General Discussion

wnylib

(25,355 posts)

86. Very true. Both world wars broke up old empires around the world.

Mon Oct 23, 2023, 01:41 AM

Oct 2023

European empires lasted until the end of WWII, so they claimed parts of the collapsed Ottoman Empire after the first World War. By the end of WWII, there was a rise of national identity and demand for self government in former colonies in Asia, the ME, and Africa.

At the same time, the Holocaust demonstrated the need for a Jewish homeland. Between world wars and after the second one, there were many international discussions about what to do regarding lands formerly ruled by the Ottomans. There were some proposals to make Palestine part of other nations in the region. Palestinians wanted their own identity and land, apart from those regional nations. Britain had already promised, before WWII that the Jews in Palestine could have their own self-governing homeland there. But, Britain also spoke on behalf of a separate nation in Palestine for Muslim Arabs.

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"New Israel" , a not so modest proposal [View all] Pantagruel Oct 2023 OP

This message was self-deleted by its author WarGamer Oct 2023 #1

How in the world is this logical? TexasDem69 Oct 2023 #10

Logical doesn't mean RIGHT or the proper thing to do. WarGamer Oct 2023 #31

Israelis abandoning TexasDem69 Oct 2023 #48

BTW I made an OP a couple days ago asking what if the Palestinian could leave Gaza for new land... WarGamer Oct 2023 #51

No other country will accept Gaza refugees TexasDem69 Oct 2023 #53

Yes but in 2023... it'd be LOGICAL WarGamer Oct 2023 #55

The Palestinians would use their new home as a staging ground to attack Israel Yavin4 Oct 2023 #75

How about we act like all Palestinians aren't Hamas? Cuthbert Allgood Oct 2023 #126

Kind of like ... Straw Man Oct 2023 #156

Well, there were Germans that did all they could to counter the Nazis Cuthbert Allgood Oct 2023 #159

Yes, there were. Straw Man Oct 2023 #163

That wasn't the tone of your original post. Cuthbert Allgood Oct 2023 #167

I think my tone has been consistent. Straw Man Oct 2023 #170

"work for a new governing body to get rid of Hamas" DFW Oct 2023 #183

The Gaza Refugees RobinA Oct 2023 #154

And in this case, it doesn't even mean 'logical'. Abolishinist Oct 2023 #78

Trail of Tears was not voluntary. Also, after removing wnylib Oct 2023 #83

IMO natural immigration to the area would be more like the US treestar Oct 2023 #105

Well, perhaps the word "terrorism" was not used in wnylib Oct 2023 #124

What other country was created by the UN and Britain treestar Oct 2023 #104

So, basically, ethnically clense the region of Jews. Behind the Aegis Oct 2023 #2

Devil's Advocate... what happened in 1947/1948? WarGamer Oct 2023 #8

The ethnic cleansing of Jews in the ME? Behind the Aegis Oct 2023 #11

Devils Advocate means... WarGamer Oct 2023 #22

That is NOT what Devil's Advocate means. Behind the Aegis Oct 2023 #35

I didn't propose it and don't support it. WarGamer Oct 2023 #38

WHATABOUTISM Behind the Aegis Oct 2023 #41

I'm not going to teach a course here... WarGamer Oct 2023 #42

BTW I literally made an OP a few days ago... WarGamer Oct 2023 #44

two reasons... Bucky Oct 2023 #95

I have been H2O Man Oct 2023 #67

Very true. Both world wars broke up old empires around the world. wnylib Oct 2023 #86

I talk with H2O Man Oct 2023 #89

Yup. And regarding Palestine, it looks like Britain was trying to hedge its bets wnylib Oct 2023 #90

Let me interject an idea here. Bet TPTB in 1947-48 wish they could do a "mulligan" (a re-do),... brush Oct 2023 #108

