General Discussion

MontanaMama

(23,864 posts)

108. We are not talking about men being killed by men.

Tue May 7, 2024, 11:03 PM

May 2024

We are talking about women being killed by men which happens enough that women would rather encounter a bear than a man. The statistics of women being killed by bears favors that interaction by miles compared to women being killed by men. Men that they know, men that they don’t know…it doesn’t matter. Women are killed by men far more often than I am comfortable with.

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Of bears and men: How big does a risk have to be before you "have to" walk around scared? [View all] Silent3 May 2024 OP

In a word leftieNanner May 2024 #1

If you were a woman you'd know the answer. Ocelot II May 2024 #2

Don't forget that even cloistered nuns interact with a priest in a confessional. wnylib May 2024 #109

And worst of all? NanaCat May 2024 #202

I wouldn't say I walk around scared, I walk around prepared. LNM May 2024 #3

There's no animosity here, just wondering how much women are self-terrifying themselves... Silent3 May 2024 #10

This kind of feels like the definition of "mansplaining". Crunchy Frog May 2024 #23

Yes, it does and you're right, we don't care. Brenda May 2024 #214

+1 betsuni May 2024 #221

Deliberate obtuseness is not attractive Hekate May 2024 #28

Please, spell out what I'm being obtuse about Silent3 May 2024 #32

I'd dare say most women Sparkly May 2024 #39

You need to work on your empathy wryter2000 May 2024 #42

So, you do request performative empathy? Silent3 May 2024 #49

"On average, there are 463,634 victims (age 12 or older) of rape and sexual assault each year in the United States." viva la May 2024 #94

This message was self-deleted by its author raccoon May 2024 #192

What do you know about "real world risks" for women? wnylib May 2024 #120

Risk, in the statistical sense, has nothing to do with personal experience Silent3 May 2024 #123

Statistics also fall short of reality. If you don't know that yet, it's time you learned. wnylib May 2024 #170

+1 betsuni May 2024 #178

Co-sign! Dorian Gray May 2024 #195

Well said mcar May 2024 #245

I remember when a man-friend explained to me that menstrual cramps came from being anxious--- viva la May 2024 #126

You have a whole thread of women Dorian Gray May 2024 #194

No, we expect you to, you know... NanaCat May 2024 #207

Dude. As a man, I suggest you stop. Risk is 1:1 for women who are victimized. Caliman73 May 2024 #286

What makes you think MorbidButterflyTat May 2024 #290

You are mansplaining, not being "empathetic. " As you're a DUer since the beginning, I expect more of you. Hekate May 2024 #62

I'm bringing up a tricky topic that I know a lot of people would steer clear of, not "mansplaining" Silent3 May 2024 #66

Or you could, you know, just not say anything about Crunchy Frog May 2024 #124

Why should one feel so afraid to discuss such things? Silent3 May 2024 #138

Why don't you make a new post about how black men should stop exaggerating the risks Crunchy Frog May 2024 #148

If a black man were choosing, say, being in a locked room with a hungry lion rather than an average cop... Silent3 May 2024 #174

You never said anything in your previous posts about being locked in a room with a hungry bear or lion. Crunchy Frog May 2024 #220

Perfect idea. And you know what? ... Hekate May 2024 #302

I've always respected this poster in the past. Crunchy Frog May 2024 #305

OH FOR FUCK'S SAKE NanaCat May 2024 #209

3% can't do that Sucha NastyWoman May 2024 #222

Nobody was asking for any kind of empathy from you Dorian Gray May 2024 #197

If all you can offer when women tell you how bloody-minded NanaCat May 2024 #208

See my post #111. wnylib May 2024 #114

It's mansplaining NanaCat May 2024 #204

+1 betsuni May 2024 #211

Thanks for the mansplaining. NanaCat May 2024 #206

Thank you for your concern. viva la May 2024 #92

Who said anything that has anything to do with this reply of yours? Silent3 May 2024 #96

Oh, never mind. viva la May 2024 #98

The fact that women who have no experience with actual bears MontanaMama May 2024 #105

Actual bears can usually be scared off. When hiking in Glacier Park a few years ago Ocelot II May 2024 #264

Absolutely. MontanaMama May 2024 #280

If you're not female, your real world risks are not the same as a woman's real world experiences wnylib May 2024 #111

