General Discussion

kenfrequed

(7,865 posts)

119. Uhm...

Wed Dec 14, 2011, 02:28 PM

Dec 2011

They do both. They have done both. And anyone who suggests they have not spoken out to politicians is not paying attention.

One of the crucial reasons to continue marching on banks and on corporations is not to try to convince banks and corporations to be nice people or to be responsible citizens. To suggest that this is what they are trying to accomplish when they do so is either a blunderous misreading, or an intentional and obtuse blindness.

The reason they march on these organizations is to remind the people who caused the financial ruin. Just blaming the government and politics is useless as it only garauntees that someone will posit something slightly different and pretend it might work, like more friggin tax cuts, or deregulation.

By attacking the banks and Wallstreet we are indicating who needs to be regulated and who caused the problem, and more importantly pointing out the costs of irrational and insane levels of greed.

Until we get politicians speaking and voting for the people and against the banks and Wallstreet we will not get meaningful reform.

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Many of us are still going to protest. Some might not like our "tactics". [View all] mmonk Dec 2011 OP

Absolutely. We've tried playing nice, writing letters, voting, going to town-halls. backscatter712 Dec 2011 #1

Yes. I have worked it on the inside and have done the fax and calling campaigns. mmonk Dec 2011 #3

We need a new Declaration of Independence. nm rhett o rick Dec 2011 #5

A Constitutional Convention is what we need tavalon Dec 2011 #70

But how do we wrest power away from the corp-overlords? nm rhett o rick Dec 2011 #118

Go. Save the nation. This has already changed things permanently. I love Occupy. roguevalley Dec 2011 #68

I've been going. backscatter712 Dec 2011 #75

Oh, hell yeah! tavalon Dec 2011 #69

Post removed Post removed Dec 2011 #92

Amen Brother. Matariki Dec 2011 #2

Watch out for the anti-OWS crowd in here. There code is "OWS is hurting their own message" rhett o rick Dec 2011 #4

Their concern is touching, isn't it? n/t backscatter712 Dec 2011 #6

Not always. greytdemocrat Dec 2011 #10

Please expain how it is becoming a religion? And what do you recommend instead? Status quo? nm rhett o rick Dec 2011 #11

"Global warming" is a "religion?!" RandomKoolzip Dec 2011 #12

Well... greytdemocrat Dec 2011 #14

Oh, you mean how there's overwhelming scientific evidence that climate change exists, unlike RandomKoolzip Dec 2011 #20

So you believe nearly every climate scientist in the world is a fanatic? Bjorn Against Dec 2011 #62

I'm trying to see the difference UnrepentantLiberal Dec 2011 #73

Is that called "self-hate"? Fuddnik Dec 2011 #87

Uhm kenfrequed Dec 2011 #95

Holy Crap... turn off the right wing propaganda fascisthunter Dec 2011 #135

He's right about the OWS = New Religion. randome Dec 2011 #15

You have a fucked up definition of the word "religion." RandomKoolzip Dec 2011 #16

How so? Blind faith? Refusal to discuss alternative opinions? randome Dec 2011 #18

As someone who actually participated in the protests, I assure you RandomKoolzip Dec 2011 #22

Damned straight. backscatter712 Dec 2011 #27

Wow. Such cogent arguments. randome Dec 2011 #28

Funny, that's the same logic DU's Obama supporters refuse to acknowledge. RandomKoolzip Dec 2011 #30

Actually, that's a good point. randome Dec 2011 #31

Go to a protest and be heard! Fantastic Anarchist Dec 2011 #38

I'm listening. randome Dec 2011 #40

Washington is one of the targets of the protest. Fantastic Anarchist Dec 2011 #41

First you say Washington is one of the targets. randome Dec 2011 #43

You are demeaning OWS. "little groups going off on their own thing". Whose side are you on? rhett o rick Dec 2011 #45

Where the hell do you get that from? randome Dec 2011 #47

They are protesting both Democrats and Republicans! Fantastic Anarchist Dec 2011 #49

I said nothing about speed or instant gratification. randome Dec 2011 #58

Ammendment to get rid of corporate personhood nadinbrzezinski Dec 2011 #97

Your claim that they will accomplish nothing is forgetting that they already have. They have jwirr Dec 2011 #103

