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Violet_Crumble

(36,443 posts)

39. She 'spews' indirect bigotry against trans people....

Thu Mar 23, 2023, 05:49 PM

Mar 2023

I put 'spew' in dit-dits because as a very successful writer, she chooses her words carefully and they've got some nuance. There's a world of difference between the Twitter swarm I've had the misfortune to encounter yesterday and someone like JK Rowling.

Not sure if any of you have heard of Kellie-Jay Keen-Minshull. She's an anti-trans 'activist' who's having rallies in most Australian cities called 'Let Women Speak' because she claims to be an activist for women's rights. She's not. I would have used her as an example of a TERF rather than JK Rowling, who I do think has made bigoted comments, but not the base and extremely ugly type that I saw yesterday on Twitter from the KJK mob.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kellie-Jay_Keen-Minshull

Anyway, I'm the first to acknowledge that I know very little about trans issues and when in doubt I think it's best to turn to a trans woman to explain why what JK Rowling has been saying is in fact bigoted.

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Ana Kasparian's "I'm a woman" Tweet [View all] JI7 Mar 2023 OP

I'm disappointed in her Mad_Machine76 Mar 2023 #1

It isn't inclusive, though. 'Women and other pregnant persons' is inclusive. You want to exclude hlthe2b Mar 2023 #3

"Women and other pregnant persons" implies that all women are pregnant. WhiskeyGrinder Mar 2023 #26

This message was self-deleted by its author hlthe2b Mar 2023 #27

"Pregnant women" refers to women who are pregnant. WhiskeyGrinder Mar 2023 #28

As I've already replied... ignore hlthe2b Mar 2023 #29

Claiming that the term "pregnant people" is not inclusive makes no sense whatsoever. ShazzieB Mar 2023 #31

This message was self-deleted by its author hlthe2b Mar 2023 #32

Your understanding of what "inclusive" means seems to be different from that of most people here. ShazzieB Mar 2023 #37

This message was self-deleted by its author hlthe2b Mar 2023 #38

I'm not trying to diminish ANYONE. ShazzieB Mar 2023 #43

It's never a good idea to use logic to dismiss other peoples' feelings Bucky Mar 2023 #115

That's a matter of opinion. ShazzieB Mar 2023 #131

Not everybody who is pregnant identifies as a woman. yardwork Mar 2023 #109

"doesn't hurt anybody to use inclusive terms" Sorry, but it does Bucky Mar 2023 #116

The only place these phrases are being used is in the context of specific medical care. yardwork Mar 2023 #120

Again, I have to disagree Bucky Mar 2023 #124

This is a right wing trick designed to make people dislike Joe Biden. yardwork Mar 2023 #126

I believe their agenda is quite a bit broader than that Bucky Mar 2023 #127

Why can't she decide what she wants to be called? Dr. Strange Mar 2023 #8

She can be called personally whatever she wants and I would of course respect that Mad_Machine76 Mar 2023 #9

well, I think we should and can be inclusive without ignoring that pregnancy is overwhelmingly an hlthe2b Mar 2023 #2

This is quite illogical. ShazzieB Mar 2023 #33

This message was self-deleted by its author hlthe2b Mar 2023 #34

Please do not put words in my mouth. ShazzieB Mar 2023 #40

Post removed Post removed Mar 2023 #41

You can think whatever you want. ShazzieB Mar 2023 #57

This message was self-deleted by its author hlthe2b Mar 2023 #58

Wow, you really have a unique and imaginative way of putting words in people's mouths! 😂 ShazzieB Mar 2023 #67

This message was self-deleted by its author hlthe2b Mar 2023 #70

I haven't attacked ANYONE for ANYTHING. ShazzieB Mar 2023 #100

Thank you for standing up for the truth. LostOne4Ever Mar 2023 #81

Thank you. You have said this better than I. BlackSkimmer Mar 2023 #44

Except no one is trying to decide anything like that obamanut2012 Mar 2023 #141

The term is transgender, not transgendered. yardwork Mar 2023 #110

All the TYT people are trolls. dawg Mar 2023 #4

So so true. nt MrsCoffee Mar 2023 #89

In my opinion, Ana was a true believer of hateful anti-Democratic conspiracy theories/propaganda betsuni Mar 2023 #94

