General Discussion

Voltaire2

(15,377 posts)

83. OK, interesting theory, the data is a bit difficult though.

Mon Oct 26, 2020, 12:06 PM

Oct 2020

"One of the most puzzling elements of the 2016 election, at least for a lot of Americans, was the millions of voters who switched from voting for Barack Obama in 2012 to Donald Trump in 2016. Somewhere between 6.7 million and 9.2 million Americans switched this way; given that the 2016 election was decided by 40,000 votes, it’s fair to say that Obama-Trump switchers were one of the key reasons that Hillary Clinton lost."
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/10/16/17980820/trump-obama-2016-race-racism-class-economy-2018-midterm

The TOTAL green party vote in 2016 was 1,457,216. In 2012 it was 469,501.

So you would have to demonstrate that somehow the extra 1,000,000 green votes in 2016 were about 6x more critical than the more than 6 million Obama->Trump votes in 2016.

Please proceed.

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The lifetime appointment of Amy Coney Barrett to the Supreme Court is dedicated to Susan Sarandon... [View all] NurseJackie Oct 2020 OP

And everyone who wouldn't vote because they couldn't have the candidate they wanted. redstatebluegirl Oct 2020 #1

Or simply forgot the astronomical favorability polls on HRC when she was in office ffr Oct 2020 #40

Great point, but she actually rose all the way to the mid to high 60s. StevieM Oct 2020 #124

+1 ffr Oct 2020 #133

we let 1500 radio stations attack her and lie about her for 30 years certainot Oct 2020 #193

Political orthodoxy at its worst. Aristus Oct 2020 #2

I will honestly never watch another one of her movies, ever greenjar_01 Oct 2020 #3

Maybe Sarandon will play Barrett in the Lifetime Network bio-pic. NurseJackie Oct 2020 #6

The closing shot will be Sarandon as Coney Island.... NorthOf270 Oct 2020 #39

Barrett will be constant reminder of 2016, the year some Democrats choose to protest the Party. Hoyt Oct 2020 #4

Constant is the key word. She is young enough that she may be issuing Statistical Oct 2020 #15

Perhaps it's me, but looking at her gives me the Undiagnosed or Precursor to Serious Disease vibe. TheBlackAdder Oct 2020 #23

Possibly NorthOf270 Oct 2020 #41

Hear Hear, Ma'am The Magistrate Oct 2020 #5

This 👆🏼 UpInArms Oct 2020 #8

You said it. Newest Reality Oct 2020 #9

When Mr. Chomskey Says To Dial It Back, Sir The Magistrate Oct 2020 #18

Exactly! ;) Newest Reality Oct 2020 #19

Yes, I was surprised when he spoke like that! : o electric_blue68 Oct 2020 #263

That was her theory back in 2016 - vote for trump and we can make things better after him... George II Oct 2020 #52

She can afford the luxury of "sending a message" (at the cost all those among us... NurseJackie Oct 2020 #107

Took me a while to come up with a relatively short... electric_blue68 Oct 2020 #264

You described it perfectly. (I might borrow your wording someday.) NurseJackie Oct 2020 #265

thanks. Be my guest. 🙂 electric_blue68 Oct 2020 #267

+++ brer cat Oct 2020 #261

and the first people to be sent to Hitler's concentration camps were ... DBoon Oct 2020 #197

Clinton lost primarily because of white voters who voted for Obama in 2012 voted for Trump in 2016 Voltaire2 Oct 2020 #7

The left needs to learn so they dont do something that stupid again Fullduplexxx Oct 2020 #12

Do Not Sell The 'Lefter Than Thou' Short, Sir The Magistrate Oct 2020 #14

To you, Sir Hekate Oct 2020 #199

We have that autocrat in part because of some of the left. TwilightZone Oct 2020 #26

Your first premise is incorrect. Clinton lost primarily because many voters felt that she wasn't.... George II Oct 2020 #43

