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PavePusher

(15,374 posts)

162. "anyone caught with one will be dealt with (legal or not). "

Reply to graham4anything (Reply #121)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 01:39 PM

Oct 2012

What exactly do you mean by that?

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How do protective orders really help women? In light of today's mass shooting.. [View all] HipChick Oct 2012 OP

This message was self-deleted by its author nadinbrzezinski Oct 2012 #1

Here in MO glacierbay Oct 2012 #31

Protective orders don't really protect! Protective orders allow the victims TheDebbieDee Oct 2012 #47

I advise victims of abuse that glacierbay Oct 2012 #51

I doubt that your advice to get a firearm and a CC permit was ignored.......... TheDebbieDee Oct 2012 #58

actually never mind nadinbrzezinski Oct 2012 #53

Stand your ground can be used in these cases, and should be without repercussions. crunch60 Oct 2012 #234

i imagine any of those that are not murderous/criminal people. nt seabeyond Oct 2012 #2

with a legal gun allowed, no one in the world is safe to go about their 1st amendment rights. graham4anything Oct 2012 #3

Illegal guns start out as legal guns. Same provenance but with a wrong turn. Loudly Oct 2012 #10

Yo Shares, is that you? ProgressiveProfessor Oct 2012 #18

Sorry, but what a load of bullshit. eom eqfan592 Oct 2012 #16

Alert - Jury report. Enjoy... L0oniX Oct 2012 #76

Nobody is truely "safe" under any conditions.. pipoman Oct 2012 #20

What other republicans to you pray to? ProgressiveProfessor Oct 2012 #21

He actually is a liberal democrat from Mass. graham4anything Oct 2012 #23

Really? Wasn't he the Republican Mayor of NYC for a while? One of the 25 richest people in the US ProgressiveProfessor Oct 2012 #39

Didn't he also sic the NYPD on the Occupy demonstrators? glacierbay Oct 2012 #46

No, but you know that as I have answered this false soundbyte before. graham4anything Oct 2012 #50

Yeah he did glacierbay Oct 2012 #52

you are not from NYC, so don't be a pretender. graham4anything Oct 2012 #57

What difference does it make it I'm in NY or not? glacierbay Oct 2012 #62

you are advocating for a normal person to shoot someone first graham4anything Oct 2012 #69

You really have no clue what I'm about do you? glacierbay Oct 2012 #75

Not at all...he is advocating for people to be able to defend themselves against violence ProgressiveProfessor Oct 2012 #79

LOL 24/7/365 graham4anything Oct 2012 #83

?????????????? nt. glacierbay Oct 2012 #85

Maybe he is calling his lifeline? ProgressiveProfessor Oct 2012 #90

Take justice in my hands, or be shot dead along with 10 others? Hmmmm. Hard decision there. Zalatix Oct 2012 #113

get the legal guns out of the open, you then can stop an illegal gun from entering graham4anything Oct 2012 #117

So I'll ask you again glacierbay Oct 2012 #118

obviously you don't read, you just bloviate...if no one can have an outside gun graham4anything Oct 2012 #121

So I'll ask you again glacierbay Oct 2012 #122

a simple person cannot protect themselves against a mafia, it ludacrist to bring that up graham4anything Oct 2012 #123

What the fuck does the mafia have to do with my question? glacierbay Oct 2012 #124

you brought the mafia up. you said "if a gang member" the mafia is the gang, no? graham4anything Oct 2012 #125

If you don't have the answer glacierbay Oct 2012 #126

who do you think supplies them with the goods they distribute? graham4anything Oct 2012 #127

Still not answering my question glacierbay Oct 2012 #128

"...you are bullying me for some reason." PavePusher Oct 2012 #172

graham4anything already answered your question, didn't you see? Zalatix Oct 2012 #168

I saw that glacierbay Oct 2012 #171

"the brain is smarter than an idiot gun." PavePusher Oct 2012 #163

"a simple person cannot protect themselves against a mafia" PavePusher Oct 2012 #164

