 #188

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #190

you have no scruples at all, do you? iverglas Jan 2012 #191

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #192

Please don't put me in the 7 or 8 out of 10 brigade. zappaman Jan 2012 #195

Used to go bar hopping in Long beach. A tranny crew would come in. Bout twelve of them. WingDinger Jan 2012 #214

Deep. Thats real deep. Vanje Jan 2012 #193

The reason beauty pageants for women are regressive ZombieHorde Jan 2012 #196

+1. nt seabeyond Jan 2012 #199

"Men aren't really oppressed for their gender, so beauty pageants for men don't really matter." redqueen Jan 2012 #203

Beauty pagents for women don't really matter either, in the grand scheme of things. Jean V. Dubois Jan 2012 #211

Objectification is dehumanization. redqueen Jan 2012 #222

Ok, I will. Jean V. Dubois Jan 2012 #233

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #258

Consider them added to the list! Jean V. Dubois Jan 2012 #290

Violence. redqueen Jan 2012 #271

I freely admit that people getting upset about beauty pageants *is* a big joke to me. Jean V. Dubois Jan 2012 #285

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #293

You don't even acknowledge that objectification exists. redqueen Jan 2012 #298

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #300

none n/t zappaman Jan 2012 #301

If by "grand scheme of things," you mean beauty pageants for women ZombieHorde Jan 2012 #237

They may not help the cause of gender equality, but I don't think they hurt it in any meaningful way Jean V. Dubois Jan 2012 #238

I am a straight male, so I love looking at beautiful women, but that is not really the point. ZombieHorde Jan 2012 #241

I think you're running up against human nature. Jean V. Dubois Jan 2012 #242

Perhaps, but I am encouraged by the progress that has been made over the generations. ZombieHorde Jan 2012 #243

The problem being, of course, the definition of what exactly is "enlightenment". Jean V. Dubois Jan 2012 #247

Sure, all value is subjective. ZombieHorde Jan 2012 #288

"I agree, that's sexist...and I don't care because I like it". seabeyond Jan 2012 #244

Context is everything. Read more closely, please. Jean V. Dubois Jan 2012 #246

ok, you are not bragging, it is the other men that say that, that is bragging seabeyond Jan 2012 #248

I don't know that "bragging" is the best word. I think "justifying" or "rationalizing" Jean V. Dubois Jan 2012 #249

i think it is bragging and about their entitlement wrapped up in them feeling like men seabeyond Jan 2012 #250

As I've pointed out, morals and ethics are essentially opinions. Jean V. Dubois Jan 2012 #280

pointless unwillingness to call it what it is. nt seabeyond Jan 2012 #284

"racism and homophobia are much less acceptable in today's society than sexism" redqueen Jan 2012 #278

Valid question, but I don't think there's any question that it is the case. Jean V. Dubois Jan 2012 #279

It needs to be addressed. redqueen Jan 2012 #283

he wont answer cause then they gotta own it. so skirt away, around, under and over seabeyond Jan 2012 #286

Answer what, exactly? This thread is getting a bit convoluted. Jean V. Dubois Jan 2012 #294

I can't believe that was said. redqueen Jan 2012 #297

"being a sexist is FUN" zappaman Jan 2012 #299

It was paraphrasing what someone else said... redqueen Jan 2012 #302

Oh, paraphrasing...hence the use of quote marks. zappaman Jan 2012 #305

Because you're not paying attention? redqueen Jan 2012 #307

That's not the only thing that's fun. Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #304

Ok. It's not acceptable and and inexcusable. Now what? Jean V. Dubois Jan 2012 #289

I propose that people stop pretending that it's all just harmless fun. redqueen Jan 2012 #295

Good luck, Mollie! n/t =D AverageJoe90 Jan 2012 #207

After reading this thread over two days, I have some thoughts obamanut2012 Jan 2012 #215

Your #4 is right on the money. William769 Jan 2012 #216

I thought so obamanut2012 Jan 2012 #217

Yeah, too bad Eliminator Jan 2012 #219

+ a brazillion opiate69 Jan 2012 #236

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #263

what i have a problem with is a thread that goes on to talk about women that dared to say anything, seabeyond Jan 2012 #220

Why would I rate Mollie? obamanut2012 Jan 2012 #223

why isnt the issue spelled out and what started it was the dehumanizing of this woman RATING her. seabeyond Jan 2012 #224

That is what my #4 was obamanut2012 Jan 2012 #225

that is why i posted to the op about the direction his OP went. unfortantely, all the blame seems seabeyond Jan 2012 #226

I never rated her. William769 Jan 2012 #227

i know you did not rate her. i didnt say that you did. i know your intent with the post seabeyond Jan 2012 #228

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #261

so? who cares. you rate her like an animal. i am so very fuckin impressed. nt seabeyond Jan 2012 #264

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #267

check out the way people buy animals. no different. nt seabeyond Jan 2012 #270

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #272

who rates animals? zappaman Jan 2012 #268

Judges at dog and cat shows. nt justiceischeap Jan 2012 #277

true...my bad zappaman Jan 2012 #281

Can't get away from it. Look at Survivor, that's worse than rating. nt justiceischeap Jan 2012 #303

Sasha got introduced in this thread because of me (inadvertently) justiceischeap Jan 2012 #230

Cosign on your entire post obamanut2012 Jan 2012 #234

I went back up and read what prompted Sasha's appearance justiceischeap Jan 2012 #239

I am going to self delete the OP William769 Jan 2012 #306