Experiences obviously change feelings of fear Silent3 May 2024 #116

Wow. Talk about clueless. You mention one dog attack making wnylib May 2024 #168

Take this all back to the man/bear thing, and risk assessment Silent3 May 2024 #169

Why Dorian Gray May 2024 #198

I wonder about the obsession with bears. Mythology about women marrying bears? betsuni May 2024 #215

I think he's having an emotional response to an online meme Dorian Gray May 2024 #219

Could also be a bear-envy thing. betsuni May 2024 #232

I heard they're really hung MorbidButterflyTat May 2024 #291

There was a bestseller in the 70s about a woman moving out to the woods and having an affair with a bear AZSkiffyGeek May 2024 #308

Will you shut up? NanaCat May 2024 #210

"THE MAN/BEAR THING." betsuni May 2024 #212

Why wouldn't you possible be frightened in either scenario? robbob May 2024 #253

Thank you, wnylib!! TSExile May 2024 #244

I'm so sorry for your experience and the effect that it has had on you. wnylib May 2024 #318

wnylib, you speak for so many of us. Diamond_Dog May 2024 #314

I speak from my own experience, but I know wnylib May 2024 #317

What are you doing? bcbink May 2024 #233

The number of sexual assaults MontanaMama May 2024 #281

It's called Woman's Intuition. Happyone May 2024 #329

At 12 years old Dorian Gray May 2024 #193

But ... but ... but ... STATISTICS AND BEARS! We're not only getting worked up about nothing, we're stupid too! betsuni May 2024 #205

I never experienced an assault myself at that age, but Crunchy Frog May 2024 #306

Men are afraid women will laugh at them. 3catwoman3 May 2024 #4

I'm trying to compare real risk vs. what people fear, whatever the odds might be. Silent3 May 2024 #13

Real risk wryter2000 May 2024 #37

I'm specifically refering to "stranger danger" Silent3 May 2024 #44

Then, there's your problem wryter2000 May 2024 #59

That's not my problem. That's my POINT. Silent3 May 2024 #71

LADIES! How many have been groped, assaulted, fondled, chased, by a stranger? viva la May 2024 #129

How many bears have you run into in real life? Silent3 May 2024 #136

As a matter of fact, I have encountered a couple grizzlies-- viva la May 2024 #143

Standing, what, ten feet way from you? Silent3 May 2024 #145

I'm not sure what you are getting at? viva la May 2024 #149

For the actually risk assessment... Silent3 May 2024 #153

Okay, for the lulz, let me point out that we don't usually let bears on the subway. viva la May 2024 #158

The internet man/bear discussion is all about Silent3 May 2024 #161

I spent every day of ages 10-mid-50s NanaCat May 2024 #223

+1 betsuni May 2024 #226

20% of sexual assaults are at the hands of a stranger. Scrivener7 May 2024 #65

While a young lady in college Texasgal May 2024 #321

And "being killed" is not the only risk. viva la May 2024 #100

Women are routinely harassed, raped, and/or killed. What do you want? Prurient details? Hm? Hekate May 2024 #47

You're off on your own agenda... Silent3 May 2024 #166

That's what I'm suspecting. MorbidButterflyTat May 2024 #293

Further down I do ask... Hekate May 2024 #296

How about statistics on domestic abuse, rape or other sexual spooky3 May 2024 #48

Those are thing things I contrasted to "stranger danger" as more truly risky Silent3 May 2024 #51

When are you going to "get it" that this question is not literally spooky3 May 2024 #58

My OP clearly makes in plain I'm talking about the "degree to which women reasonably feel unsafe" Silent3 May 2024 #106

What makes you think you know anything about the degree to which women feel unsafe? Scrivener7 May 2024 #131

And overcoming a confrontational, hostile approach to this discussion... Silent3 May 2024 #134

So you've heard women talk about feeling unsafe and you figured you'd school all of us about Scrivener7 May 2024 #137

My OP isn't "schooling" anyone about anything Silent3 May 2024 #139

Yep. You're right. I do have you pegged. Scrivener7 May 2024 #142

So, what's the point of discussing anything with someone who takes that attitude? Silent3 May 2024 #156