Never really thought too much about this but I think this is correct JI7 Mar 2023 #136

"I'm shocked by that result": Cenk on his TYT audience polling, 80% would not vote for Hillary. betsuni Mar 2023 #137

I'd never heard of her before, but that explains a lot. yardwork Mar 2023 #111

Learned a new term, TERF, trans-exclusionary radical feminist oregonjen Mar 2023 #5

This message was self-deleted by its author hlthe2b Mar 2023 #6

I don't know about that oregonjen Mar 2023 #7

This message was self-deleted by its author hlthe2b Mar 2023 #10

Wow, you're snarky. No, it's about people not being inclusive. JK Rowling was just an example that oregonjen Mar 2023 #11

This message was self-deleted by its author hlthe2b Mar 2023 #12

how is the term that describes a subset DonCoquixote Mar 2023 #14

This message was self-deleted by its author hlthe2b Mar 2023 #15

snark does not communicate your point well DonCoquixote Mar 2023 #16

This message was self-deleted by its author hlthe2b Mar 2023 #18

asking for you to explain your logic DonCoquixote Mar 2023 #19

This message was self-deleted by its author hlthe2b Mar 2023 #20

It is relatively new but not a "nasty new acronym" Caliman73 Mar 2023 #30

Thanks for this, especially the links. ShazzieB Mar 2023 #35

I think assigned male comics showed this very well LostOne4Ever Mar 2023 #76

Please show me where Rowling said she "hates" trans folk? BlackSkimmer Mar 2023 #45

here ya go DonCoquixote Mar 2023 #79

Don't expect a response... Violet_Crumble Mar 2023 #105

I have read Rowling's comments. BlackSkimmer Mar 2023 #25

She 'spews' indirect bigotry against trans people.... Violet_Crumble Mar 2023 #39

My Millennial kids feel the same way about JK Rowling. yardwork Mar 2023 #112

. WhiskeyGrinder Mar 2023 #21

Thank you. BlackSkimmer Mar 2023 #24

TERFs are bad feminists - especially the ones who ally with the far / Christian right. Oneironaut Mar 2023 #42

I find it difficult to believe that Rowling supports a far-right Christian organization. BlackSkimmer Mar 2023 #46

Oh yes. She very much does. Oneironaut Mar 2023 #47

Well, I'll have to research that. I will do so, and thanks for the info. BlackSkimmer Mar 2023 #50

Why can't it be discussed? Violet_Crumble Mar 2023 #54

EarlG put his foot down on advocacy of discrimination against trans individuals. Ms. Toad Mar 2023 #85

This message was self-deleted by its author hlthe2b Mar 2023 #95

Yes. Well said again. BlackSkimmer Mar 2023 #96

JFC just stop obamanut2012 Mar 2023 #143

we know who does support people DonCoquixote Mar 2023 #99

Seiously, many of teh non-hidden posts in thsi thraed are as bad obamanut2012 Mar 2023 #142

Actually, there are a number of problematic issues in her books. yardwork Mar 2023 #114

I've encountered a few on Twitter yesterday... Violet_Crumble Mar 2023 #53

I appreciate your post, Violet_Crumble and it is good to see you. hlthe2b Mar 2023 #62

It's good to see you too, old friend.... Violet_Crumble Mar 2023 #106

Post removed Post removed Mar 2023 #144

I'm just ForgedCrank Mar 2023 #65

Yup... hlthe2b Mar 2023 #71

One of the hallmarks of a lot of TERFs LostOne4Ever Mar 2023 #51

Thanks for this link. ShazzieB Mar 2023 #63

Actually some people revel in the term TERF Bucky Mar 2023 #121

Anyone who identifies themselves as exclusionary of anyone else... Bucky Mar 2023 #117

This has to be about the Biden administration using "birthing people." betsuni Mar 2023 #13

I'm glad you've pinpointed that this has nothing to do with discrimination against transpeople... Violet_Crumble Mar 2023 #104

I know Kasparian, why I say it's about Biden admin. documents referring to "birthing persons." betsuni Mar 2023 #107

