Welcome to DU!
The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards.
Join the community:
Create a free account
Support DU (and get rid of ads!):
Become a Star Member
Latest Breaking News
Editorials & Other Articles
General Discussion
The DU Lounge
All Forums
Issue Forums
Culture Forums
Alliance Forums
Region Forums
Support Forums
Help & Search
General Discussion
In reply to the discussion: What do you think accounts for the rise in incivility? [View all]KansDem
(28,498 posts)118. Of course!
Many versions of the "Faust" classic exist but I was referring to Goethes:
Mephistopheles tries to seize Faust's soul when he dies after this moment of happiness, but is frustrated and enraged when angels intervene due to God's grace. Though this grace is truly 'gratuitous' and does not condone Faust's frequent errors perpetrated with Mephistopheles, the angels state that this grace can only occur because of Faust's unending striving and due to the intercession of the forgiving Gretchen. The final scene has Faust's soul carried to heaven in the presence of God as the "Holy Virgin, Mother, Queen, Goddess...The Eternal Feminine". The Goddess is thus victorious over Mephistopheles, who had insisted at Faust's death that he would be consigned to "The Eternal Empty".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faust
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faust
Perhaps more to the point is the protagonist in Carl Marie von Webers opera, Der Freischutz in which Max makes a deal with Samiel through his agent Casper for seven golden bullets so that he may win a shooting contest and the hand of Agathe. Max uses the last bullet to shoot a dove and instead the bullet is guided by Samiel to hit Agathe. The bullet hits her wedding veil and is deflected to strike Casper, who is in turn snatched by Samiel. A wandering hermit interrupts the proceedings and announces that Maxs straying from a good life to accept Samiels deal was due to his love for Agathe and fear of losing the shooting match. The hermit suggests condemning the shoot and suggest a probationary period of one year, after which if Max continues to live a faultless life, he will gain forgiveness and be permitted to marry Agathe.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Der_Freisch%C3%BCtz
Thats what I meant by Leave It to Beaver as a weekly reenactment of the Faust legend. Call it Hollywood Faust but generally you had the Beav lured into an agreement with one of his friends that is supposed to result in a good time, but instead learns otherwise, usually with the help of Ward. A lesson is learned and redemption is achieved.
As for Archie Bunker, sure he was a bigot and misogynist. But I wasnt saying he deserve" to be ridiculed, but that he was merely the target of such ridicule.
Edit history
Please sign in to view edit histories.
Recommendations
0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):
134 replies
= new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight:
NoneDon't highlight anything
5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
RecommendedHighlight replies with 5 or more recommendations
There is a very thin line between civilization and barbarianism as a wise person
RKP5637
Oct 2012
#52
Do you think a lot of people mistake harsh free-for-all criticisms as "the only REAL free speech"?
Tigress DEM
Oct 2012
#66
it has been going on for quite a while. I remember when Pat Schroeder decided to retire from
niyad
Oct 2012
#6
Bush, Disco, perceived anonymity, and our failure to adopt the Metric System
slackmaster
Oct 2012
#7
He gave people permission to be uncivil , to be not only ignorant, but to be proud of it.
Egalitarian Thug
Oct 2012
#93
I love those who wax nostaligic for all white, all straight 50's TV, produced by direct
Bluenorthwest
Oct 2012
#39
And also, no air conditioning. MAYBE in movie theaters or drug stores, which is what I remember
raccoon
Oct 2012
#94
No, it isn't. But every time someone mentions the old days,that's one of the things I think of. nt
raccoon
Oct 2012
#99
Good post grasswire. The media certainly has followed the trend toward 'coarseness'
lumpy
Oct 2012
#74
Jumpin' Bill Carlisle used to tell a joke about 1 out of 3 people are ugly
graham4anything
Oct 2012
#14
I think part of it can be contributed to increased use of electronic devices for
Butterbean
Oct 2012
#21
I was raised in the 30s depression. People were struggling in every area, yet people
lumpy
Oct 2012
#80
The Beav as FAUST?! Gilbert as SATAN?! LOL! (Faust had no redemption.) Archie's racism and misogyny
WinkyDink
Oct 2012
#112
Get real, man. It was not civil when discrimination was the definition of America.
Bluenorthwest
Oct 2012
#45
Putting people in jail for existing is very uncivil. The US no longer allows that.
Bluenorthwest
Oct 2012
#47
Joe Wilson. But that was very rude, disrespectful, and he was a real a-hole for saying it.
raccoon
Oct 2012
#96
about past forms of 'entertainment'...during the time of Shakespeare the most
Bluenorthwest
Oct 2012
#101
We are on the verge of Civil War because one side has been cheating and oppressing the other.
Tigress DEM
Oct 2012
#61
War is only inevitable when folk CHOOSE to be too stupid to resolve their differences.
Tigress DEM
Oct 2012
#133
i find that folks are fine in the grocery store and on the roads in my little town
NMDemDist2
Oct 2012
#76
IMO it became acceptable with Raygun. "There you go again" said to President Carter
Raine
Oct 2012
#82
Because, in our society, bullies are celebrated, and non-bullies are seen as weak.
Dash87
Oct 2012
#89
Lifestyles of the rich and famous, bad parenting and lack of personal responsibility.
lalalu
Oct 2012
#102
For late 20th C. America = Right. Wing. Talk. Radio. Hours and hours of "aggrieved" rants.
WinkyDink
Oct 2012
#111
Let me get this straight: our country is based on ECONOMIC DARWINISM, as is the most unequal of all
Romulox
Oct 2012
#113
For the right-wing agenda to be successful, we must be a nation of strangers who hate each other
begin_within
Oct 2012
#120
The habit of instant gratification and the increased ability to compartmentalize life.
haele
Oct 2012
#122
Getting old. No matter what time or place you live in, people always get ruder the older you get.
Evoman
Oct 2012
#131
"Think of your own driving habits. You yelling at other drivers. Other drivers flipping you off."
undeterred
Oct 2012
#132