General Discussion

Ms. Toad

(38,077 posts)

107. Correct.

Mon Aug 2, 2021, 04:54 PM

Aug 2021

Based on the numbers Dr. Fauci gave (96% effectiveness against hospitalized), 99.975% of unvaccinated individuals were not hospitalized with COVID. In other words, during the time period measured - hospitalization with COVID was extremely rare. (A breakthrough case is even rarer. But during this time period only .025% of even unvaccinated people were hospitalized with COVID. Which makes the.001% seem less fantastic than it does wtihout the reality check against the general state of getting COVID.)

That sounds to me like fantastic protection by just not getting vaccinated!!!!

Effectiveness can ONLY be measured by comparing what happens in a vaccinated population to what happens in a like group of unvaccinated. What happens solely in the vaccinated populatino provides little to no useful information.

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Highlight:

Lying by Omission about Break-Thru Covid-19 Infections? [View all] bluewater Aug 2021 OP

.77% or .077 chance Botany Aug 2021 #1

They aren't lying. They are providing data. Phoenix61 Aug 2021 #2

Pay Walled Link and some sources are quoting old data, not current trends bluewater Aug 2021 #3

New York State is still tracking all breakthrough cases Phoenix61 Aug 2021 #8

Missing my point that news sources are quoting older data stlll? bluewater Aug 2021 #15

I found this Phoenix61 Aug 2021 #23

Thanks for the links to current data supporting my point in the OP bluewater Aug 2021 #28

This message was self-deleted by its author Tomconroy Aug 2021 #55

Exactly. I find the OP as offensive/seemingly willfully clueless as the accusations from other side hlthe2b Aug 2021 #5

100% agree obamanut2012 Aug 2021 #12

They wanted the data for Delta Phoenix61 Aug 2021 #13

" The running totals may make it look better than it really is." EXACTLY! bluewater Aug 2021 #19

Of course you are right. I'd like to see those numbers too. Scrivener7 Aug 2021 #67

Yup - and there is a lot of that sensationalizing around here. lagomorph777 Aug 2021 #22

+1 BannonsLiver Aug 2021 #42

I'm not even sure what you're saying. They're not lying. The vaccine is highly effective. Dream Girl Aug 2021 #4

And it's almost all unvaccinated people going to the hospital and/or dying. Initech Aug 2021 #6

It's simple, quote current data for the Delta Variant, not outdated data bluewater Aug 2021 #7

It's 95% Delta at this point. Does that work for you? Dream Girl Aug 2021 #9

Then why are they quoting statistics using months old data? No need to get personal. bluewater Aug 2021 #16

Who is "they"? Some random person on Twitter? The Tweet is not official just some random Dream Girl Aug 2021 #31

It was AXIOS and an NBC reporter I quoted in my OP post bluewater Aug 2021 #37

Yet you titled your post to imply CDC was "lying by omission." NO, you simply need to be able hlthe2b Aug 2021 #50

Except I never mention the CDC bluewater Aug 2021 #53

Your disingenous explanation without accepting responsibillity & editing your OP to clarify hlthe2b Aug 2021 #54

The personal attacks have been duly noted bluewater Aug 2021 #57

No. I am attacking your posts and questioning your motivation in not correcting erroneous hlthe2b Aug 2021 #59

Any and all baseless assertions aside, I think the thread speaks for itself. bluewater Aug 2021 #61

And more have seen your baseless attacks on CDC that only helps the RW destroy confidence in hlthe2b Aug 2021 #62

11 heartwarming DU recs so far.... bluewater Aug 2021 #65

Only because they are opting to ignore your accusation toward CDC. hlthe2b Aug 2021 #68

12 heartwarming recs now... bluewater Aug 2021 #71

Oblivious. hlthe2b Aug 2021 #73

As is cowering behind implication. LanternWaste Aug 2021 #123

15 heartwarming recs and counting... bluewater Aug 2021 #124

Wow. He never said a single thing about the CDC. Scrivener7 Aug 2021 #69

If those numbers were 10 times worse than the vaccine was still be great and working as planned uponit7771 Aug 2021 #10