I agree with you. yardwork Mar 2023 #128

+1 betsuni Mar 2023 #138

All of those should only be used in a situation where the qualifier is relevant muriel_volestrangler Mar 2023 #17

+1 Celerity Mar 2023 #23

Agreed 100%! ShazzieB Mar 2023 #36

In the absence of a reasonable example, I'm assuming she's just trying to cause trouble. yardwork Mar 2023 #129

Post removed Post removed Mar 2023 #22

Paradoxically, terms like "person with a uterus" and "people who menstruate" are more "inclusive" in WhiskeyGrinder Mar 2023 #48

It is removing the ability of the majority of those who can become pregnant to be referred to as hlthe2b Mar 2023 #56

Again, THANK YOU. BlackSkimmer Mar 2023 #59

. WhiskeyGrinder Mar 2023 #60

This message was self-deleted by its author hlthe2b Mar 2023 #64

I'm with you. I also see the argument that's it's necessary to include trans men. Oneironaut Mar 2023 #66

Not to argue against the inclusive language, but I'd give trans men the benefit of the doubt... Silent3 Mar 2023 #72

+1 leftstreet Mar 2023 #75

Also? WhiskeyGrinder Mar 2023 #49

I agree that it's cringe, but, where have these terms been used? Oneironaut Mar 2023 #52

It's neither cringe nor bone-headed. WhiskeyGrinder Mar 2023 #55

Hard agree. ShazzieB Mar 2023 #102

Yes. Ana and others are taking this out of context to fear-monger. yardwork Mar 2023 #119

Yep. It's working right in this thread. WhiskeyGrinder Mar 2023 #122

It's the third such thread I've seen on DU in recent days. yardwork Mar 2023 #125

Many posts not hidden, too, even though they are supporting TERFs obamanut2012 Mar 2023 #145

Ana Kasparian's ForgedCrank Mar 2023 #61

This message was self-deleted by its author Silent3 Mar 2023 #68

I have mixed feelings about this. On one hand, using language to increase feelings of inclusion... Silent3 Mar 2023 #69

This is a great post. Thank you! lanlady Mar 2023 #73

You said it better than I can Bucky Mar 2023 #118

Thank you. I really got rubbed over someone telling me that Ilsa Mar 2023 #133

I was in a training once where we had to list what our pronouns were and how we identified ourselves Evergreen Emerald Mar 2023 #134

I do not believe this actually happened LostOne4Ever Mar 2023 #139

It actually did happen Evergreen Emerald Mar 2023 #140

When we can call cis men people without a uterus, non birthing person and person who does not boston bean Mar 2023 #74

+1 JustAnotherGen Mar 2023 #77

The correct analogy would be 'people with prostrate issues'. Voltaire2 Mar 2023 #135

My take ecstatic Mar 2023 #78

She fell for the right wing narrative, as to trans individuals - as have a number of people on DU Ms. Toad Mar 2023 #80

This message was self-deleted by its author hlthe2b Mar 2023 #86

No one is telling her she can't identify as a woman. Period. Ms. Toad Mar 2023 #90

This message was self-deleted by its author hlthe2b Mar 2023 #93

Agreed. This is the latest right wing manufactured outrage. yardwork Mar 2023 #130

This message was self-deleted by its author hlthe2b Mar 2023 #87

Not at all. People who are reframing general gender-neutral statements about people whose anatomy Ms. Toad Mar 2023 #91

This message was self-deleted by its author hlthe2b Mar 2023 #92

Where? AZSkiffyGeek Mar 2023 #101

She is being disingenuous LostOne4Ever Mar 2023 #82

Post removed Post removed Mar 2023 #88

Also this is a great response: LostOne4Ever Mar 2023 #83

Post removed Post removed Mar 2023 #84

This is great! ShazzieB Mar 2023 #103

Post removed Post removed Mar 2023 #97

I see an analogy to Black Lives Matter here. Croney Mar 2023 #98

She's way off base. Those terms are used in medical settings. yardwork Mar 2023 #108

Renaming people groups is an exercise in futility. It minimizes their struggles Bucky Mar 2023 #113

Nobody is trying to rename women. yardwork Mar 2023 #123

What's terrific about this issue is it brings people together. BannonsLiver Mar 2023 #132