The "Purity Wing" of the Democratic Party is our version of the "teabaggers" to the RePutinicans IMO NoMoreRepugs Oct 2020 #55

A vote for Jill Stein was a vote for trump Gothmog Oct 2020 #71

OK, interesting theory, the data is a bit difficult though. Voltaire2 Oct 2020 #83

Some people are determined not to blame Trump voters for Trump. Mariana Oct 2020 #143

Because trying to understand why white suburban males vote in huge numbers for Voltaire2 Oct 2020 #175

Was it because of their economic anxiety? BannonsLiver Oct 2020 #241

partially, augmented by racist demagoguery that has a long tradition here. Voltaire2 Oct 2020 #247

I see BannonsLiver Oct 2020 #249

Even Trump understands that dividing the left was his R B Garr Oct 2020 #220

The OP implied that Sarandon played a big part in the 2016 result, but wasn't the only thing.... George II Oct 2020 #162

the op did nothing of the sort. But ok fine, lets walk back the entire op and start over. Voltaire2 Oct 2020 #177

It is Like Arguing With a Kitchen Table, Sir The Magistrate Oct 2020 #182

rather an amazing comment considering the op is doing just that from the center. Voltaire2 Oct 2020 #184

The Basic Mis-Understanding, Sir, Rests With The Further Left The Magistrate Oct 2020 #185

there was no misunderstanding on my part. Voltaire2 Oct 2020 #186

One Might Say, Sir The Magistrate Oct 2020 #187

Funny Lordquinton Oct 2020 #202

No One Is Interested In Apologetics From People Who Engaged In Sabotage The Magistrate Oct 2020 #206

Now do Gary Johnson Lordquinton Oct 2020 #203

The goalposts are making me dizzy Lordquinton Oct 2020 #205

Jill Stein voters gave trump his margin of victory Gothmog Oct 2020 #69

only if you ignore the shift from Obama to Trump Voltaire2 Oct 2020 #73

Do not forget the sanders voters who voted for trump Gothmog Oct 2020 #88

I never forgot the PUMAS JonLP24 Oct 2020 #106

LOL! NurseJackie Oct 2020 #191

This sheshe2 Oct 2020 #198

Clinton campaign for and worked very hard to elect President Obama Gothmog Oct 2020 #210

This message was self-deleted by its author BannonsLiver Oct 2020 #243

First of all, so did Gary Johnson. He took more votes away from Clinton than Stein did. StevieM Oct 2020 #127

A defeat can have multiple causes Gothmog Oct 2020 #148

James Comey dominated the 2016 election from start to finish. StevieM Oct 2020 #149

Comey was assisted by the NYT who kept the Clinton email story alive Gothmog Oct 2020 #151

You do understand that these voters likely never trumpers and republicans Gothmog Oct 2020 #212

Every indication I saw from polling at the time indicated that Johnson voters came more from HRC. StevieM Oct 2020 #219

I would like to see this polling Gothmog Oct 2020 #236

Exactly. If stein & sarandon hadn't LIED their FUCKING Cha Oct 2020 #189

+100,000,000x100,000,000 oasis Oct 2020 #208

Mahalo, oasis! RF Lessons to learn from History! Cha Oct 2020 #269

James Comey dominated the 2016 election from start to finish. StevieM Oct 2020 #129

The swing state losses were by smaller margins than those states' treestar Oct 2020 #152

No, in PA, the number of votes for Harambe was more than the difference that gave Trump the state. haele Oct 2020 #201

No you cant blame just her the dems bought this sitting out 2010 and 2016 Fullduplexxx Oct 2020 #10

and 2014, 2014 - state and local elections AlexSFCA Oct 2020 #134

Enough. Mike Niendorff Oct 2020 #11

You Need To Get Out And Read More, Sir The Magistrate Oct 2020 #16

I've seen plenty. Mike Niendorff Oct 2020 #20

I See, Sir The Magistrate Oct 2020 #22

You know me well by now. Mike Niendorff Oct 2020 #30

I Do Appreciate Your Contribution Here, Sir The Magistrate Oct 2020 #36

Understood and respected. Mike Niendorff Oct 2020 #45

You do know that Rove funded Nader Gothmog Oct 2020 #58

So, has 20 years gotten us anywhere? Mike Niendorff Oct 2020 #72

Nader's arrogance and stupidity got us the Iraq War and Ciitizens United Gothmog Oct 2020 #79