How is this lying??? It's literally accurate data obamanut2012 Aug 2021 #11

The OP statistics are using months old data, not current data. bluewater Aug 2021 #17

You do understand that any one can post anything on social media. I could post year old data Dream Girl Aug 2021 #33

It was AXIOS and an NBC reporter I quoted in my OP post bluewater Aug 2021 #35

these insanely high claims for effectiveness against infection are bullshit, pure and simple Celerity Aug 2021 #14

THANK YOU!!!! bluewater Aug 2021 #18

Passing you my flame shield SheltieLover Aug 2021 #20

lol Thanks bluewater Aug 2021 #24

Yw! SheltieLover Aug 2021 #26

Stay safe! bluewater Aug 2021 #29

You too! SheltieLover Aug 2021 #56

Your question was reasonable Wavelight Aug 2021 #36

Thank you bluewater Aug 2021 #40

It is VERY simple math, the 95% for Pfizer efficacy and 90% effectiveness numbers against infection Celerity Aug 2021 #27

Thanks for pointing out the facts bluewater Aug 2021 #34

It doesn't seem to be helping, I see a lot of doubling down and some ridiculing of other Celerity Aug 2021 #38

The ironic AF thing is that some of this is coming from people who are hardcore about masks! bluewater Aug 2021 #43

Also, over in the UK (I live in Sweden but I am London-raised) they had a very different outcome Celerity Aug 2021 #44

Seems people like to shoot the messenger bluewater Aug 2021 #46

I do not see any good purpose for wilful and vast over-inflation of COVID-prevention numbers. Celerity Aug 2021 #47

I would like to see news sources stressing how much more contagious Delta is bluewater Aug 2021 #49

Since the very beginning, there has been a fairly large Scrivener7 Aug 2021 #64

+1000 bluewater Aug 2021 #66

Lying by omission is going the other way around here. lagomorph777 Aug 2021 #21

Agree. On the plus side, the period when alarmed and alarming noise Hortensis Aug 2021 #58

When do they plan to start? lagomorph777 Aug 2021 #60

You don't think the meeting took place or that MSM are Hortensis Aug 2021 #63

I believe the meeting happened, and some are being more responsible. lagomorph777 Aug 2021 #70

Sensationalism always. Those who want it will always reward it. nt Hortensis Aug 2021 #74

So we see, here. lagomorph777 Aug 2021 #75

Yes. But at least not by most. nt Hortensis Aug 2021 #79

Thank goodness. lagomorph777 Aug 2021 #85

We don't do ourselves any favors by overestimating the effectiveness of the vaccines. dawg Aug 2021 #25

A point well made bluewater Aug 2021 #30

+1 Celerity Aug 2021 #41

The way the data is presented is misleading for sure madville Aug 2021 #32

I don't understand your point TxGuitar Aug 2021 #72

+1 ProfessorGAC Aug 2021 #82

"It's distressing that there are so many here that willfully focus on the negative..." bluewater Aug 2021 #84

The Denominator Keeps Changing ProfessorGAC Aug 2021 #90

"If a state had a 100% vaccination rate, what percent of new cases would be breakthrough?" bluewater Aug 2021 #102

Yes, we know it works great at preventing severe cases of Delta madville Aug 2021 #87

Where does it end? TxGuitar Aug 2021 #91

It doesn't end, vaccine effectiveness also appears to be waning over time madville Aug 2021 #93

I think it equally dishonest when people say even if you are vaccinated you are at any real risk GulfCoast66 Aug 2021 #39

Current data shows the risks are real and increasing, even for us vaccinated bluewater Aug 2021 #45

No, it's not lying, either "on purpose" or by accident. The data is incomplete muriel_volestrangler Aug 2021 #48

"What we really need is a figure for total breakthrough infections from some time in June." bluewater Aug 2021 #51

