General Discussion

HiPointDem

(20,729 posts)

71. no, you didn't pay in as a child making minimum wage. jesus christ. you got a full refund.

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 06:30 AM

Nov 2012

because if you were a 'child' you weren't a full-time worker.

social security exists and creates a community of interest that is perfectly aware it has paid SS all during its working life and is willing to fight to keep what it has *paid for*. it's a community that can't be shamed by the rhetoric of the right ('welfare bum' 'leech' 'useless eater') because it has worked and *paid its way* and because everyone who pays in gets something and the benefits to high earners and low earners are (still) not so disproportionate to what they paid in, keeping a unity between high and low earners.

you propose to eliminate that community for some airy-fairy bullshit about people 'coming together' when there is no united community that can't be divided through shame and income.

your proposal is a wet dream for the wingers and fascists. it's been done before, and it failed. as it will always fail.

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Repeat after me - benefit. Ben-e-fit. Benefit. Social Security is a BENEFIT. [View all] jillan Nov 2012 OP

Seriously! JaneyVee Nov 2012 #1

PAID BENEFIT, DAMMIT brush Nov 2012 #30

The only problem is customerserviceguy Nov 2012 #82

that's solvable JUST raise the cap on taxable income... ReallyIAmAnOptimist Nov 2012 #83

That's exactly right. Capital gains too. eom Blanks Nov 2012 #85

Yeah, yeah brush Nov 2012 #84

You should really stop listening to Republicans about debt jeff47 Nov 2012 #109

Bernie Sanders customerserviceguy Nov 2012 #114

So you claim it's impossible to get back to the economy of 1999 or 2000? jeff47 Nov 2012 #115

I think it's highly unlikely customerserviceguy Nov 2012 #126

You're either a boomer with the largest ego I've ever seen, or you're a really poorly informed jeff47 Nov 2012 #127

Why do my statements about the sheer volume of the numbers sound egotistical? customerserviceguy Nov 2012 #143

I saw a documentary that said just that, guy. The baby boomers caused an economy boon. Honeycombe8 Nov 2012 #128

Thanks customerserviceguy Nov 2012 #140

It doesn't take immigration to save SS. Honeycombe8 Nov 2012 #141

Your analysis is correct customerserviceguy Nov 2012 #144

You're wrong. People who have been working over the past several sabrina 1 Nov 2012 #133

Good to hear from you again, it's been awhile customerserviceguy Nov 2012 #145

so you think you are entitled to those benefits? hfojvt Nov 2012 #131

Not sure what you mean? brush Nov 2012 #134

seems to me that if someboyd is entitled to something hfojvt Nov 2012 #135

Entitlement v paid benefit brush Nov 2012 #136

a paid benefit sounds like it has already been paid hfojvt Nov 2012 #137

Entitled is in the 1935 SS law 9 times FogerRox Nov 2012 #103

Actually there is nothing wrong with the word entitlement just means Live and Learn Nov 2012 #2

Except when the GOP wants the President to cut "entitlement" spending before they will agree to jillan Nov 2012 #3

So you really do hate the word Angry Dragon Nov 2012 #9

Not sure how you got that out of what I said. No, I don't Live and Learn Nov 2012 #12

I misread your last sentence Angry Dragon Nov 2012 #19

Unfortunately or otherwise ... you are right, we need to change the word..... meti57b Nov 2012 #80

How about "refund" or "distribution" or "dividend" Delmette Nov 2012 #100

I think they are more open to interpertation than 'insurance' Angry Dragon Nov 2012 #101

What is the title of SS? FogerRox Nov 2012 #107

"Insurance" usually implies that you'll only get paid Art_from_Ark Nov 2012 #130

to repukes, entitlement means "FREE STUFF" Skittles Nov 2012 #25

Unless they are the ones getting it. Live and Learn Nov 2012 #27

CORRECT Skittles Nov 2012 #31

Just what I was about to say. The Rs need to get a freakin' dictionary. But, face it, Dark n Stormy Knight Nov 2012 #37

I think you hit the nail on the head when you added "evil" to "genius" Live and Learn Nov 2012 #39

But I only consider him evil because what he sells is evil, but not the way he sells it. Dark n Stormy Knight Nov 2012 #43

Not sure I need to read that since I already know that. Live and Learn Nov 2012 #46

Maybe not, but it's not a progressive book. It is a marketing book based on the idea of the power of Dark n Stormy Knight Nov 2012 #54

I'll look in to it based on your recommendation. nt Live and Learn Nov 2012 #59

Agreed Sherman A1 Nov 2012 #58

I agree and I'm sick of the left running away from the word. PeaceNikki Nov 2012 #139