There are a few problems with that. wnylib Oct 2023 #132

Wasn't the idea for Jews from all over to come there? brush Oct 2023 #133

Yes. Here are Israel's policies regarding immigration snd citizenship. wnylib Oct 2023 #139

all true and a fascinating topic. WarGamer Oct 2023 #114

I used to love H2O Man Oct 2023 #117

as you know... WarGamer Oct 2023 #118

The Arabs and Palestinians refused to accept the partition.... Happy Hoosier Oct 2023 #99

That is exactly right. And the elephant in the room is that JohnSJ Oct 2023 #13

Yup. Behind the Aegis Oct 2023 #15

Yes JohnSJ Oct 2023 #17

Well, It Seems RobinA Oct 2023 #161

It is an ulikely proposal to be sure but, Disaffected Oct 2023 #21

"Surely it would be voluntary, not forced." Behind the Aegis Oct 2023 #24

That is one way of looking at it but, Disaffected Oct 2023 #33

It has been used throughout by all parties concerned moniss Oct 2023 #177

Yes, thanks. Some seem to WANT to read the worst into the question. elleng Oct 2023 #34

Yes, sadly the case. Disaffected Oct 2023 #36

Yeah - And, it's not like Israel is a new country. Oneironaut Oct 2023 #68

Do you think... perhaps... it's satire? Beastly Boy Oct 2023 #97

It's been working with Egypt, UAE, Jordan JI7 Oct 2023 #3

Perhaps a small problem: Israel is where Israel is, and not wherever this "New Israel" is RockRaven Oct 2023 #4

This can't be a serious proposal TexasDem69 Oct 2023 #5

Hint: anything riffing off the name "Modest Proposal" intentionally isn't meant to be taken literally Bucky Oct 2023 #96

If we are grading "on the curve", ... stuck in the middle Oct 2023 #111

'a safer location' where? elleng Oct 2023 #6

So, what piece of "land rich" US would you give them? Sogo Oct 2023 #7

The where? Pantagruel Oct 2023 #19

I'm not sure what you expected while advocating to ethnically cleanse Israel of Jews tritsofme Oct 2023 #20

Are You Purposely RobinA Oct 2023 #162

Not sure what to tell you, "outside the box" or not, OP proposes the definition of ethnic cleansing tritsofme Oct 2023 #164

Do you think expecting 8,000,000 people to voluntaruly leave their ancestral homeland is a serious proposal? DemocratSinceBirth Oct 2023 #192

I guess I should have used this smilie: Sogo Oct 2023 #23

Utah makes sense. Maybe the LDS church can persuade the Jews about Jesus. It could work. Kennah Oct 2023 #29

Yeah sure, a Bright Red state will willfully go along, ensuring that they will turn Blue n/t Polybius Oct 2023 #45

If people wanted to live in those places people would be living in them already. Ocelot II Oct 2023 #61

Add mine to make post #6. wnylib Oct 2023 #88

This message was self-deleted by its author DemocratSinceBirth Oct 2023 #175

What happens to Jews who don't want to leave? DemocratSinceBirth Oct 2023 #190

I'd be a little careful here. Disaffected Oct 2023 #9

The question is: LiberaBlueDem Oct 2023 #12

We know what Hamas wants. The extermination of all Jews JohnSJ Oct 2023 #16

Seems you only are addressing HALF of the question. Behind the Aegis Oct 2023 #18

The disingenuousness of some of these replies have been shocking to read. n/t musicblind Oct 2023 #80

What I read inthewind21 Oct 2023 #150

I Read The OP RobinA Oct 2023 #165

You call it impratcial, I call it bigoted. Behind the Aegis Oct 2023 #169

Message auto-removed Name removed Oct 2023 #14

Hey cool let's give the terrorists everything they dream of unblock Oct 2023 #25

Hate to break it to you inthewind21 Oct 2023 #151

Huh? unblock Oct 2023 #174

About 25 percent of Israeli Citizens are non Jewish JI7 Oct 2023 #26

"just looking to logically end this horrible insanity" Earth-shine Oct 2023 #27

"This cannot be brought to an end based solely on reason and rationality." Pantagruel Oct 2023 #47

