General Discussion

gollygee

(22,336 posts)

16. Thank you for those links!

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 09:22 AM

Dec 2012

Interesting quote:

But if you think about it even for a minute, you realize that the one thing the companies that make up the prison-industrial complex — companies like Community Education or the private-prison giant Corrections Corporation of America — are definitely not doing is competing in a free market. They are, instead, living off government contracts. There isn’t any market here, and there is, therefore, no reason to expect any magical gains in efficiency.

True of schools too. If everyone has to go to school, and every charter school is from the same corporation (which in a smaller city like mine would be likely), there is no competition.

Also, unless charter schools and public schools have the same rules and requirements, they aren't competing in a fair way.

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Any time you hear the word "privatization", you should be scared [View all] gollygee Dec 2012 OP

exactly! eom ellenfl Dec 2012 #1

Privatization - or how my sister became a Democrat. SharonAnn Dec 2012 #63

they're getting sneakier... Locrian Dec 2012 #142

From today's Thom Hartmann radio show: "Is public education going the way of public housing?" alp227 Dec 2012 #132

There have been many studies showing public services can be provided more effectively and jody Dec 2012 #2

there have been many more studies showing the opposite. and there is the evidence of our own HiPointDem Dec 2012 #5

Please cite a study supporting your assertion re "military contracting systems being exhibit A." nt jody Dec 2012 #9

Are the companies being awarded contracts Lars39 Dec 2012 #13

Please clarify your question. nt jody Dec 2012 #20

Please answer the question. Lars39 Dec 2012 #21

LOL have a great day. nt jody Dec 2012 #24

A lack of decent affordable healthcare and pensions Lars39 Dec 2012 #39

Here's the list of the federal contractors' number of fraud convictions Overseas Dec 2012 #150

Thanks. This thread is about service contracts. There were perhaps a dozen Poor Contract jody Dec 2012 #151

The privatization of military services has been a failure in terms of cost and quality. Overseas Dec 2012 #152

Yes but service contracts on permanent military sites have been successful. nt jody Dec 2012 #153

Are you familiar with performance based service contracts used by the federal government? The name jody Dec 2012 #15

are you familiar with 'no-bid' contracts? black budgets? HiPointDem Dec 2012 #35

Yes intimately familiar. nt jody Dec 2012 #68

The problem with privatization is that you are dealing with corporations. JDPriestly Dec 2012 #42

Please read A-76 and tell me where it is wrong. nt jody Dec 2012 #69

Education is neither a product nor a service, but is properly termed a social imperative. Occulus Dec 2012 #57

Sorry but in terms of contracts the accepted terms are either product or service. nt jody Dec 2012 #71

Ring! Ring! Ring! Occulus Dec 2012 #80

I've noticed that this particular cat doesn't like being belled. GoneOffShore Dec 2012 #77

Yes but can you cite studies that prove the cat doesn't like to be belled? And if you can, then Squinch Dec 2012 #127

Excellent! But GoneOffShore Dec 2012 #136

It's TROLL CAT!!! Squinch Dec 2012 #148

Carter was a neo-liberal. This was widely known. His failed policies led to the election of Reagan. AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2012 #11

That neo-Liberalism has caught on with Republicans. Baitball Blogger Dec 2012 #41

Charter schools don't have to provide busing or special ed gollygee Dec 2012 #14

I've read several state's laws for charter schools. IMO it's up to the state to declare what a jody Dec 2012 #17

There is a pattern of privatization gollygee Dec 2012 #19

Then you oppose the Presidents policies to contract out services under Circular A-76. jody Dec 2012 #22

I am opposed to any neo-liberal privatization schemes. nt gollygee Dec 2012 #23

Are you unable to say you oppose Obama's policies under A-76? A simple yes or no is easy. nt jody Dec 2012 #26

I haven't read that and I have no intention to gollygee Dec 2012 #27

You don't know what I like or dislike. I do dislike ignorance and like facts. nt jody Dec 2012 #29

It's my understanding that defense contractors are exempted duhneece Dec 2012 #30

"defense contractors are exempted" from what? Please explain. nt jody Dec 2012 #31

Defense contractors have no-bid, cost-plus contracts to supply meals, security, other duhneece Dec 2012 #32

Agree but contracts for services at permanent bases do not have those problems. nt jody Dec 2012 #62

I used to write grants including grants for public money. JDPriestly Dec 2012 #75

You and several million other people can claim they wrote grants. You do know that grants have jody Dec 2012 #97

Quite a few changes resulted from the A-76 fuckup at Walter Reed Major Nikon Dec 2012 #46

I never said A-76 is a panacea. I pointed out it's a president's policy for "privatization" that the jody Dec 2012 #101