Ok then. Mike Niendorff Oct 2020 #81

I am working to elect Joe and to turn Texas blue in the real world Gothmog Oct 2020 #86

This is adorable. herding cats Oct 2020 #229

Us, no. Them, yes. herding cats Oct 2020 #228

"there is no other discussion to be had." ehrnst Oct 2020 #118

There are many enemies, sir. Codeine Oct 2020 #21

I haven't been here that long but this is a bit over the top. Does Sarandon really airmid Oct 2020 #24

You had to be here in 2016. She encouraged not voting for Hillary. brush Oct 2020 #29

Yeah, she is living in people's heads. progressoid Oct 2020 #103

Do you deny she had a hand in it in encouraging people to vote for Jill Stein... brush Oct 2020 #105

A very very small hand. progressoid Oct 2020 #113

What a pretty graphic. Does it show Stein had more votes than the 77k in 3 states... brush Oct 2020 #128

It also doesn't show progressoid Oct 2020 #141

You do a very good job of defending trump voters. brush Oct 2020 #153

Condemning. progressoid Oct 2020 #155

A vote for Jill Stein was a vote for trump Gothmog Oct 2020 #213

Not the first time a woman has been attacked over the actions of sexist men. Lancero Oct 2020 #221

And she's currently encouraging people to not vote on the Democratic line, even if voting... George II Oct 2020 #160

Scapegoating sells. Mike Niendorff Oct 2020 #35

I note that Sarandon was also a supporter of that asshole Nader Gothmog Oct 2020 #214

This message was self-deleted by its author BannonsLiver Oct 2020 #246

Oh cool. Mike Niendorff Oct 2020 #252

All of our days would have been nicer if Gore had won. BannonsLiver Oct 2020 #253

He did win. Mike Niendorff Oct 2020 #254

This message was self-deleted by its author BannonsLiver Oct 2020 #245

She has earned every bit of criticism that she receives. N/t Lucinda Oct 2020 #32

I will not forgive or forget Nader's role in hurting our country Gothmog Oct 2020 #60

ok then. Mike Niendorff Oct 2020 #77

I am have been working hard in the real world to turn Texas blue and defeat trump Gothmog Oct 2020 #84

The extremist-left who let the perfect be the enemy of the good in 2016 are just as culpable Tarc Oct 2020 #82

This message was self-deleted by its author MrsCoffee Oct 2020 #93

You must have taken a break in 2015-16 if this is the worst thing you've read here. yardwork Oct 2020 #130

This is not an internal fight at all AmericanCanuck Oct 2020 #163

My enemy is anyone not voting for Dems BannonsLiver Oct 2020 #240

Susan Sarandon deserves a lifetime achievement award for fuckery. My Pet Orangutan Oct 2020 #13

It can be a golden coat hanger. nt Statistical Oct 2020 #17

That! plimsoll Oct 2020 #33

K&R sheshe2 Oct 2020 #25

Post removed Post removed Oct 2020 #27

I lulz'd KG Oct 2020 #28

She is quite the example of privilege and narcissism. PaulRevere08 Oct 2020 #31

Here she is when asked if she'll vote for Trump instead of Hillary... NurseJackie Oct 2020 #38

Very stupid woman and Jill Stein too, WTF were they thinking? Miigwech Oct 2020 #54

