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unblock

(56,108 posts)
Tue Feb 2, 2021, 05:32 PM Feb 2021

people focus way too much on intent, e.g., whether or not donnie meant to incite a riot [View all]

for some things, certainly, intent matters. for instance, in a criminal trial where the charge involves intent, fine. there's certainly a difference between pre-meditated, intentional murder and negligent homicide.

but for many things in life, intent really doesn't matter that much. the effect is what counts, not what's going on inside someone else's brain. if your romantic relationship is toxic, if your boss treats you horrible, if your landlord behaves like a jerk, often it really doesn't matter why. maybe it does if you can use that information to change their ways, but people are notoriously resistant to that sort of thing. in the end, what matters is the relationship sucks, you just need to get out and find a better situation.


so it is with donnie and impeachment. really, it doesn't matter what donnie intended or if he really meant to incite a riot or if he really didn't want anyone to get hurt or killed. the fact is that he did some things that led to a mob storming the seat of government and killing a number of people in an effort to overturn an election.

impeachment is not a criminal trial. the wording in the constitution is perhaps unfortunate. it's really just a jobs review panel evaluating whether or not a person should be fired and possibly never hired again.

intent really doesn't make much of a difference. in the end, whether a federal officer abuses, neglects, or misuses their office out of ignorance, stupidity, malice, or accident, it hardly matters. regardless, they're not suited for the job. they need to go and not be hired again.


hypothetically, (and who knew we'd make it through 4 years without this one happening) if donnie momentarily forgot which button in his office summons a diet coke and which button send nukes to russia, honestly, no one should really care why he started a nuclear war. honest accident? who gives a crap. fire him and keep him away from any damn buttons.


so when republicans defend donnie by insisting the mob escalated things on their own, that things got out of hand, just tell them, who cares. it really doesn't matter. donnie gave them motivation and a sense of righteous anger, a time and a location, and a purpose. whether or not he's too stupid to realize that would lead to an attempted coup, or whether or not he just "forgot" to mention, please don't break any laws and please don't hurt people, who cares.

the fact is, he caused the situation, and he can't be trusted to be in a position to do anything like that again, even if by accident.




of course, it totally was on purpose, absolutely, i mean, gimme a break. but the point is, we don't need to prove that. he caused the whole situation and that's needed to reach the conclusion that he should be barred from holding office ever again.

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and remember. Didn't it take about 2 hours before he called out the Nat. Guard?? riversedge Feb 2021 #1
He never did - Pence called out the National Guard csziggy Feb 2021 #21
He certainly intended a major obstruction of the legislative branch doing its work Walleye Feb 2021 #2
What Amazes Me Is How Far His Big Lie Got Him..... global1 Feb 2021 #3
scary how gullible the right-wing masses are. they'll believe anything. unblock Feb 2021 #16
Agreed. choie Feb 2021 #4
Hadn't Noticed but Incitement to Insurrection Contains No Mens Rea or State of Mind Element Stallion Feb 2021 #5
Interesting that it's not even needed for the criminal charge. unblock Feb 2021 #8
It may be that the case law breaks it down further into elements coti Feb 2021 #24
And Trump was warned by GA election official that he was inciting violence Raven123 Feb 2021 #6
Good Point ProfessorGAC Feb 2021 #7
Luckily we have the testimony of the rioters gratuitous Feb 2021 #9
I also don't understand why there isn't more focus on what Giuliani said... AntiFascist Feb 2021 #10
There were more bdamomma Feb 2021 #15
Why would his lawyers make that argument? kentuck Feb 2021 #11
not sure about his lawyers, but there certainly others argue that he's not responsible for the mob unblock Feb 2021 #13
So if you yell "Fire!" in a crowded theatre and you don't intend to get people trampled to death ... robertpaulsen Feb 2021 #12
well, someone like that certainly shouldn't be president lol! unblock Feb 2021 #14
i think casting this as a "trial" obscures the "performance review" angle 0rganism Feb 2021 #17
yes. the constitution is a marvelous document, but i think this is one of its subtle mistakes unblock Feb 2021 #18
This message was self-deleted by its author Chin music Feb 2021 #19
We are responsible for the foreseeable consequences of our acts struggle4progress Feb 2021 #20
This message was self-deleted by its author Chin music Feb 2021 #22
What he intended- and quite obviously- was to overturn the will of the voters coti Feb 2021 #23
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