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Caliman73

(11,767 posts)
43. Likely because "some party values" are not worth supporting.
Sun Jun 20, 2021, 01:05 PM
Jun 2021
Democrats used to support "nation building", not anymore. Now non-interventionism is the prevailing foreign policy approach.


With the problems in Vietnam, Central and South America, Iraq, and Afghanistan, with the military budget being so ridiculously large, and understanding that "Nation Building" is just a code word for imposition of our own ideas instead of actually helping nations to develop on their own. Some liberals do not want to be engaged in perpetual war.

Democrats (eg Howard Dean, President Carter) used to support tariffs as a way to encourage developing countries to do better by their people and the environment, not anymore. Now Democrats are free trade globalists.


Tariffs are okay in the short term, when trying to negotiate trade agreements and such, however the better solution is to have an industrial policy and sound trade agreements. Globalism is inevitable but that doesn't mean that you race to the bottom. Tariffs are not effective long term strategies for changing behavior, they have been meant primarily to protect domestic industries. Regulated free trade where people are not being exploited is the better strategy.

Democrats used to support free speech. Now some want to criminalize speech, and jail people under hate speech laws.


Simply not true. No one has ever supported absolute free speech. Objectionable views have been tolerated (I.E. Nazis marching in Skokie) however both conservatives and liberals have had their limits. Hate speech which terrorizes already vulnerable populations is not acceptable in a civilized nation. Also, the United States does not have "hate speech laws" so that is a moot point. There is a MAJOR difference between supporting social and financial consequences, or de-platforming people and making laws to criminalize speech.

Democrats used to support liberal pluralism, now it's slowly being supplanted by identity politics.


Democrats continue to support pluralism. Differing opinions and power centers in political systems IS pluralism. Talking about "identity politics" is buying into right wing framing. There have ALWAYS been identity politics, however the identity that was most represented in politics (and still is) is White Men. When you are the dominant majority and your particular view point has always been "the norm", then any other view point that demands respect, would likely seem like oppression. You see that with Christians whining about religious oppression too. Non-White people and women have been treated like 2nd class citizens in the United States for almost all of its history. LGBTQ people have been marginalized legally and socially. These groups coming out into the open and demanding full and equal respect is not Identity Politics. If the laws, systems, and society treated these groups equally, there would be no need to identify them and make those demands.