WTF is this "If your time is up, it is" lay down and die argument? Zalatix Oct 2012 #167

"anyone caught with one will be dealt with (legal or not). " PavePusher Oct 2012 #162

How do you advocate we do this? PavePusher Oct 2012 #161

"you are advocating for a normal person to shoot someone first" PavePusher Oct 2012 #160

Your "Meek mayor mike" is surrounded by armed guards. PavePusher Oct 2012 #159

As always(on scores of posts against me by gun fans) this is stereotyping which is wrong to do. graham4anything Oct 2012 #48

Meek Mayor Mike? Can you make it any more funny? ProgressiveProfessor Oct 2012 #60

Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness graham4anything Oct 2012 #66

Anything illegal that terminates your life would be the same ProgressiveProfessor Oct 2012 #78

the nra is the 1% the rest is not relevant graham4anything Oct 2012 #81

Show me one post glacierbay Oct 2012 #87

wow. I mean wow. graham4anything Oct 2012 #93

wow. I mean wow. glacierbay Oct 2012 #96

The police should never "collide" with the lawful, peaceful exercise of a Constitutional Right. PavePusher Oct 2012 #180

Depite your obsession with the NRA is quite clear, the rest is also relevant ProgressiveProfessor Oct 2012 #92

How in the Nine Flaming Hells does police misconduct justify restricting Citizens' Rights? PavePusher Oct 2012 #177

Please compare and contrast these two statements sarisataka Oct 2012 #237

What's funny is pipoman Oct 2012 #140

"Meek mayor mike" is surrounded by armed guards.... PavePusher Oct 2012 #175

Nice glacierbay Oct 2012 #32

Right, no-one ever got killed before the invention of firearms. PavePusher Oct 2012 #158

restraining orders really don't help much in cases like this 0rganism Oct 2012 #4

hi! Viva_La_Revolution Oct 2012 #17

hey there! 0rganism Oct 2012 #238

I wish I could Viva_La_Revolution Oct 2012 #240

In 1968, I was told by my attorney Suich Oct 2012 #5

+1000!!! FirstLight Oct 2012 #7

1998 for me. EarthGurl2012 Oct 2012 #9

restraining orders did not help nicole brown simpson, and did not help a woman who was murdered niyad Oct 2012 #6

Unfortunately glacierbay Oct 2012 #34

But in most cases, absence of a gun helps. Hoyt Oct 2012 #45

No it won't glacierbay Oct 2012 #55

You need to think long-term, expand your view. Hoyt Oct 2012 #59

I teach firearms to women for just this kind of thing, and for the foreseeable future firearms are ProgressiveProfessor Oct 2012 #63

I too, have seen the horrors of domestic violence glacierbay Oct 2012 #67

I'm sorry Hoyt glacierbay Oct 2012 #65

I'll agree you and I have a different view of police, in general. Hoyt Oct 2012 #73

If you think a enraged and irrational individual will not act because all they have ProgressiveProfessor Oct 2012 #80

Surely you can cite to stats, pre- and post-firearm development, that support your assertion. n/t PavePusher Oct 2012 #183

Ever heard of fists? Jamastiene Oct 2012 #226

Tell that to a woman all bloodied and bruised from the fists that just pounded her into a pulp. n/t Jamastiene Oct 2012 #225

How about a baby who gets shot? In most cases there are better ways Hoyt Oct 2012 #227

Or the 4 year old who was beaten to death 6 miles north of me the other week? Jamastiene Oct 2012 #229

One of my worse domestic violence calls glacierbay Oct 2012 #231

I suppose a gun would have helped. Hoyt Oct 2012 #236

Your facile facetiousness has wandered grossly off-topic. n/t PavePusher Oct 2012 #239

If a guy is determined to get you a piece of paper won't stop him. virgogal Oct 2012 #8

yup. deafskeptic Oct 2012 #13

A law is only as effective as a persons willingness to follow it. Xithras Oct 2012 #152

