General Discussion
In reply to the discussion: You cannot be providing money and weapons for people who have killed [View all]0rganism
(24,112 posts)I assume you reference
>> America's historic and/or hypothetical treatment of neighboring and indigenous populations should not be considered a calibration point for the rest of human civilizations' behavior, for ever and ever
But your question
> Okay, give your prefered "calibration point". One that actually exists.
I could engage with this list ("the Greeks of now or the Greeks of 431 BCE? the Athenians?" ), but to do so is non sequitur. To clarify, the point remains that we should not look only to our past to guide our evaluation of future ethics to come. I believe we can do better, and it is our duty to try to do so. There is no need to compare ourselves to anyone but us relative to our desired outcome, no previous people have existed with the enormous advantages developed in the last 100 years. Our situation is radically different now, and with its privileges will come commensurate challenges and obligations.
I would not wish the ethics of 1920s America upon any indigenous or minority population today, but to disparage those historic qualities is to disregard their context and miss their latent potential for improvement.
If it seems I hold Israel to this higher standard, it is because (a) I have family ties to the country and want it to succeed as a nation-state among global peers, (b) I want Israel seen as a paragon of liberty and compassion rather than an agent of misfortune and despair, and (c) at this point Israel has the most agency in the conflict. Hamas is involved obviously, especially with respect to the fate of hostages, but they are terroristic exterminationists who cannot be trusted to negotiate and they have little control of the overall situation. Israel is in the driver's seat now, and I really want them to do an excellent job. So far, that has not been the case, and I really hope that changes before the conflict spreads further.
So to answer your question,
> Who is this beacon of humanity you lay out as the model that Israel is uniquely required to be measured against?
Only our best selves. We humans of now must become the "calibration point" and be ready to improve on that as time moves along with us. Maybe this is impossible, but impossibilities remain within the domain of hope.
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