I'm guessing you don't see the irony in your post. Scrivener7 May 2024 #157

Likewise, I'm sure. n/t Silent3 May 2024 #159

We are not talking about men being killed by men. MontanaMama May 2024 #108

Common denominator in your post? North Shore Chicago May 2024 #196

You might want to just stop with this thread and just fucking listen. Cuthbert Allgood May 2024 #265

I'll listen to responses which address what I actually said... Silent3 May 2024 #267

OK, here's another clue for you. Cuthbert Allgood May 2024 #270

Nope Silent3 May 2024 #273

I knew some people enjoyed the taste of sand Dorian Gray May 2024 #275

You said that women are walking around with unnecessary fear Dorian Gray May 2024 #274

While the majority of homicide victims are men killed by strangers, MontanaMama May 2024 #283

SO. WHAT. MorbidButterflyTat May 2024 #292

Years ago, when I worked nights... TSExile May 2024 #5

There's certainly nothing wrong with being prepared Silent3 May 2024 #15

What level of fear is acceptable to you? And where are you seeing Scrivener7 May 2024 #19

It has nothing to do with what's acceptible to me Silent3 May 2024 #26

So this is you "talking us down?" Seriously dude, I think you don't understand just Scrivener7 May 2024 #35

There's not a single thing I said against talking precautions Silent3 May 2024 #107

The things on which you have based this whole discussion on, the man vs. bear discussion and the Scrivener7 May 2024 #115

"You are the one who made the irrational assumption that women's use of precautions amount to a 'self-torment'" Silent3 May 2024 #118

Nope. It's not. It's you making the irrational assumption that the precautions women take Scrivener7 May 2024 #122

Nope, you're adding a layer of meaning that isn't there. Silent3 May 2024 #127

Nope. I'm not. The man vs. bear discussion is about choosing a lesser danger. The Scrivener7 May 2024 #130

Outsized fears? TSExile May 2024 #25

But isn't that like suffering PTSD? Silent3 May 2024 #30

But MANY of us have experienced that and/or other violence from men. Sparkly May 2024 #45

No, it's not. She reasonably is concerned that spooky3 May 2024 #53

What about my position is "indefensible"? Silent3 May 2024 #63

Do you understand that this is a cruel and disgusting comment to make to a victim Scrivener7 May 2024 #55

They do not understand MontanaMama May 2024 #112

What bothers me most is that I think he DOES fully understand. Scrivener7 May 2024 #117

Indeed. MontanaMama May 2024 #135

You're exaggerating the fear Dorian Gray May 2024 #200

Back during the gender wars on DU, some women said they assume Scrivener7 May 2024 #6

Heck, Laz said he'd prefer to meet a bear than a lone man in the woods. haele May 2024 #64

I'd rather face the bear NanaCat May 2024 #225

Previous to this thread, I was one of the few who said the man, but now I want to make a caveat: not the OP. Scrivener7 May 2024 #254

hah! Dorian Gray May 2024 #276

What percent of women have been assaulted by a man at some point in their life? RockRaven May 2024 #7

Yes, but we're not allowed to "get all worked up about it." Scrivener7 May 2024 #8

The question is assault out of the blue in the kind of situation the bear/man thing is about. n/t Silent3 May 2024 #14

And how many women have been assaulted by a bear NanaCat May 2024 #227

When asked, a good number of men choose the bear, too. -nt CrispyQ May 2024 #9

Besides... TSExile May 2024 #11

I have never actually done any of those things. PoindexterOglethorpe May 2024 #12

Thank you for being one of the few women who doesn't see my post itself as an attack Silent3 May 2024 #17

I haven't seen anyone demonizing men, but the risks are absolutely real. Crunchy Frog May 2024 #16

I don't think either of us has real stats here... no sure where I'd even look for them Silent3 May 2024 #21

I honestly just don't care what your opinion is on this subject. Crunchy Frog May 2024 #27

Oh, but he's "talking us down" from our irrational "self-torment" doncha know? Scrivener7 May 2024 #61

Oh, you know how we wimmenfolk get... Sky Jewels May 2024 #181

Men just don't know the fear because they feel reasonably safe everywhere they go. Diamond_Dog May 2024 #18

And let's just realize that someone who thinks this way on a jury-- or a judge at the trial viva la May 2024 #103

All it takes is that one time being there in that place, that time when the opportunity presents itself to a predator. betsuni May 2024 #155