Perhaps you are just someone who has no attachment to either side or actual knowledge of history. Earth-shine Oct 2023 #50

You got better solutions? Pantagruel Oct 2023 #52

People far more knowledgeable and concerned than you and I have worked on it, and continue to do so. Earth-shine Oct 2023 #59

Huh inthewind21 Oct 2023 #152

You are a day late and a dollar short with this response. Earth-shine Oct 2023 #153

Your solution is akin to the final solution. onenote Oct 2023 #69

I am... speechless Dorian Gray Oct 2023 #91

Imagine there's no countries. stuck in the middle Oct 2023 #197

It Will ONLY RobinA Oct 2023 #168

The hate, attacks, and terrorism have been going on for thousands of years. Who are we to think we can stop it? Earth-shine Oct 2023 #171

Perhaps they could move to outer space (and have lasers) Bucky Oct 2023 #28

No, the lasers are reserved for the sharks to wear on their heads... nt yagotme Oct 2023 #40

That piece of dirt is connected to several of the world's religions, and that's unlikely to change soon Kennah Oct 2023 #30

Perfectly rational. BootinUp Oct 2023 #32

This is an intellectual exercise. Pantagruel Oct 2023 #37

We will all go together ... BootinUp Oct 2023 #56

National Brotherhood Week lapfog_1 Oct 2023 #76

Your intellectual Dorian Gray Oct 2023 #92

This part of the world has been at war with one another for close to 3,000 years. ProudMNDemocrat Oct 2023 #39

Jordan is 55% "Palestinian". sellitman Oct 2023 #43

Is it not the case however that Disaffected Oct 2023 #46

Yes, and people ignore when that is brought up JI7 Oct 2023 #85

This message was self-deleted by its author debm55 Oct 2023 #49

It would be against their will. Just about anyone can leave Israel now. Those that want Silent Type Oct 2023 #54

There will be reasons where any proposed location is not already inhabited, Ocelot II Oct 2023 #57

"land where nobody wants to live" Pantagruel Oct 2023 #60

There is that. calimary Oct 2023 #100

If the scheme depends on global warming to open up land Retrograde Oct 2023 #122

the time for such ideas came and went 75 years ago, maybe more 0rganism Oct 2023 #58

Post removed Post removed Oct 2023 #65

Disagree. It is completely insane. onenote Oct 2023 #70

The idea isn't insane, it's anachronistic 0rganism Oct 2023 #72

Hmmm...how about Madagascar...? First Speaker Oct 2023 #62

Genius. Why didn't someone think of that before? speak easy Oct 2023 #73

There was a proposal to relocate Jews from nazi occupied Europe to Alaska. madaboutharry Oct 2023 #63

Please read Michael Chabon's excellent novel based on this premise! LauraInLA Oct 2023 #82

Didn't Andrew Jackson sarisataka Oct 2023 #64

I think that H2O Man Oct 2023 #66

75 years Pantagruel Oct 2023 #71

Given That Israel Was Originally Carved Out of Palestine T_A Oct 2023 #74

The biggest problem is religion lapfog_1 Oct 2023 #77

The Bible Is Not Reliable T_A Oct 2023 #93

The Old Testament was written in Hebrew. The NT in Greek. Aramaic was a language spoken in the region. (nt) LeftyLucie Oct 2023 #113

Sure T_A Oct 2023 #115

Actually T_A Oct 2023 #137

lol ... can you be more specific? To which "parts" exactly are you referring? LeftyLucie Oct 2023 #155

That Was Just One Of Many T_A Oct 2023 #157

I am unaware of any parts of the Bible being written in Aramaic, so please enlighten me. LeftyLucie Oct 2023 #160

