Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search
 

PTWB

(4,131 posts)
44. That isn't what you wrote in the post I was replying to.
Sun Jan 16, 2022, 01:28 PM
Jan 2022

In this post you've written that you're "not trying to attack me" and "no-one is saying the majority of poor people are criminals." In the post I was replying to, you wrote, and I'm quoting again, "The majority of poor people are not criminals despite the assertions made in these posts."

I do not claim that the majority of poor people are criminals. I never have said anything of the sort, despite what you wrote in that post when you attacked me with that false claim.

Now you're saying that the majority of criminals are poor, but you're attributing that as "being due primarily to their criminal nature and other behaviors associated with that criminality." That's incredibly offensive.

We disproportionately incarcerate Black Americans because they're more likely to be born into extreme poverty due to generation after generation of economic and social oppression. They are NOT any more likely to have a "criminal nature and other behaviors associated with that criminality" than white Americans, yet Black Americans are five times more likely to be incarcerated than whites. Tell me again how that's just due to their "criminal nature."

You claim in this post that the relationship between poverty and crime is because of "their criminal nature." You claimed in your previous post that these poor folks have "criminal inclinations tending to move them down the socioeconomic ladder" and that all they have to do to climb out of poverty is to "work harder." Can you not see how that smacks of racism, classism, and rightwing extremism? That's something you'd expect to hear if you'd accidentally tuned into Rush Limbaugh in the early 90s. That isn't something you'd expect to read on a progressive, Democratic forum in 2022!

I'm really not sure what to say to you. We've known for decades that as wealth disparity and income inequality get worse, so do crime rates.

The stark relationship between income inequality and crime

A new survey by Gallup, a polling organization, appears to go some way to verifying Becker’s theory. It asked 148,000 people in 142 countries about their perceptions of crime and how safe they feel across four measures: whether they trust the local police; whether they feel safe walking home alone; if they have had property or money stolen; and whether they have been assaulted over the past year. Testing the correlation between these questions and the amount of income inequality (as measured by the Gini coefficient) in any given country shows a strong and positive relationship (see chart above).

Whether people feel safe walking home alone or not shows the strongest relationship with inequality. In Venezuela, for example, four-fifths of respondents said they do not feel safe walking home alone—kidnappings and extortion are a common occurrence in the country. Its income distribution is the 19th-most unequal in the study. In contrast, fully 95% of people in Norway said they feel safe walking home alone. Sure enough, it is 12th most equal country of the 142.


FACTORS THAT PREDICT VIOLENT CRIME

FACTORS THAT PREDICT VIOLENT CRIME

Firearm ownership is a statistically significant predictor of homicide rate (t=4.43), but the effect of each firearm is vanishingly small (and that of each homicide disproportionately large) at the margin. For example, the model suggests that a population of 1.2 million must reduce its firearm ownership rate by 1 per 100 (i.e. destroy up to 12,000 firearms) to avoid one homicide per year. Alternatively, each additional homicide per year would prompt the purchase of up to 12,000 additional firearms.

Racial diversity. This analysis was colorblind. I used publicly available data from the Kaiser Family Foundation for the racial composition of each state (White, Black, Hispanic, Asian, Native, and of two or more races). The diversity index represents the probability of a random pairing of individuals being of different racial groups. The analysis found that more-diverse populations have higher rates of homicide (t=4.75) and robbery (t=3.41). This statistical finding might seem disturbing, but the magnitude of the effect is rather small: If we were to make our hypothetical population of 1.2 million of any single race, the model predicts that we would avoid only three homicides per year.

GDP per capita. The analysis found an inverse relationship between GDP and both homicide (t=-5.86) and robbery (t=-5.29). In other words, as a population gets wealthier, homicides and robberies both decrease. The model implies that our hypothetical population of 1.2 million could avoid one homicide per year by increasing GDP by $1,700 per person.

Income inequality. The analysis found an interaction between the Gini coefficient and the GDP per capita that was a strong predictor of both homicide (t=6.80) and robbery (t=7.06). In other words, the wealthier the population and the bigger the gap between the highest and lowest income earners, the more homicides and robberies. The model suggests that our hypothetical population of 1.2 million, assuming the current US GDP per capita of $57,466 and Gini coefficient of 0.41, would avoid 60 homicides per year if it had Canada’s Gini coefficient of 0.34 while holding all other variables constant.