To help you understand- MOMFUDSKI May 2024 #20

But I also have to imagine how likely it is that a foot-taller man is going to grab me Silent3 May 2024 #22

You do not understand the social construct of gender Sparkly May 2024 #50

I'm a little confused. Sparkly May 2024 #24

The question going around the internet is about meeting a bear vs. meeting a man while alone in the woods Silent3 May 2024 #38

You do know that? Sparkly May 2024 #52

It's in the stats Silent3 May 2024 #56

Please explain? Sparkly May 2024 #69

Someone else said 20% for self-reported Silent3 May 2024 #73

Perhaps you could share a link to these stats? Sparkly May 2024 #75

Here's on thing I just re-found Silent3 May 2024 #78

This says 93% of JUVENILE victims knew the perps. Sparkly May 2024 #83

I'm not sure where you're coming from Silent3 May 2024 #87

Oh Kay. Sparkly May 2024 #95

Don't bother with the sexist mansplainer NanaCat May 2024 #228

Women have been murdered in parks mainer May 2024 #29

Men have been murdered in parks too, but don't live in great fear of it Silent3 May 2024 #34

Is there a certain level of assault by strangers in one's home, on a campus, and/or in a public place Sparkly May 2024 #57

Of course there isn't NanaCat May 2024 #229

This quote lets me know that you need help JanMichael May 2024 #31

Oh, I knew I'd come across as tone-deaf to many Silent3 May 2024 #33

Did you take precautions during COVID? If so, why did you do that? Scrivener7 May 2024 #41

Congratulations then. The real world "truth" is that men attack women. JanMichael May 2024 #60

I came here for an argument wryter2000 May 2024 #68

A man who sneers at women's reaction viva la May 2024 #251

It's a woman thing GenThePerservering May 2024 #36

The statistics I've seen say that one in five women will be raped at some point in their lives. thucythucy May 2024 #40

And 45% will experience sexual assault of some kind other than rape. Scrivener7 May 2024 #43

Another stat that I read said 20 percent of MOMFUDSKI May 2024 #54

Not strangers Daylily May 2024 #46

Next stop for this train is GenThePerservering May 2024 #67

There's no "lighten up" message here Silent3 May 2024 #76

I would suggest you go no further GenThePerservering May 2024 #77

This is where DU group-think gets to me Silent3 May 2024 #81

Again, I will ask you: Did you take precautions against Covid before we Scrivener7 May 2024 #82

Wow, you're impatient about that question. Silent3 May 2024 #89

In case you are sincere... Sparkly May 2024 #88

Yes, "free range parenting" is exactly the kind of analogy that fits the kind of point I'm trying to make n/t Silent3 May 2024 #91

Hey, Mr. MRA. Brenda May 2024 #224

He's actually thinking we're all... hysterical, I guess? viva la May 2024 #133

I like pancakes Silent3 May 2024 #144

You obviously get a kick out of trolling women. viva la May 2024 #146

No, I do get a kick out of trolling people who... Silent3 May 2024 #150

Enough. You haven't listened to any of us. You don't care. viva la May 2024 #152

No, I dismiss most of what YOU say Silent3 May 2024 #154

You know, it's almost hilarious how absolutely .... on point you are. viva la May 2024 #162

No, I'm just mildly annoyed by a predictable type of response Silent3 May 2024 #164

You are so viva la May 2024 #171

LOL! The level of your projection is hilarious. Again, I'm going to guess you don't see the irony in this. Scrivener7 May 2024 #213

Deleted viva la May 2024 #249

Viva, check that post again. It's me replying to the mansplainer, not to you. Scrivener7 May 2024 #250

Oh, okay. viva la May 2024 #252

Poor dear. Scrivener7 May 2024 #151

we are maladaptive. bcbink May 2024 #236

I don't know. We might be past that. We've already been told that he is just Scrivener7 May 2024 #80

Women are prey animals mainer May 2024 #70

Interesting discussion. 1WorldHope May 2024 #72

I see you are assiduously avoiding my question about whether you took Scrivener7 May 2024 #74

Not assiduously avoiding, just took that as a rhetorical question, plus having a lot of posts to respond to Silent3 May 2024 #85

So you did take precautions against encountering people who could do damage to you. Scrivener7 May 2024 #90