Sorry T_A Oct 2023 #166

So what? Mosby Oct 2023 #178

Indeed T_A Oct 2023 #181

Again, so what? Mosby Oct 2023 #184

We Agree T_A Oct 2023 #185

Palestine was an area not a country. Mosby Oct 2023 #188

Check Post #74 T_A Oct 2023 #194

From his link: lapucelle Oct 2023 #195

And for some odd reason, many of the agenda-driven "histories" of the region lapucelle Oct 2023 #196

The Arab nations rejected a two state approach. onenote Oct 2023 #131

WHO T_A Oct 2023 #136

What nation was this "inside of"? brooklynite Oct 2023 #140

OK T_A Oct 2023 #143

But Palestine "the geography" wasn't Palestine "a State for Palestinians" brooklynite Oct 2023 #145

The Balfour Declaration States "IN PALESTINE" T_A Oct 2023 #146

And what was also "in Palestine" was a home for the Palestinian people. brooklynite Oct 2023 #148

Please don't blame Logic. stuck in the middle Oct 2023 #79

Math problem. Not all "the 400 million Arabs" hate the Israelis. question everything Oct 2023 #81

There are a lot of problems with your proposal LostOne4Ever Oct 2023 #84

A lot more complicated than that. Xolodno Oct 2023 #87

"israel in Africa" was a proposal by the Nazi's... brooklynite Oct 2023 #98

Yes, I remember that one. Xolodno Oct 2023 #134

Uganda was accepted by the 1st Zionist council radicalleft Oct 2023 #173

A New Israel elsewhere has been proposed before. Aussie105 Oct 2023 #94

The center of Australia... inviting? sarisataka Oct 2023 #101

Looks like a problem for which there is no solution. calimary Oct 2023 #102

I don't believe there is. Disaffected Oct 2023 #106

Yep. Sad to say. calimary Oct 2023 #109

That is the crux of the matter. Disaffected Oct 2023 #112

Oh, but you'll love this one... Bucky Oct 2023 #123

Promised Land... Mike Nelson Oct 2023 #103

How about they get repatriated to EUrope WhiteTara Oct 2023 #107

How would you feel about a proposal to "repatriate" Black Americans to Africa? onenote Oct 2023 #142

It's too late now of course WhiteTara Oct 2023 #147

The majority of Jews in Israel are from North Africa. DemocratSinceBirth Oct 2023 #187

REally? Where? I thought WhiteTara Oct 2023 #189

Here DemocratSinceBirth Oct 2023 #191

In Israel Johnny2X2X Oct 2023 #110

Nope. Nosir. Never. Not gon' do it. Bonx Oct 2023 #116

I agree anamnua Oct 2023 #119

Which US state shall we sacrifice? pinkstarburst Oct 2023 #120

The United States of Judea... AntiFascist Oct 2023 #121

Removing Israel destabilizes the region manicdem Oct 2023 #125

a more likely propsale involves flattening the holy sites in jerusalem moonshinegnomie Oct 2023 #127

makes as much sense as bringing back the Ottoman Empire DBoon Oct 2023 #128

And following your "logic" is this what comes next? Relocating American Jews? onenote Oct 2023 #129

Echoes of history sarisataka Oct 2023 #130

I've got a great idea to solve the "Jewish Question"... AZSkiffyGeek Oct 2023 #172

This is not an original thought, however PCIntern Oct 2023 #135

Such out-of-the-box thinking! Now do the US FBaggins Oct 2023 #138

Actually, that was what Liberia was established for. brooklynite Oct 2023 #141

Yep! And did it solve the problem? FBaggins Oct 2023 #158

Absolutely ridiculous. lostnfound Oct 2023 #144

Shades of Madagascar in WWII yankee87 Oct 2023 #149

This message was self-deleted by its author Thinker Cats Oct 2023 #176

You want to put Jews on a resevation. Mosby Oct 2023 #179

Doesn't really matter in the long run. haele Oct 2023 #180

How about Sheldon's idea? Oneironaut Oct 2023 #182

Random points DemocratSinceBirth Oct 2023 #186

What makes you think that they would be happy mercuryblues Oct 2023 #193