Indeed! Stinky The Clown Oct 2020 #34

Extreme Narcissism and hypocrisy with no remorse Meowmee Oct 2020 #37

When Bill Clinton was President tiredtoo Oct 2020 #42

Lulz! NurseJackie Oct 2020 #47

Personally Susan Sarandon's well being tiredtoo Oct 2020 #147

Nobody is rehashing the past. This is an object lesson. These are things we must remember... NurseJackie Oct 2020 #156

we all know we lost in 2016 tiredtoo Oct 2020 #194

Are There Any Reliable Statistics on How Many People Susan Sarandon Influenced panfluteman Oct 2020 #44

of course not she is just a convenient target for punching left. Voltaire2 Oct 2020 #49

This! progressoid Oct 2020 #126

Impossible to put a firm number on it but I believe it was substantial. honest.abe Oct 2020 #64

Sarandon diverted thousands of votes away from our Dem nominee. oasis Oct 2020 #218

Jill Stein is now officially the Ralph Nader of 2016. Gothmog Oct 2020 #75

And yet we still have Bernie-or-Busters who want Trump to win again. Oneironaut Oct 2020 #46

VERY FINE TRAITORS ON BOTH SIDES! A great post, thx NurseJackie! (Nt) FreepFryer Oct 2020 #48

Not as easy to find the Sarandons of the world now is it? ismnotwasm Oct 2020 #50

Some cannot resist the lure of flypaper... NurseJackie Oct 2020 #56

Amen. And save some scorn for Eddie Glaude Jr. Paladin Oct 2020 #51

I mute MSNBC when this Stein supporter is on Gothmog Oct 2020 #76

Well said. OnDoutside Oct 2020 #100

Maybe it should be dedicated to RBG for not retiring when Obama was president... mudstump Oct 2020 #53

Lulz! NurseJackie Oct 2020 #57

Good grief. honest.abe Oct 2020 #59

How very democratic of you. mudstump Oct 2020 #112

After 2014, the GOP had a blocking position in the Senate Gothmog Oct 2020 #63

Obama tried to get RBG to retire in 2013 before the Senate takeover. Voltaire2 Oct 2020 #74

If this actually happened I am sure Obama completely understood why she didnt want to retire. honest.abe Oct 2020 #89

it actually happened and of course Obama understood. Voltaire2 Oct 2020 #91

So we all should understand including you and others casting blame on an innocent person.. honest.abe Oct 2020 #92

Truly at fault? Autumn Oct 2020 #96

Of course there were many factors. We all know that! honest.abe Oct 2020 #99

I'm gonna call a crock of Bullshit on 3 and 5. There have been third party candidates in Autumn Oct 2020 #101

All 5 were factors. honest.abe Oct 2020 #104

Like I said,it's funny how republican assholes get a pass on 16. EVERY time. On a Democratic site. Autumn Oct 2020 #109

It's not very funny how delusional narcissists like ss who have done their best to do harm Meowmee Oct 2020 #168

I love how the actual Trump voters get exactly none of the blame! Mariana Oct 2020 #211

Yeah I saw that. And that remark was no surprise to me, I've seen less praise and more complaints Autumn Oct 2020 #259

3... NurseJackie Oct 2020 #102

Holy shit ismnotwasm Oct 2020 #204

He had lunch with her. Period. Neither ever even hinted that it was about her retiring. George II Oct 2020 #190

At that time, the filibuster rule applied to SCOTUS nominations Gothmog Oct 2020 #94

RBG gambled that she would live long enough for the next democratic president...she lost that bet. mudstump Oct 2020 #121

Nothing in that article or the link within that article says that Obama tried to get her to retire. George II Oct 2020 #188

Seriously????? George II Oct 2020 #65

+1 melman Oct 2020 #66

Hillary warned us that control of the SCOTUS was on the ballot in 2016 Gothmog Oct 2020 #61

Nor all the so-called "progressives" mcar Oct 2020 #122

trump has appointed one-third of the SCOTUS Gothmog Oct 2020 #215

That's right. Nt mcar Oct 2020 #256

Ironically, her major speech on the subject was given in Wisconsin. StevieM Oct 2020 #125

So, are we to give repuke governors a pass for throwing 100's of 1000's off voter rolls? yaesu Oct 2020 #62