No. H2O Man Oct 2012 #11

I'm sure I'm about to enrage some folks but here goes anyway justiceischeap Oct 2012 #12

That's already the law obamanut2012 Oct 2012 #14

Then it doesn't seem to be working. justiceischeap Oct 2012 #25

Ultimately, the women, some of them, are facing situations where they will need to be armed. krispos42 Oct 2012 #42

+1 graham4anything Oct 2012 #24

Like this one? dems_rightnow Oct 2012 #30

Here in Missouri glacierbay Oct 2012 #37

That was the case here... Jeff In Milwaukee Oct 2012 #173

They tell you when you file LadyHawkAZ Oct 2012 #15

Govt. is not obligated to protect anyone unless they are in custody. Self-defense is a personal jody Oct 2012 #19

Maybe we should start making self-defense easier by reducing gun availability. Hoyt Oct 2012 #26

+ a zillion trillion million graham4anything Oct 2012 #29

It seems so obvious. And, you are exactly right about "legal" guns Hoyt Oct 2012 #40

That would only make things eaiser for the perps ProgressiveProfessor Oct 2012 #70

Except, Professor, there would be a lot less perps. Hoyt Oct 2012 #77

You truly think someone bent on violence will not use another weapon than a handgun? ProgressiveProfessor Oct 2012 #82

Not everyone who does crud like this is as "bent" as you assume. Hoyt Oct 2012 #89

What about those you would disarm who need firearms to protect themselves against ProgressiveProfessor Oct 2012 #95

Professor, much less will do it without a gun. Hoyt Oct 2012 #97

Much less or 10%? ProgressiveProfessor Oct 2012 #98

I think most folks would prefer to fight a brick, or belt. Hoyt Oct 2012 #105

You just nailed it glacierbay Oct 2012 #107

Prey logic. Zalatix Oct 2012 #174

People who consider themselves "prey" probably ought not have access to guns. Hoyt Oct 2012 #176

Moar prey logic! Zalatix Oct 2012 #181

A woman who has an RO against an abusive husband shouldn't have access to defensive weapons? PavePusher Oct 2012 #187

If he or she truly consider themselves "prey" (meaning they will do anything to survive), and Hoyt Oct 2012 #197

Not necessarily glacierbay Oct 2012 #84

GB, I get it some folks will use another weapon, but many who might use a gun Hoyt Oct 2012 #106

Very true glacierbay Oct 2012 #108

Sounds good and thanks. I did the ride along that with my father-in-law years ago. Hoyt Oct 2012 #132

I promise I'll supply the donuts and coffee glacierbay Oct 2012 #133

YUP!!! graham4anything Oct 2012 #116

So a law abiding citizen with a gun glacierbay Oct 2012 #119

Let's be fair. The point here is to cut down on the criminals who have a gun, and Hoyt Oct 2012 #134

I fully agree glacierbay Oct 2012 #136

"...become a criminal because guns are so accessible." PavePusher Oct 2012 #193

Statistics work differently in that one's world. n/t PavePusher Oct 2012 #192

Very true glacierbay Oct 2012 #198

Sounds like we have same experience with gun cultists. Hoyt Oct 2012 #130

Why don't you take a look at some of the posts I've made recently, Hoyt? Decoy of Fenris Oct 2012 #131

So that I have a little better feel for where you are coming from -- How do you feel about NRA? Hoyt Oct 2012 #135

C'mon Hoyt glacierbay Oct 2012 #137

I believe I've answered these questions from you before, or something similar. Decoy of Fenris Oct 2012 #139

If you think the Mississippi gun shop selling a Charlie Rangel assault rifle is just satire, we'd Hoyt Oct 2012 #142

Ah, aye, it was DanTex, not you. Decoy of Fenris Oct 2012 #143

I find it unfortunate you don't acknowledge the racism in the Mississippi gun store's promotion. Hoyt Oct 2012 #144