They are using the most current data they can - that's the point muriel_volestrangler Aug 2021 #89

"They are using the most current data they can - that's the point" No, they are not. bluewater Aug 2021 #94

I think you are personally assuming something that no one else does, and which is unrealistic muriel_volestrangler Aug 2021 #97

Thanks for correcting my math, but my point still stands. bluewater Aug 2021 #105

No, you're still getting it wrong muriel_volestrangler Aug 2021 #108

No, you are splitting hairs. In fact, you just made my point for me. bluewater Aug 2021 #112

You're assuming that 100% people will get infected in the absence of a vaccine. muriel_volestrangler Aug 2021 #116

Here's a nice article stating how much more contagious the delta variant is: bluewater Aug 2021 #119

You have not shown the statistics in the OP are "misleading" muriel_volestrangler Aug 2021 #121

Oh but I have. bluewater Aug 2021 #122

The problem is that you are demanding that people only talk about what you want to hear muriel_volestrangler Aug 2021 #125

Maybe the "problem" is that other people agree with my point in the OP? bluewater Aug 2021 #127

Again, you're blaming an article for not stating what you wanted it to state muriel_volestrangler Aug 2021 #128

Lack of a substantial reply to previous post noted. bluewater Aug 2021 #129

I did reply to your point muriel_volestrangler Aug 2021 #131

At least 125,000 could be anything, really. LisaL Aug 2021 #80

No, it's not a bullshit number muriel_volestrangler Aug 2021 #86

Last I checked we had 50 states. LisaL Aug 2021 #92

Half the states don't appear to be keeping track Tomconroy Aug 2021 #52

The only truly reliable data for ALL breakthrough infections of any sort in a group are the vax Celerity Aug 2021 #76

Bookmarking for future reference bluewater Aug 2021 #78

yes, I bookmarked this thread as I have posted a fair amount of hard data in it Celerity Aug 2021 #81

Statistics aren't my strong point Tomconroy Aug 2021 #95

No, it means if you are exposed to the virus it has an 80% effectiveness Celerity Aug 2021 #96

So if I understand, 20 percent of us vaxed won't get covid, but Tomconroy Aug 2021 #98

No. You are conflating absolute numbers with actual exposure. Celerity Aug 2021 #99

You know, I'm a horse player. I try to roughly figure the odds. Tomconroy Aug 2021 #100

I am not dealing with predictions of actual numbers of breakthrough cases, Celerity Aug 2021 #103

Have to agree with all that. I'm just trying to figure out how to get through the next month. Tomconroy Aug 2021 #104

No, that is not what the 80% effective number means muriel_volestrangler Aug 2021 #110

No, that is wrong. Sorry. You are now delving into utter randomness as you are not taking into Celerity Aug 2021 #111

No, this is nothing to do with any lab tests muriel_volestrangler Aug 2021 #114

The vax trial we are in used both lab-grown and then later on, wild strain variants Celerity Aug 2021 #115

The figures you gave are for effectiveness, in the real world muriel_volestrangler Aug 2021 #117

I understand your points Celerity Aug 2021 #120

Yes. LisaL Aug 2021 #77

I think we're in the known unknown category stillcool Aug 2021 #83

Of course they wouldn't. Tomconroy Aug 2021 #88

I read a really helpful article the other day ecstatic Aug 2021 #101

bluewater, I just want to thank you for this post and crickets Aug 2021 #106

Thank you, the news need to both correct and not easily misinterpreted bluewater Aug 2021 #109

The delta variant has shaken up a lot of people bluewater Aug 2021 #118

Correct. Ms. Toad Aug 2021 #107

Thanks for a much clearer summary! bluewater Aug 2021 #113

Yep. LisaL Aug 2021 #126

Data from the recent UK Delta surge show how misleading the 99.99% is bluewater Aug 2021 #130

Yes, it's misleading and some people can't figure out what 99.99 % numbers actually mean. LisaL Aug 2021 #132