There is no difference between her and you. You're both trying to divide the coalition. miffelplix Oct 2020 #67

What "coalition" are you speaking of? George II Oct 2020 #136

The Donald Trump-Jill Stein coalition? AmericanCanuck Oct 2020 #166

I am also curious Gothmog Oct 2020 #216

Oh FFS, put it to rest already. vsrazdem Oct 2020 #68

EXACTLY. Mike Niendorff Oct 2020 #78

Never. NurseJackie Oct 2020 #95

I think not. AmericanCanuck Oct 2020 #167

Sorry. Get used to hearing it. kcr Oct 2020 #222

i prefer not to live in the past. vsrazdem Oct 2020 #242

LOL! Ridiculous! -- Nobody is doing that. NurseJackie Oct 2020 #266

LOL, good one. vsrazdem Oct 2020 #268

It's too late now. Oh, I voted already, but it's too fucking late to fucking matter. Texin Oct 2020 #70

I'll forgive Susan Sarandon when she goes to Hillary and GROVELS, on her knees, not_the_one Oct 2020 #80

That is was bugs me even more... she and others still wont fess up to their msitake. honest.abe Oct 2020 #90

Hillary being a thousand times better than Trump wasn't good enough for Susan. Ugh! :) nt Sloumeau Oct 2020 #85

Sarandon preferred Trump's WALL over Hillary... NurseJackie Oct 2020 #116

There's plenty of blame to go around. Mariana Oct 2020 #87

K&R betsuni Oct 2020 #97

Never buying ANYTHING you're selling, Susan. Never again. calimary Oct 2020 #98

If it makes people feel better to scapegoat Surandon go ahead JonLP24 Oct 2020 #108

It is not scapegoating AmericanCanuck Oct 2020 #164

Oh, the all powerfull Susan Sarandon returns! progressoid Oct 2020 #110

It's a very special day in her highly touted "destroy it to rebuild it" philosophy... NurseJackie Oct 2020 #111

"And her sympathizers and defenders" progressoid Oct 2020 #115

Lulz! NurseJackie Oct 2020 #117

Soooo, what does that mean? progressoid Oct 2020 #119

"..her NYC duplex sold quickly for 7.9 million." In other words she's not one of the Americans.... George II Oct 2020 #132

I'm not defending her weath. progressoid Oct 2020 #139

As long as trump is in office, tens of millions of people are out of work, hundreds of thousands... George II Oct 2020 #142

"among other factors" progressoid Oct 2020 #144

When the presidency was decided by a mere 77,000 of 129,000,000 votes, EVERY factor is relevant. George II Oct 2020 #146

But only one factor is worth harping on progressoid Oct 2020 #154

Aw. NurseJackie Oct 2020 #157

Ouch. progressoid Oct 2020 #183

There are a large number of real democrats who will not forgive or forget this idiot Gothmog Oct 2020 #217

Along with the ignorant assholes who defend her. kcr Oct 2020 #223

And to every other mcar Oct 2020 #114

Sarandon gave them permission to do so. She encouraged it with her lies about... NurseJackie Oct 2020 #120

That is correct mcar Oct 2020 #123

She gave them permission??? She's a damn powerful woman then, Autumn Oct 2020 #161

Absolutely she did! NurseJackie Oct 2020 #170

Yeah sure, permission Autumn Oct 2020 #173

You're welcome. NurseJackie Oct 2020 #176

She is also an activist who was a surrogate for Nader, John Edwards, Bernie Sanders. betsuni Oct 2020 #195

This message was self-deleted by its author BannonsLiver Oct 2020 #248

That's a fact, a laughing GIF or nasty snark when one can't come up with a reply to what is posted. Autumn Oct 2020 #258

Absolutely correct AmericanCanuck Oct 2020 #169

You are so correct in that assessment. NurseJackie Oct 2020 #174

I'd vote for even a conservative Democrat over any Republican. AmericanCanuck Oct 2020 #179