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Ah Yep Same place where Mr Peacetrain and I are at!! Peacetrain Jun 2021 #1
Or as Rachel puts it... Towlie Jun 2021 #2
Rachel grew up in a proud-Republican family and so did I FakeNoose Jun 2021 #15
Unfortunately, many Republicans were far from agreeing with their platform Hortensis Jun 2021 #38
Yup. I think that what the cause for the largest shift for the Republican party from back then to cstanleytech Jun 2021 #52
I'm going to disagree there, we've moved left quite a bit Amishman Jun 2021 #3
You're not "disagreeing", kpete didn't say anything about you, it was about kpete and "mr pete". Towlie Jun 2021 #8
True. treestar Jun 2021 #23
I've moved a little, soldierant Jun 2021 #57
Meanwhile Republicans who still view themselves as "moderate" have become a party of radical sop Jun 2021 #4
I was going to say the same thing USAFRetired_Liberal Jun 2021 #10
If it were not so early in the morning, I could come up with a better post but, Ferrets are Cool Jun 2021 #5
Not bad....... MyOwnPeace Jun 2021 #22
Thank you Ferrets are Cool Jun 2021 #46
Ronald Reagan The Mouth Jun 2021 #28
I think I would agree if you added one word: "openly" RVN VET71 Jun 2021 #31
You are correct. Ferrets are Cool Jun 2021 #47
Yep. Though I admit I might a bit further to the left. At least when it comes PatrickforB Jun 2021 #6
I read Senator Kennedy's book about our healthcare system yellowdogintexas Jun 2021 #36
I'm farther left when it comes to the environment and the climate crisis. calimary Jun 2021 #54
I am more liberal Sherman A1 Jun 2021 #7
Amen! My positions have changed very little. Lonestarblue Jun 2021 #9
LGBTQ rights were unheard of 50 years ago when yellowdogintexas Jun 2021 #35
Right?!? moreland01 Jun 2021 #11
"god" help you if you have some left, some centrist, and some conservative positions The Mouth Jun 2021 #29
The right thinks I am left and the left thinks I am centrist. Its tiring. BoomaofBandM Jun 2021 #12
My positions haven't changed, but the remedies for the mess we're in... Bucky Jun 2021 #13
Our big problem is that we "hate freedom." Chainfire Jun 2021 #14
Every time I hear that comment/opinion ChubbyStar Jun 2021 #60
Because there's no opposition party, only a radical far-right post-policy conspiracy theory betsuni Jun 2021 #16
Heat wave and drought will be blamed on Biden; wait for it. Chainfire Jun 2021 #17
Wait for it? It is Biden's fault, clearly. RVN VET71 Jun 2021 #33
It is, after all, the Christian thing to do Retired Engineer Bob Jun 2021 #62
Unions say hey Sympthsical Jun 2021 #18
I've come to understand that the "left-right" way of talking about politics Ron Green Jun 2021 #19
Kick BlueWavePsych Jun 2021 #20
Me too! mgardener Jun 2021 #21
Oh yes. Although I have become more liberal on some social issues. Shrike47 Jun 2021 #24
a post basically describing what hate radio did and you are the first and only one certainot Jun 2021 #66
We didn't move. They did. It's a matter of perspective. paleotn Jun 2021 #25
Don't forget your simultanous years as a Republican-type corporatist also, Hortensis Jun 2021 #26
We are wealthy conservative elites trolling DU by supporting betsuni Jun 2021 #32
In 1968 I was liberal and attending demonstrations LakeArenal Jun 2021 #27
I started far left, and keep moving further left. NewHendoLib Jun 2021 #30
I have always been a flaming liberal yellowdogintexas Jun 2021 #34
That's exactly it! BobTheSubgenius Jun 2021 #37
I think what was considered moderate back 30 years ago. LiberalFighter Jun 2021 #39
I think some liberals have strayed from Democrat party values but don't know it. Mosby Jun 2021 #40
Likely because "some party values" are not worth supporting. Caliman73 Jun 2021 #43
You made my point, thx. Mosby Jun 2021 #44
Here is, I think, a pretty good explainer. Caliman73 Jun 2021 #41
You just hit the nail on the head that's the speaknow Jun 2021 #42
Same. BadgerMom Jun 2021 #45
And Republican have moved from... Kablooie Jun 2021 #48
Don't forget about our clandestine pizza parlors and our hurling soup cans at Rethugs. KY_EnviroGuy Jun 2021 #49
I started out as a liberal in the 60s keldridge Jun 2021 #50
Same. Seems to be accelerating for me! I want substantive change. Welcome to DU Evolve Dammit Jun 2021 #56
Welcome Keldridge! kpete Jun 2021 #64
I am definitely more liberal now than when I was younger mvd Jun 2021 #51
It's still a big tent. Cinnamonspice Jun 2021 #53
This is so spot on. Nixon, Reagan or Bush wouldn't make it out of a primary. Evolve Dammit Jun 2021 #55
Yet all 3 of them step by step led the GOP inexorably to where they are now. Ford_Prefect Jun 2021 #58
indeed. They plan well, spend well, and are patient behind the scenes. Dark money, dark people. Evolve Dammit Jun 2021 #61
Perfect. tecelote Jun 2021 #59
I've always been liberal to progressive. So by some accounts... electric_blue68 Jun 2021 #63
Of course, the typical Republican knows as much about actual socialism Fortinbras Armstrong Jun 2021 #65
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