What did the West Coast port interruptions do for jobs or the economy? randome Dec 2011 #106

WE already know that but there are a lot people who did not know that. It also highlighted the jwirr Dec 2011 #108

I agree, OWS got that message through just fine! randome Dec 2011 #112

Corporations bought the politicians Bjorn Against Dec 2011 #143

The general public is ablivious to that gross inequality. They dont rhett o rick Dec 2011 #115

I don't have to do shit. randome Dec 2011 #122

In other words nadinbrzezinski Dec 2011 #130

not if the poster's agenda is to help fight against a movement and idea fascisthunter Dec 2011 #136

Ridiculous kenfrequed Dec 2011 #98

It's been answered many times by many posters. randome Dec 2011 #110

Uhm... kenfrequed Dec 2011 #119

I agreewith your last paragraph. randome Dec 2011 #121

Do you have any idea what it entails to be involved in Politics? truedelphi Dec 2011 #141

+1 Zorra Dec 2011 #117

Wow, you have been busy! tavalon Dec 2011 #71

His lounge chair is like Bill and Ted's UnrepentantLiberal Dec 2011 #74

This message was self-deleted by its author Pacifist Patriot Dec 2011 #94

Apparently some people think a "religion" is "something I like a whole lot." RandomKoolzip Dec 2011 #144

Perhaps with Global Warming greytdemocrat Dec 2011 #32

Really? You think academic grant money compares to oil+chemical lobbyist money? RandomKoolzip Dec 2011 #33

I've had this arguement countless times greytdemocrat Dec 2011 #37

Yes nothing changes, you lose every time when you don't have the facts on your side. Bjorn Against Dec 2011 #63

It would have been very easy to avoid this if you'd refrained from calling global warming a religion JVS Dec 2011 #99

Wikipedia is a religion. RandomKoolzip Dec 2011 #145

We're getting off-topic here, obviously. randome Dec 2011 #36

My point is greytdemocrat Dec 2011 #39

Who the hell says we control the weather? Bjorn Against Dec 2011 #65

Unfortunately just about every competent scientist studying human-induced global climate change... Raster Dec 2011 #101

Actions have consequences. That is a very conservative statement that should make you very happy. jwirr Dec 2011 #105

Tell you what: let's test whether we humans have control of the atmosphere on a small scale first. RandomKoolzip Dec 2011 #146

Grant money riding on it? Your opinion is straight off the O'Reilly Factor. dogknob Dec 2011 #61

Anyone who thinks global warming is wrong, IMHO, is a fool Marrah_G Dec 2011 #89

So you are against OWS. What's your answer? Status Quo? nm rhett o rick Dec 2011 #44

I am not against OWS. randome Dec 2011 #48

Your first two statements conflict. You support OWS if they did it different, means you dont rhett o rick Dec 2011 #51

Yeah, well, I can compress your statement down further, too. randome Dec 2011 #55

Do you understand the concept of civil disobedience? If so, explain why you dont agree the ports rhett o rick Dec 2011 #57

Civil disobedience is usually directed at groups or institutions responsible... randome Dec 2011 #60

I will ask a very rethorical question nadinbrzezinski Dec 2011 #64

This is like trying to explain rock and roll to grandpa. UnrepentantLiberal Dec 2011 #77

So now OWS is even MORE than a protest movement? randome Dec 2011 #82

Nice straw man you made there. UnrepentantLiberal Dec 2011 #113

Totally agree. And while the M$M Media whines about this truedelphi Dec 2011 #124

OWS is learning how to adapt in order to survive... AntiFascist Dec 2011 #50

It's a social movement, fer cryin' out loud Remember Me Dec 2011 #53

Actually it makes sense. kenfrequed Dec 2011 #96

The "dirty hippies" meme didn't work in the time truedelphi Dec 2011 #125

that sounds like DonCoquixote Dec 2011 #114

Interesting concept. mmonk Dec 2011 #13

I guess it's a good thing nadinbrzezinski Dec 2011 #26

I can't believe you just said G_j Dec 2011 #80

This message was self-deleted by its author AllyCat Dec 2011 #88

Wow, I've read silly stuff at DU over the years, but this is up there. Pacifist Patriot Dec 2011 #93