There's no racism glacierbay Oct 2012 #147

Well, see, that's a little personal problem. Decoy of Fenris Oct 2012 #150

You probably didn't see racism in Reagan launching his presidential campaign Hoyt Oct 2012 #166

Nope. Had to do some digging. Decoy of Fenris Oct 2012 #179

I think you need some history lessons on the subject. Hoyt Oct 2012 #182

Please point out the racism. n/t PavePusher Oct 2012 #196

Unless you can explicitly cite this "racism" you seem to be imagining... PavePusher Oct 2012 #199

Not to shoot people glacierbay Oct 2012 #145

GB, no that is not racist. However the Mississippi gun store promotion is. Hoyt Oct 2012 #146

Can you prove that it's racist? glacierbay Oct 2012 #148

Probably not to your satisfaction. Not sure you understand the term. Hoyt Oct 2012 #165

So you have no proof that it's racist based. glacierbay Oct 2012 #169

More insinuated slander from you. Interesting. PavePusher Oct 2012 #200

Please point out the "racist gun cultists" you refer to at your link. PavePusher Oct 2012 #194

YUP! graham4anything Oct 2012 #138

Here's what I find ironic glacierbay Oct 2012 #141

what cats hear when people talk blah blah blah blah blah graham4anything Oct 2012 #149

I rest my case. nt. glacierbay Oct 2012 #151

Legal guns stop the removal of illegal guns. You cannot deny it. graham4anything Oct 2012 #153

How in the world do legally owned guns stop the removal of illegal guns? glacierbay Oct 2012 #154

legal guns stop the removal of illegal guns. for the 8th time today. graham4anything Oct 2012 #155

And you have yet to answer any question posed to you glacierbay Oct 2012 #157

"legal guns stop the removal of illegal guns." You still haven't explained this. PavePusher Oct 2012 #202

anyone with a gun could shoot me for no reason at all,then claim self defense graham4anything Oct 2012 #216

"then claim self defense" PavePusher Oct 2012 #219

"legal guns stop the removal of illegal guns" PavePusher Oct 2012 #203

Clearly you know nothing about physical combat. PavePusher Oct 2012 #191

"but many who might use a gun won't use a less lethal weapon." PavePusher Oct 2012 #188

Please cite your supporting evidence. n/t PavePusher Oct 2012 #186

Assuming the would-be victims are always the strongest and most violent people in our society 4th law of robotics Oct 2012 #101

Because crime was lower in pre-firearm days? PavePusher Oct 2012 #185

citizens can call 911 when attacked, and kindly tell the perp to please wait 15 min for the police niyad Oct 2012 #68

Apparently you did not understand what I wrote. Please reread. nt jody Oct 2012 #100

I understood you just fine. so do please tell me how a person is supposed to defend herself, niyad Oct 2012 #109

In some states she could have been armed. IMO that option should be jody Oct 2012 #110

Wow, you SERIOUSLY didn't read that post for comprehension, did you? Zalatix Oct 2012 #112

Perhaps some additional punctuation will make the meaning more clear? PavePusher Oct 2012 #204

It's a piece of paper, and far from bullet proof. eqfan592 Oct 2012 #22

It boggles the mind graham4anything Oct 2012 #28

So if there's a law that says you can't take your gun out of your home glacierbay Oct 2012 #38

we have argued on 100s of threads. You are pro-gun. I am anti-gun. graham4anything Oct 2012 #43

You didn't answer the question glacierbay Oct 2012 #44

You can't get rid of illegal guns til you get rid of legal ones. graham4anything Oct 2012 #54

So in other words glacierbay Oct 2012 #56

They should issue the victim a gun along with the protection order leftstreet Oct 2012 #35