I appears as if you are suggesting that anyone who opposes A-76, opposes Obama Major Nikon Dec 2012 #115

I believe Obama wants to revise A-76 has have previous presidents. He's also being pressured by the jody Dec 2012 #119

Not just Obama, and that is exactly what is happening right now Major Nikon Dec 2012 #123

From my experience the problem is not the policies in A-76 nor the FAR & DAR. It's the people who jody Dec 2012 #129

Yes. I oppose many things that the Obama administration does. JDPriestly Dec 2012 #44

While it may be true the OMB circulars are technically presidents' policies... Major Nikon Dec 2012 #55

Sorry but you are wrong. There are thousands of service contracts that function very effectively and jody Dec 2012 #67

That has nothing to do with what I posted Major Nikon Dec 2012 #70

Your following statement is wrong. jody Dec 2012 #72

Just because you don't agree, doesn't mean I'm wrong Major Nikon Dec 2012 #73

The Poster In Question Thinks Anyone Who Disagrees Is Wrong HangOnKids Dec 2012 #82

A case of investing too heavily in one's own bullshit? Major Nikon Dec 2012 #83

Well you do have a POINT! n/t HangOnKids Dec 2012 #85

I wasn't the first to come up with the concept, unfortunately Major Nikon Dec 2012 #86

With few exceptions, necessary public services should not be privatized duhneece Dec 2012 #25

Then you oppose presidents' policies under A-76? See other posts in this thread for the circular. nt jody Dec 2012 #28

Fact is, after decades of privatization favored more by Republicans than Democrats, JDPriestly Dec 2012 #34

+1,000 to what you said! freshwest Dec 2012 #40

You need to study the issue more thoroughly before you reject contracting out. The issue is much to jody Dec 2012 #64

I'm 69 and I read a lot of history. JDPriestly Dec 2012 #74

I've also read lots of history. Does the Democratic Party Platform oppose "privatizers" if they as a jody Dec 2012 #87

Not if we have the very corporations that profit from these contracts are running our JDPriestly Dec 2012 #109

Who is defending corporations? Not I! nt jody Dec 2012 #111

Republican. Occulus Dec 2012 #50

and which public services Dyedinthewoolliberal Dec 2012 #51

You're not going to get an answer if the earlier part of this discussion is any indicator. GoneOffShore Dec 2012 #59

Go to any military base and the odds are its morale, recreation, and welfare units are operated by jody Dec 2012 #66

But that fact, in and of itself, Dyedinthewoolliberal Dec 2012 #76

Federal contracts for services are supposed to meet acquisition regulations that focus on jody Dec 2012 #92

if by organic you mean, in this case, Dyedinthewoolliberal Dec 2012 #130

You Have Been To Military Bases jody? HangOnKids Dec 2012 #84

I've been to military bases. Have you? nt jody Dec 2012 #90

My Late Father Was A Flag Officer In The US Navy I Grew Up On Base HangOnKids Dec 2012 #91

OK but neither your experience nor mine has anything to do with the issue under discussion. Why did jody Dec 2012 #94

Oh It matters a great deal. Are you Military? Or Contractor? HangOnKids Dec 2012 #96

How does a Navy father and F-14 pilot give you even the most rudimentary knowledge of the FAR & DAR? jody Dec 2012 #106

You Have NO Idea What I Do For A Living HangOnKids Dec 2012 #107

You really have gotten in over your head haven't you because you don't know about FAR & DAR. nt jody Dec 2012 #110

Are you Civilian or Military jody? HangOnKids Dec 2012 #93

my dad was a civil servant and disabled vet newspeak Dec 2012 #146

Indeed! HangOnKids Dec 2012 #147

This message was self-deleted by its author devilgrrl Dec 2012 #81

Well said - And do you need more butter for that? GoneOffShore Dec 2012 #88

Still Waiting On jody To Explain His Expertise On Military Functioning HangOnKids Dec 2012 #98

This message was self-deleted by its author devilgrrl Dec 2012 #99

Thank You HangOnKids Dec 2012 #100

Scoot over. geardaddy Dec 2012 #102

K&R forestpath Dec 2012 #112

No, there aren't. What there is, is an often repeated lie that pubic services are provided more Egalitarian Thug Dec 2012 #135

I did not say the presidential policy at the link proved anything. I said "One obvious set of jody Dec 2012 #139

The proposition that private is better than public is still a lie. And you are the one that is Egalitarian Thug Dec 2012 #143

Only someone who is uninformed on the issue would allege a "lie". Have a great day and goodbye. nt jody Dec 2012 #144