As ambivalent as I feel about him... NurseJackie Oct 2020 #180

The overwhelming majority of Sanders supporters voted for Clinton. nt. Mariana Oct 2020 #207

All it takes is to shave off a few in swing states AmericanCanuck Oct 2020 #251

Susan Sarandon's Own Private Handmaid Blue Owl Oct 2020 #131

If trump loses and dems take senate, thomas will likely retire AlexSFCA Oct 2020 #135

You're correct... adding SIX seats (total of 15) is the only remedy. And we will be justified... NurseJackie Oct 2020 #137

doesn have to be 6, 2 will do (11 total). AlexSFCA Oct 2020 #138

Louder, please!! NurseJackie Oct 2020 #140

Yes -- 6 or 8 new seats minimum. AmericanCanuck Oct 2020 #171

Amen. She owns this. I'm still waiting for the R B Garr Oct 2020 #145

You're COMPLETELY wrong! brooklynite Oct 2020 #150

I know, right? NurseJackie Oct 2020 #158

I don't post here very much any more, but occasionally I stop by to read - and stumble onto Ron Green Oct 2020 #159

I'm sure you all are equally mad at Mike Bloomberg for helping put the deciding votes in the Senate liskddksil Oct 2020 #165

Whataboutism. AmericanCanuck Oct 2020 #172

Not at all. Just stating how we got here. You can rightfully be mad at those who stayed home or vote liskddksil Oct 2020 #181

Looks like you've got that covered pretty well all on your own. Thanks! NurseJackie Oct 2020 #178

We're discussing reasons for why trump was elected. Bloomberg endorsed Hillary Clinton and even.... George II Oct 2020 #192

Sarandon Supported John Edwards who Cosponsered the IWR JI7 Oct 2020 #196

This is very important, destroys "authentic" and "voting with my conscience" and betsuni Oct 2020 #226

Sarandon is a fraud. She sees herself as an activist, but she's a fucking fraud. NurseJackie Oct 2020 #237

What's sad is the comments responding Trumpocalypse Oct 2020 #200

The Sarandon Court must not stand. Gothmog Oct 2020 #209

I was fairly indifferent to SS before, I now despise her. Tarheel_Dem Oct 2020 #224

Susan Sarandon probably Voted for Trump JI7 Oct 2020 #225

She wanted a "revolution"... I would not doubt it at all. NurseJackie Oct 2020 #235

Lessons need to be learned. herding cats Oct 2020 #227

And still more EXCUSES to be made. I'm truly amazed at how many Sarandon Sympathizers there are... NurseJackie Oct 2020 #231

I just want to hear their plan to fix what's been broken. herding cats Oct 2020 #232

I think it goes something like this... NurseJackie Oct 2020 #233

This revolution has been disappointing Gothmog Oct 2020 #272

Ironic: one of reasons people like Sarandon hated Hillary is her imaginary plot to frack everything. betsuni Oct 2020 #230

Sarandon also hated Hillary for her IWR vote. Yet Sarandon was a BIG FAN of John Edwards... NurseJackie Oct 2020 #234

Yes. Double standard weathervane, and for what. betsuni Oct 2020 #238

Pride? Vanity? Ego? Hurt feelings? Stubbornness? Power? Fame? NurseJackie Oct 2020 #239

Stupidity. betsuni Oct 2020 #244

Massively stupid, indeed. That twitter user... NurseJackie Oct 2020 #255

This message was self-deleted by its author BannonsLiver Oct 2020 #250

Some that I expected are absent (and have been for a while now anyway) and there are some... NurseJackie Oct 2020 #257

Susan S will never live this down......kick. oasis Oct 2020 #260

Until the day she dies (and beyond) people will scorn her for her part in all of this. NurseJackie Oct 2020 #262

Any future Oscars are out of the question. She's radioactive. nt oasis Oct 2020 #270

Sarandn and Stein voters-THIS IS ALL ON YOU Gothmog Oct 2020 #271