Here Here! Dyedinthewoolliberal Nov 2012 #4

I agree we need to re-brand, but only because that word has been demonized. If you paid for a pair Dark n Stormy Knight Nov 2012 #44

It is an INSURANCE POLICY Angry Dragon Nov 2012 #5

Too many syllables for the right wing. jillan Nov 2012 #7

Exactly! Not sure what it says now because I am on a state retirement program in Colorado, but when world wide wally Nov 2012 #41

Fuck "austerity"! No socialization of government debt! Don't pay for Bush's wars and the bailouts! Fire Walk With Me Nov 2012 #6

we paid for it in good faith & we're entitled to it. i don't see how saying 'benefit' makes HiPointDem Nov 2012 #8

+1 nt Live and Learn Nov 2012 #13

I never miss a chance to tell people that SS has close to $3 trillion in bonds, and... reformist2 Nov 2012 #10

Intragovernmental debt is not the same as external debt. n/t PoliticAverse Nov 2012 #34

both are public debt. HiPointDem Nov 2012 #52

I would even better if we admitted it is a WELFARE benefit and got rid of the "insurance" meme Maplegrass Nov 2012 #11

Nothing wrong with the word welfare. Live and Learn Nov 2012 #15

Absolutely right. Maplegrass Nov 2012 #18

You really do have a point. We all do pay (by way of taxes) Live and Learn Nov 2012 #29

no, we don't all pay for welfare. welfare, food stamps etc. are paid through the income tax, HiPointDem Nov 2012 #51

Willing to bet there are relatively few that don't pay income tax ever in their lifetime. nt Live and Learn Nov 2012 #53

paying it 'ever in their lifetime' isn't paying for it. and yeah, there's a significant fraction of HiPointDem Nov 2012 #57

Maybe, your problem is really with thinking people are leeches just because they Live and Learn Nov 2012 #60

it ain't me throwing the poor under the bus, it's our own ruling class. No, my problem is with HiPointDem Nov 2012 #63

Seems to me you are throwing them under the bus to protect Live and Learn Nov 2012 #66

seems to me you are very confused. there is no fucking social contract, seems you don't get it. HiPointDem Nov 2012 #69

Nope, I am suggesting that you stick up for not only what yourself but those Live and Learn Nov 2012 #70

there is no worker 'less fortunate than me' where social security is concerned. the social contract HiPointDem Nov 2012 #72

Wow, really? You imagine yourself to be the least fortunate person in existence? Live and Learn Nov 2012 #75

no, i mean all workers are on an equal footing where SS is concerned. you pay into the system HiPointDem Nov 2012 #76

Absolutely right democrattotheend Nov 2012 #105

I confess the first 2 years of my son's life truedelphi Nov 2012 #93

Social Security is not a welfare program democrattotheend Nov 2012 #104

Your comment is excellent. FogerRox Nov 2012 #122

I think the Rs have redacted that. Dark n Stormy Knight Nov 2012 #45

I think they would love to except that it also pertains to the military Live and Learn Nov 2012 #47

According the them. Their attempts to narrowly define the General Welfare Clause as constrained by Dark n Stormy Knight Nov 2012 #50

absolute hogwash. it's not a welfare benefit and it's survived 75 years intact because it's *not.* HiPointDem Nov 2012 #17

Yeah, because Clinton threw it under the bus due to right-wing pressure. Maplegrass Nov 2012 #22

and he was able to do so because the recipients hadn't paid for it, so no one cared. HiPointDem Nov 2012 #23

How do you know they never paid for it? "Welfare" is a safety net program. Live and Learn Nov 2012 #56

Welfare is funded through income taxes. Most workers pay little if any income tax: top 10% of HiPointDem Nov 2012 #61

Give me a friggen break. I pay quite a bit in income tax and I Live and Learn Nov 2012 #65

maybe you do. most people don't. i *expect* to collect on my social security payments, that's HiPointDem Nov 2012 #67

Most of us will be at their mercy no matter what if we don't come together Live and Learn Nov 2012 #68

no, you didn't pay in as a child making minimum wage. jesus christ. you got a full refund. HiPointDem Nov 2012 #71

Nope, I paid income tax and payroll taxes as a part time worker. Live and Learn Nov 2012 #73

you paid payroll taxes, including social security tax, and didn't get them back. no one gets them HiPointDem Nov 2012 #74

This message was self-deleted by its author Live and Learn Nov 2012 #77

why will you 'never be eligble to recieve a penny from it or medicare'...? BlueMan Votes Nov 2012 #89