IOW, you got nothing. 30+ posts with nary a fact. Egalitarian Thug Dec 2012 #145

+100. I don't think the public always appreciates how much of the 'bad' is mandated from above. HiPointDem Dec 2012 #3

I had this figured out years ago RC Dec 2012 #4

some don't see it because they're not informed enough, having just heard the propaganda about HiPointDem Dec 2012 #7

And some don't see it because they think the school board knows what it is doing. RC Dec 2012 #60

that's just a subset of lack of information. most people have no idea what anyone who represents HiPointDem Dec 2012 #61

As Noam Chomsky said: marmar Dec 2012 #6

Chomsky is wrong for federal services contracted out under Circular A-76. nt jody Dec 2012 #10

In theory theory and practice are identical.. Fumesucker Dec 2012 #79

A-76 is no more theory than any other statement of policy published by the executive branch. The jody Dec 2012 #89

I'm of the opinion that policy should work effectively in the real world Fumesucker Dec 2012 #103

Agree and policies like A-76 have evolved over decades under Democrats and Republican presidents. jody Dec 2012 #108

Are you arguing that the one has nothing to do with the other? Fumesucker Dec 2012 #113

Re subject question, answer "no". The OP made a blanket condemnation of privatization and IMO that's jody Dec 2012 #114

Fed Ex and UPS packages are routed through the USPS system regularly Fumesucker Dec 2012 #116

I stated USPS Express Mail goes via FedEx. That's privatization pure and simple. I understand the jody Dec 2012 #118

I'm glad we see eye to eye on this matter Fumesucker Dec 2012 #120

I thought we did. Have a great evening. nt jody Dec 2012 #122

+ 1,000. Profit adds a layer of cost where there should be none in health, education and utilities. freshwest Dec 2012 #43

Another point: at least theoretically, the gov. is more directly answerable to voters. snot Dec 2012 #53

Thanks to Arne Duncan, the Sec of Ed, there are those who are now harvesting public assets. AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2012 #8

For real-life examples of privatization hell, look to NJ ProSense Dec 2012 #12

Thank you for those links! gollygee Dec 2012 #16

Totally agree abelenkpe Dec 2012 #18

I've even seen it in 'Behavioral Health Administration' duhneece Dec 2012 #33

If the Republicans/Corporate Overlords want to dismantle avebury Dec 2012 #36

yup, some things should not be driven by the profit motive quinnox Dec 2012 #37

that's why i call it "piratization". it's glorified looting of the treasury. unblock Dec 2012 #38

You know when I was a little girl and my daddy was in the military we lived on base. southernyankeebelle Dec 2012 #45

Excellent info, southernyahkeebelle. That's just another way we shortchange our troops nowadays :( We People Dec 2012 #117

The true distruction started under Reagan. He started with the union breakdown then letting southernyankeebelle Dec 2012 #121

I hope the democrats listen to this wake up call liberal_at_heart Dec 2012 #47

Lots of Dems voted for Issa's Post Office destruction efforts in 2006. cyclezealot Dec 2012 #48

Word at the time was that it was a Hobson's choice Occulus Dec 2012 #95

There's a song that says the same when your bosses call you a "team" Bucky Dec 2012 #49

''Piratization'' Octafish Dec 2012 #52

piratization...niiiice! nashville_brook Dec 2012 #124

ENRON was getting ready to piratize H2O itself. Octafish Dec 2012 #125

If there were a way to hook us up to masks and meter the air we took in and let out each day gollygee Dec 2012 #126

As a Public Employee, RoccoR5955 Dec 2012 #54

I'd like to see more "deprivatization." hunter Dec 2012 #56

yes be scared, they did it with the private prisons. The contracts broke states of their tax money. Sunlei Dec 2012 #58

DURec leftstreet Dec 2012 #65

You've got it right despite some anti-government services cheerleaders here. GoneOffShore Dec 2012 #78

k&r Starry Messenger Dec 2012 #104

That's exactly what's happening in my school district. We're in fiscal caution now... truth2power Dec 2012 #105

K & R in a large way. Squinch Dec 2012 #128

Things that should NEVER be Privatized in a democracy: bvar22 Dec 2012 #131

Agreed, thank you! snot Dec 2012 #133

Yes, LWolf Dec 2012 #138

We need serious media blitz on the privatization steamroller that the one percent are driving woo me with science Dec 2012 #134

And another kick for this post - Privatization being slightly more important than an GoneOffShore Dec 2012 #137

The Shock Doctrine davidpdx Dec 2012 #140

See my signature gollygee Dec 2012 #141

K & R - An excellent outline of privatization that should be memorized by everyone. Raksha Dec 2012 #149