Hmmm. you do not sound like you have ever supported OWS. Religion - it takes much longer than jwirr Dec 2011 #100

Yeah, and I have a statue of the Global Warming Goddess that I pray to every night. RoccoR5955 Dec 2011 #111

Calling global warming a "religion" is like calling gravity just a "theory" LastLiberal in PalmSprings Dec 2011 #128

On the bright side nadinbrzezinski Dec 2011 #24

I believe they always had a message, but many are too clueless or in denial to recognize it. nm rhett o rick Dec 2011 #140

How do you appeal to the 99% you claim to represent if you do use more violent tactics? applegrove Dec 2011 #56

The 'New Democrat' Message formercia Dec 2011 #109

Also, MLK Jr. was also unpopular, and HATED by many during his life. backscatter712 Dec 2011 #7

I liked the way he protested bigtree Dec 2011 #21

Not in the 50s and early 60s he didn't. UnrepentantLiberal Dec 2011 #79

I remember seeing where Kennedy invited Dr. King and others into the WH for a series of discussions bigtree Dec 2011 #86

Kennedy made some gestures, yes. UnrepentantLiberal Dec 2011 #116

it was a combination of efforts bigtree Dec 2011 #120

He did work with Congress at that point. UnrepentantLiberal Dec 2011 #133

why does OWS have to refight the landscape the civil rights movement won? bigtree Dec 2011 #148

But he actively embraced the political system hack89 Dec 2011 #52

Many Occupiers also lobby and encourage people to vote Bjorn Against Dec 2011 #67

Part of the process is ignoring some of your critics gratuitous Dec 2011 #8

We can afford to ignore our critics but can't afford not to be heard by those that hold power. mmonk Dec 2011 #19

The pricks in control do not honor our rights or the Constitution so why should we Lint Head Dec 2011 #9

we can handle that bigtree Dec 2011 #17

Yes, there is a purpose and direction for us all. mmonk Dec 2011 #23

the continuing protests undeniably provide a visible base to the arguments bigtree Dec 2011 #90

The media need to be totally occupied Rosa Luxemburg Dec 2011 #25

indeed themadstork Dec 2011 #78

Bravo, Rosa. I think the heated hallways of the major truedelphi Dec 2011 #137

the Green Room at Fox! Rosa Luxemburg Dec 2011 #139

Let's coordinate our watches and meet! truedelphi Dec 2011 #147

I still think OWS is on the right track. nt stevenleser Dec 2011 #29

Those who tend to 'concern' themselves with this haven't lost enough yet... Earth_First Dec 2011 #34

Kicking and reccing ... Fantastic Anarchist Dec 2011 #35

K&R (nt) T S Justly Dec 2011 #42

yep G_j Dec 2011 #46

I am good with protest quaker bill Dec 2011 #54

+1000!!! FirstLight Dec 2011 #59

They are the same poor saps that believe capitalism can be reformed... nt Modern_Matthew Dec 2011 #66

Agreed - K&R - nt Ohio Joe Dec 2011 #72

keep at it! themadstork Dec 2011 #76

Is there an Occupy Du Forum and I'm not talking Occupy DU2! sce56 Dec 2011 #81

No thanks, the segregation is a net loss TheKentuckian Dec 2011 #83

OWS barbtries Dec 2011 #84

I couldn't have said it better! +1 n/t deacon_sephiroth Dec 2011 #91

The second your sister loses her job, the second some life threatening illness pops truedelphi Dec 2011 #126

i know what you mean barbtries Dec 2011 #132

Who are you talking to? treestar Dec 2011 #85

When media costs are so high and they control the message nineteen50 Dec 2011 #102

Congress and the 1% have to do right by the 99%, or we Zorra Dec 2011 #104

I like your attitude, but would disagree about truedelphi Dec 2011 #142

The revolution has begun. OWS are leading the way. rainy Dec 2011 #107

The OP makes a false argument... MellowDem Dec 2011 #123

You make a good point, though in a sense you are throwing the baby out with the bath truedelphi Dec 2011 #127

Meh. bluedigger Dec 2011 #129

Thanks... midnight Dec 2011 #131

I Could care Less what the Dem Leadership Parrots have to say fascisthunter Dec 2011 #134

Ain't it the truth! n/t truedelphi Dec 2011 #138