Agree. nt jody Oct 2012 #41

What do you do about dual restraining orders? hughee99 Oct 2012 #86

What is this "qualify" you speak of? PavePusher Oct 2012 #206

Depending on the state, are you a convicted felon? hughee99 Oct 2012 #209

I know.... PavePusher Oct 2012 #213

Rereading it after your post, I can see where I may have left that impression hughee99 Oct 2012 #214

No problem. I have to admit to a bit of sensitivity on the subject. PavePusher Oct 2012 #215

No problem. hughee99 Oct 2012 #217

Read "The Gift of Fear" by Gavin de Becker. Nye Bevan Oct 2012 #27

They will not protect you against someone who wants to do physical harm. former9thward Oct 2012 #33

Last week this time Captain Barkey and his girlfriend were murdered malaise Oct 2012 #36

If your relatives are crazy, nobody can protect you undeterred Oct 2012 #49

A Secret Service detail also is pretty good protection FarCenter Oct 2012 #61

+1 million Zoeisright Oct 2012 #72

Not neccesarily. PavePusher Oct 2012 #207

They don't usually. Lone_Star_Dem Oct 2012 #64

They do help. My husband was the head of a woman's shelter Zoeisright Oct 2012 #71

They most certainly not end up in prison glacierbay Oct 2012 #189

Why should someone end up in prison for exercising a Constitutional Right???? PavePusher Oct 2012 #208

I'm not a fan of them. It's said that they actually make things worse! progressivebydesign Oct 2012 #74

They do work in many cases CitizenPatriot Oct 2012 #88

+10000 glacierbay Oct 2012 #94

My late wife helped people running and hiding ProgressiveProfessor Oct 2012 #102

I have helped as well and it will kill your belief in people CitizenPatriot Oct 2012 #114

So what message are you actually advocating there? n/t vaberella Oct 2012 #91

Laws are only as effective as their enforcement 4th law of robotics Oct 2012 #99

Orders for protection/restraining orders are a very helpful tool at work rustydog Oct 2012 #103

PROPS for that. Very encouraging and proactive. n/t CitizenPatriot Oct 2012 #115

A gun probably would not have helped her in this case. agentS Oct 2012 #104

Maybe, maybe not. PavePusher Oct 2012 #210

They do help a lot of women treestar Oct 2012 #111

Of course it's flawed. That doesn't mean it hasn't helped women. cali Oct 2012 #120

protective orders need to come with GPS's for both parties ileus Oct 2012 #129

For the most part, laws are punitive, not preventative. porphyrian Oct 2012 #156

Inadequate gun laws are a part of the problem. DanTex Oct 2012 #170

So what law would have stopped this guy from killing her? glacierbay Oct 2012 #184

It's much easier to murder with a gun than with other weapons. DanTex Oct 2012 #190

I'm going to have to dispute your post glacierbay Oct 2012 #195

OK, then we disagree. DanTex Oct 2012 #201

You didn't answer the question: PavePusher Oct 2012 #212

the new law- all guns must remain inside a home. And better security nationwide, like graham4anything Oct 2012 #218

So you want a police state..... PavePusher Oct 2012 #220

because of legal guns, we can't get rid of illegal guns graham4anything Oct 2012 #221

This message was self-deleted by its author PavePusher Oct 2012 #222

"take away crime, you don't need the police at all" PavePusher Oct 2012 #223

So I'll ask you again glacierbay Oct 2012 #228

None. Jamastiene Oct 2012 #230

I just don't understand how some posters here, one in particular glacierbay Oct 2012 #232

"I see the NRA crowd is here in full force, arguing as usual that the solution is more guns." PavePusher Oct 2012 #211

Laws against murder haven't protected any victim of such a crime Kaleva Oct 2012 #178

good question. Liberal_in_LA Oct 2012 #205

For the most part, they don't. Jamastiene Oct 2012 #224

Protective orders are not to protect any single gender RB TexLa Oct 2012 #233

Protective orders do not help women. Be prepared, carry a gun. A man intent on killing crunch60 Oct 2012 #235