How neighborhood inequality leads to higher crime rates

Overall, our results support the theory that as income inequality increases, so does property crime, and that the spatial context plays important role in the relationship. Policies aimed at reducing localized income inequality may help to reduce the incentive for property crime. If households have similar income, then there should be no reason for people to steal from their neighbors. However, we must caution readers on the robustness of these results to other cities. Block groups can vary dramatically in size across large and small cities which may impact the results.
Time for armed guards alphafemale Jan 2022 #1
We don't shoot people who steal or damage property. PTWB Jan 2022 #2
We don't? Loki Liesmith Jan 2022 #3
As a society, no, we don't. PTWB Jan 2022 #5
No, the people doing these crimes don't want to do any job . They shoot and kill minimum wage JI7 Jan 2022 #7
And just like that, crime will disappear? brooklynite Jan 2022 #8
The vast majority of crime will disappear when we fix socioeconomic injustices, yes. PTWB Jan 2022 #11
That is complete nonsense cinematicdiversions Jan 2022 #17
That was a common belief in the 70s and 80s. PTWB Jan 2022 #18
From the article Celerity Jan 2022 #25
Yes but that doesn't seem to be working. cinematicdiversions Jan 2022 #29
the underlying socio-economic issues are being poorly addressed Celerity Jan 2022 #33
Basically, the way to stop crime is to madville Jan 2022 #36
I don't think that is true. There will always be crime...and sorry that sort of criminal behavior Demsrule86 Jan 2022 #27
You're attributing something to me that I never said. PTWB Jan 2022 #30
Your assuming a chicken and egg. cinematicdiversions Jan 2022 #32
What the heck? PTWB Jan 2022 #34
I assure you I am not trying to attack you. cinematicdiversions Jan 2022 #42
That isn't what you wrote in the post I was replying to. PTWB Jan 2022 #44
I don't disagree that there will be more crime in poorer areas and part of that are the crimes Demsrule86 Jan 2022 #35
Drug abuse and policies. Mosby Jan 2022 #38
Right now there are tons of jobs, skilled & unskilled, waiting to be filled oldsoftie Jan 2022 #49
They won't. And the ones being hurt becsuse of their criminal behaviour JI7 Jan 2022 #55
Thieves will still steal. I-Scream Jan 2022 #10
Thank you whathehell Jan 2022 #16
Saying people steal because they are poor is a terrible indictment of the economically disadvantaged alphafemale Jan 2022 #23
You pretty much nailed it. nt oldsoftie Jan 2022 #50
So your take is these people are poor? harumph Jan 2022 #14
It is hilarious. And it explains a lot of other hilarious Nixie Jan 2022 #20
It's a rather repulsive mindset. Looking down on poor people. alphafemale Jan 2022 #24
So we should just leave the bank vaults open and unguarded too, then? alphafemale Jan 2022 #21
So, let them steal? No punishment? Nt USALiberal Jan 2022 #26
bs Calculating Jan 2022 #40
I think it's agents of those who want to keep inflation up and the supply chain choked. LuvLoogie Jan 2022 #4
Thats a big enough reach to make Stretch Armstrong laugh. oldsoftie Jan 2022 #51
Sounds like they have really lax security - maybe it's intentional tenderfoot Jan 2022 #6
Why would lax security be " intentional"? whathehell Jan 2022 #15
To create chaos - they sure had a lot of time to leave all that debris all over the place tenderfoot Jan 2022 #28
Union Pacific has its own police force Beaverhausen Jan 2022 #45
Looks like they had the night off tenderfoot Jan 2022 #48
Yeah. The story is not adding up, imo. Nt ecstatic Jan 2022 #54
I'm bewildered by the debris... tenderfoot Jan 2022 #56
Besides the vandalism is the mess of trash that's just left Raine Jan 2022 #9
I saw the pics shanti Jan 2022 #12
Hmmm, you're supposed to sell that stuff. BlueTsunami2018 Jan 2022 #13
Arrest The Thieves Lock Them Up Then Give Them Jobs Planting Trees When They Get Out DanieRains Jan 2022 #19
This is not a new problem Amishman Jan 2022 #22
I've seen articles on this happening in Chicago. Throck Jan 2022 #31
Sounds more like anarchists than thieves madville Jan 2022 #37
Anarchist? Throck Jan 2022 #39
Seems more like basic trash dumping leftstreet Jan 2022 #46
Despicable Calculating Jan 2022 #41
This is why Adams was elected in NYC radius777 Jan 2022 #43
London Breed REALLY went off on it last month didnt she? oldsoftie Jan 2022 #52
Post removed Post removed Jan 2022 #47
Which packages are mailed by train? ecstatic Jan 2022 #53
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Thieves in LA are looting...»Reply #44