Means-testing is the first step to eliminating it. jeff47 Nov 2012 #110

Ladies and Gentlemen, Jeff47 has made the most cogent comment in this thread. This is an example FogerRox Nov 2012 #117

No, it's an investment we all make. nt DCKit Nov 2012 #14

Why not use the word investment for it? democrattotheend Nov 2012 #106

Sorry, but I think of it as the opposite TorchTheWitch Nov 2012 #16

Did you know the word entitled is in the 1935 SS law 9 times? FogerRox Nov 2012 #120

doesn't surprise me TorchTheWitch Nov 2012 #124

Or... I Am ENTITLED To The Investment I Made Into The Social Security Program WillyT Nov 2012 #20

If not, why is Romney entitled to his investment returns? nt Live and Learn Nov 2012 #40

It's both Major Nikon Nov 2012 #21

NO CUTS to Social Security INSURANCE and Medicare and Medicaid. Until AFTER Overseas Nov 2012 #24

Also capital gains tax rates need to be fixed, daleanime Nov 2012 #35

Schumer was on tv saying CuTTING SS was "OFF THE TABLE' Harry Reid, THIS WEEK.. Cha Nov 2012 #26

Damn Skippy! Scruffy Rumbler Nov 2012 #28

It's an entitlement Canuckistanian Nov 2012 #32

Unfortunately the pigs did to the word entitlement the same thing they did to liberal. And for that jillan Nov 2012 #86

Go Jillan sheshe2 Nov 2012 #33

But that's only if you accept their demonizing of the word. Something IS an entitlement because we Dark n Stormy Knight Nov 2012 #49

Dems can on occasion be wrong too. nt Live and Learn Nov 2012 #62

No, really? Dark n Stormy Knight Nov 2012 #96

Actually, you got it wrong. Spitfire of ATJ Nov 2012 #36

Kicked SoapBox Nov 2012 #38

The semantics don't matter so long as people understand how the program works. harmonicon Nov 2012 #42

I think you're dead wrong about that. There really are such things as magic words. Dark n Stormy Knight Nov 2012 #48

I get that that works, but I'm against doing it. harmonicon Nov 2012 #92

I'd be against it if I thought the education thing would work. Too many people just don't want a Dark n Stormy Knight Nov 2012 #97

Honestly, yes, I would rather lose than sacrifice my principles. (nt) harmonicon Nov 2012 #98

paying for others is how you pay for yourself, and a significant percent of retirees continue to HiPointDem Nov 2012 #55

Social Security is a retirement plan Fearless Nov 2012 #64

"ben-e-fit"... kick n rec! nt stlsaxman Nov 2012 #78

Did you know the word entitled is in the 1935 SS law 9 times? FogerRox Nov 2012 #121

Yes- i would suppose it is. because we are "entitled" to the benefits. stlsaxman Nov 2012 #138

I'm entitled to my social security and Medicare benefits. Warren Stupidity Nov 2012 #79

EARNED benefit. unblock Nov 2012 #81

It's a benefit that we are entitled to. Ganja Ninja Nov 2012 #87

Isn't Entitlement in the name of the law when it was first passed back in the 30s? sammytko Nov 2012 #88

Entitled is in the 1935 law 9 times FogerRox Nov 2012 #118

It is an "Earned Entitlement". I bought it, I paid for it, I dam sure am entitled to it. 1-Old-Man Nov 2012 #90

Rich people are entitled libodem Nov 2012 #91

i think you might want to look up what entitlement means... dionysus Nov 2012 #94

You infer the author has a lack of understanding when it comes to the definition of the word FogerRox Nov 2012 #119

To which you are ENTITLED. Sekhmets Daughter Nov 2012 #95

Here here! hrmjustin Nov 2012 #99

SO the fact that entitled is in the 1935 law 9 times doersnt stop you from not thinking? FogerRox Nov 2012 #102

How about calling it an investment? democrattotheend Nov 2012 #108

How about if democrats loudly make the case that it *is* a workers' entitlement, because workers HiPointDem Nov 2012 #111

Except it's not an investment. Recursion Nov 2012 #113

I'm in my late 20's and not holding my breath on that democrattotheend Nov 2012 #123

Actually if you're in you're 20s, it will be in great shape for you Recursion Nov 2012 #125

I think you have misunderstood what "entitlement" means Recursion Nov 2012 #112

Such logic and clarity, and a souind legal foundation too. FogerRox Nov 2012 #116

Didn't Lawrence O'Donnell just call it Socialism? AntiFascist Nov 2012 #129

Wait, I pay for it????? Everytime a childfree conversation comes up on DU I'm told RB TexLa Nov 2012 #132

i don't collect entitlements with you. n/t dionysus Nov 2012 #142