See this post, "There's certainly nothing wrong with being prepared" Silent3 May 2024 #93

Oh, gracious! We're allowed to be prepared! That's so good of you! Scrivener7 May 2024 #104

In 2020 in Texas BigMin28 May 2024 #79

"but jeez! Men aren't that dangerous!" Oh, really? viva la May 2024 #84

Where do you get "Men aren't that dangerous!" out of the OP? Silent3 May 2024 #101

Please go back and read the end of the original post. viva la May 2024 #110

Women don't "walk around scared"- we are aware of our surroundings and potential predators at every moment ms liberty May 2024 #86

I never said anything about or against simple preparedness Silent3 May 2024 #99

No, it's not about walking around scared. Talk about missing the point! ms liberty May 2024 #119

I'm not sure the stats exist to prove which is riskier, however Silent3 May 2024 #132

I think you've mansplained enough. If you're still this clueless now, you're never gonna get it. ms liberty May 2024 #235

I have done all those things, and I'm a guy. Only a few times, but I have done them. My wife has too, and says her Doodley May 2024 #97

Assault by a male will happen to lone women more often - haele May 2024 #102

You're describing it wrong. Imagine a jogger running with a dog stick ecstatic May 2024 #113

My post has nothing to do with mere precautions Silent3 May 2024 #121

The fear does not kick in until we're confronted with the threat. Not before. ecstatic May 2024 #125

I'm not sure what you mean by "confronted with the threat" Silent3 May 2024 #128

This might be a women are from Venus ecstatic May 2024 #203

Means women are emotional and stupid and "demonize men" for no reason, men are rational and think about STATISTICS. betsuni May 2024 #217

Men teach us to be wary from an early age. nolabear May 2024 #140

I hope it isn't mansplaining ... Straw Man May 2024 #141

Oops! Meant to type black bear Silent3 May 2024 #147

You "don't want to seem callous"??? Then why did you post that niyad May 2024 #160

Nope, no deletion. I usually avoid such topics... Silent3 May 2024 #163

Sadly, I am not in the least surprised. Contrary to your last line, niyad May 2024 #165

So PoindexterOglethorpe didn't get it, like you do, when she replied to me? Silent3 May 2024 #167

You clearly don't care. MontanaMama May 2024 #172

No, I really don't care... Silent3 May 2024 #173

And yet here you are. MontanaMama May 2024 #287

You can't even parse what I said I don't care about correctly. Silent3 May 2024 #289

It's not snark. MontanaMama May 2024 #294

... betsuni May 2024 #324

One woman agreed with you. DOZENS of women and men disagreed with you. Scrivener7 May 2024 #242

Why would anyone get defensive about women's experiences? Women "get all worked up about" "demonizing men"? betsuni May 2024 #175

Who got defensive or worked up? Silent3 May 2024 #176

... betsuni May 2024 #177

Yep, now we come to the meat of the matter mcar May 2024 #247

I know several women who have been raped by males. Sky Jewels May 2024 #179

The sad reality is that men and women inhabit the same spaces very differently. Jedi Guy May 2024 #180

Thank you. "resting axe murderer face" LOL! betsuni May 2024 #190

Yeah, a friend of mine coined the "resting axe murderer face" a while back. Jedi Guy May 2024 #237

+1000! mcar May 2024 #248

Chance of being injured by a bear is 1 in 2.1 million. Chance of a woman being sexually assaulted is 1 in 4. meadowlander May 2024 #182

The bear/man choice is about a single situation in which you will encounter one or the other Silent3 May 2024 #183

Most bears won't automatically attack you either. meadowlander May 2024 #184

The "absurd hypothetical" isn't my absurd hypothetical. It's been making the rounds of the internet. Silent3 May 2024 #186

Oh, well if it's been going around the internet, then I guess we have to engage with it seriously. meadowlander May 2024 #199

Absolutely! Argument reponere Meme is enshrined in most Citical Thought text books (3rd editions and up) Torchlight May 2024 #322

#NotAllBear/Mans betsuni May 2024 #185

I was fully aware some people wouldn't be able to resist applying that lens Silent3 May 2024 #187

"lens" betsuni May 2024 #188

Do you require help with the metaphor? Silent3 May 2024 #189

... betsuni May 2024 #191

That wasn't in your OP or in your 1st scores of reply posts. Crunchy Frog May 2024 #218

Chance of being sexually assaulted by a bear is also far less than that of being mauled by a man. PeaceWave May 2024 #297

TBF NanaCat May 2024 #201

This reads like a man wrote it. tazkcmo May 2024 #216

Well, you have a brain and are capable of empathy NanaCat May 2024 #231

It's the bear because women are telling you it's the bear. A_Woman_from_MI May 2024 #230

That vid is excellent. Thanks. spooky3 May 2024 #238

Don't know who this guy is but that is excellent. Brenda May 2024 #239

I had to go back to watch it again Easterncedar May 2024 #325

Does a deer walk around scared? How about a mountain lion? mainer May 2024 #234

The first rule of holes... Patton French May 2024 #240

Unfortunately, there are those who ignore that important advice. TSExile May 2024 #241

Yes, men are that dangerous. ismnotwasm May 2024 #243

Risk is in the eye of the beholder mcar May 2024 #246

Feeling of risk is in the eye of the beholder, yes. Silent3 May 2024 #255

Being in an airplane or car crash or a fire is horrible, but it's death. Being raped or murdered is torture betsuni May 2024 #257

And that had to do with accuracy of risk assessment how? Silent3 May 2024 #258

STATISTICALLY what now? betsuni May 2024 #260

This is devolving into mish mash mcar May 2024 #262

Mission accomplished! betsuni May 2024 #266

I wish you had spent about Dorian Gray May 2024 #277

If non-fatal aviation mishaps occurred every day (and actually they do), Ocelot II May 2024 #259

Apples and oranges mcar May 2024 #261

How so? Silent3 May 2024 #263

I'll take limbicnuminousity May 2024 #256

Privilege can be defined as "shit you don't have to put up with." Ocelot II May 2024 #269

And then having the gall to tell women to not be so afraid Sky Jewels May 2024 #271

Just want to take this opportunity to say I'm sorry. Cuthbert Allgood May 2024 #268

Facebook algorithm just offered me this Cuthbert Allgood May 2024 #272

Never ran into a bear outside of a zoo. Torchlight May 2024 #278

Great discussion. Do you use a purse seine or a drift net to catch those bears? Hekate May 2024 #279

I live where there are bears. I never put my trash out the night before pickup. mjvpi May 2024 #282

The "Thought Experiment" is completely absurd CelticCrow May 2024 #284

So, I honestly had no idea where the stuff on this post was coming from, Crunchy Frog May 2024 #285

"Men aren't that dangerous"?? thucythucy May 2024 #288

Sadly, young men and boys need to be educated... PeaceWave May 2024 #295

. MorbidButterflyTat May 2024 #299

Such orthodoxy. Torchlight May 2024 #300

Young men and boys need to be educated not to rape thucythucy May 2024 #327

What is the point of this? MorbidButterflyTat May 2024 #298

Christ, this place has been dumb lately... róisín_dubh May 2024 #301

Top 10 Most Unnecessary OPs Ever ProfessorGAC May 2024 #303

I realized early on that what he really wants is prurient details. I suggest people stop giving them to him.... Hekate May 2024 #310

Hence My Use Of The Word... ProfessorGAC May 2024 #312

Yup Hekate May 2024 #313

Cool story, bro Hekate May 2024 #304

I learned early Marthe48 May 2024 #307

The male human animal or the animal type genus Ursus? The human male. Easier to gut. If necessary, of course. Solly Mack May 2024 #309

You go, girl Hekate May 2024 #311

Nobody here seems to give a damn what the bear wants... PeaceWave May 2024 #315

Did you forget your sarcasm thingy? Hekate May 2024 #316

He's one of those "trying way too hard" types. Scrivener7 May 2024 #319

Let me just say this as a man BannonsLiver May 2024 #320

Bear chowder66 May 2024 #323

Every single one. SweetT May 2024 #326

Damn. Thought I had trashed this thread. And blocked the OP Nittersing May 2024 #328

My attitude is on display at the bottom of every post I make. nocoincidences May 2024 #330

The irony here is that a mountain lion screaming sounds very much like a woman in danger. PeaceWave May 2024 #331

Replied in wrong thread Hekate May 2024 #332

Caption time: demmiblue May 2024 #333