General Discussion

trotsky

(49,533 posts)

27. Do you have any documentation of the claim in your subject line?

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 04:28 PM

Dec 2012

Everything I've been able to find says that more money was indeed raised under the 50% rate, the reasons for reducing it to 45% do not include Laffer Curve adjustment.

And then there's this:
http://touchstoneblog.org.uk/2012/03/did-the-50p-tax-rate-really-raise-less-than-1-billion-in-201011/

In the event, HMRC data for 2009/10 (the year before the 50p rate was introduced) and 2010/11 (the first year of its existence) appear to show a very large increase in income tax revenue in 2009/10 and a very large drop in 2010/11. This suggests that tax avoidance through ‘forestalling’ (moving taxable income forward from 2010/11 to 2009/10 to pay tax at 40% rather than 50%) inflated tax receipts in 2009/10 and depressed them in 2010/11 (and possibly subsequent years as well). The HMRC report on the impact of the 50p rate shows that total income for individuals with incomes above £150,000 increased from £101.3bn to £115.7bn from 2008/09 to 2009/10 before falling to £87bn in 2010/11 (HMRC, Table 5.1).

Forestalling on this scale makes it pretty much impossible to estimate the ‘long-run’ yield from the 50% tax rate on the basis of the 2009/10 and 2010/11 data alone, because there is no real way of knowing how much of the drop in income in 2010/11 is due to forestalling and how much is due to other, longer run, avoidance factors depressing taxable income, or other behavioural impacts on work by top earners.

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"The rich" are fleeing Britain and France following high tax hikes. [View all] dixiegrrrrl Dec 2012 OP

No travel visas alcibiades_mystery Dec 2012 #1

+1 LiberalLoner Dec 2012 #2

The EU allows free movement between any countries. Nye Bevan Dec 2012 #11

Furthermore, if you leave, you're not allowed to do business in or with the country anymore. backscatter712 Dec 2012 #14

Again, France would have to leave the EU to do this. Nye Bevan Dec 2012 #15

And there is absolutely no legal mechanism to do it anyway. dmallind Dec 2012 #22

The US isn't part of the EU... backscatter712 Dec 2012 #23

True. The US does not have the same constraints that France or any other EU country would have. pampango Dec 2012 #77

Our Supreme Court has repeatedly upheld retroactive taxes. AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2012 #3

Gee, cannot figure out why our government would not use such a handy tool. dixiegrrrrl Dec 2012 #5

They used retroactive laws for the FISA bill. But then, that benefited the wealthy sabrina 1 Dec 2012 #19

I have Long Considered This, Sir, the Most Appropriate Possible Use For Our Country's Military The Magistrate Dec 2012 #6

US Army battalions storming Swiss banks? Nye Bevan Dec 2012 #12

Caymans and Bahama Would Be My First Targets, Sir.... The Magistrate Dec 2012 #26

So JohLast Dec 2012 #33

It Is a Most Traditional Employment Of Armies, Sir The Magistrate Dec 2012 #34

It's a major plot point in David Brin's Earth! hedgehog Dec 2012 #55

Interesting, Ma'am: I Confess I Had Never Heard Of the Fellow The Magistrate Dec 2012 #59

The book was written about 20 years ago, set about 20 years from today - hedgehog Dec 2012 #92

Agreed. We can also stop protecting their trade. TheKentuckian Dec 2012 #64

are you aware that funds in the Caymans and the Bahamas are not "hidden" brokechris Dec 2012 #68

Peddle It Elsewhere, Fella The Magistrate Dec 2012 #76

right. But I actually have British citizenship thru my mum brokechris Dec 2012 #78

When You Demonstrate Some Knowledge Of How Tax Shelters Actually Work, Sir, We Might Talk The Magistrate Dec 2012 #79

I know a bit about tax shelters too--but have never had that kind of money brokechris Dec 2012 #82

AND I still have a current bank account at a Cayman bank brokechris Dec 2012 #80

So many ways that high-income earners can avoid closeupready Dec 2012 #4

I keep waiting to see the line of "Eat the Rich" cooking sauces... Buns_of_Fire Dec 2012 #7

duzy worthy material, there. dixiegrrrrl Dec 2012 #18

Here! Ganja Ninja Dec 2012 #20

ummmmmmmmmmmmm tasty dembotoz Dec 2012 #66

So long, don't let the door hit your butt. nt bemildred Dec 2012 #8

Whatever! Then they were not really French or British; they merely liked the scenery. WinkyDink Dec 2012 #9

So what. It opens a niche for the not rich to become rich. Cleita Dec 2012 #10

Do you advocate for US states being able to do that as well? AlexSatan Dec 2012 #35

We have something like that, for international money changing: Cleita Dec 2012 #40

Two things AlexSatan Dec 2012 #45

If your last contention is true, then why would they be leaving because of higher taxes? I'm really Cleita Dec 2012 #48

Because money made on investments AlexSatan Dec 2012 #61

According to Adam Smith, wealth is created when you make something, so Cleita Dec 2012 #65

Why wouldn't the industrialists AlexSatan Dec 2012 #67

Forget them. I really want to get rid of the bankers and insurance companies and nationalize them. Cleita Dec 2012 #69

How did the Waltons do it illegally? AlexSatan Dec 2012 #74

Did you read my post? I never said illegally. Cleita Dec 2012 #75

My bad AlexSatan Dec 2012 #90

oh boo hoo hoo hfojvt Dec 2012 #13

IMO, those rich who are fleeing Britain and France were making no monetary contribution to their ladjf Dec 2012 #16

Tax receipts went down when the UK raised the top tax rate to 50%. Nye Bevan Dec 2012 #17

Do you have any documentation of the claim in your subject line? trotsky Dec 2012 #27

Good post. Thanks for the input. nt ladjf Dec 2012 #91

If they are not contributing anyhow, let them leave. They are just a burden sabrina 1 Dec 2012 #21

So don't stop at a 75% tax rate, go all the way to 100%. Nye Bevan Dec 2012 #24

And they are contributing to the economy in an irreplaceable way how? Hydra Dec 2012 #28

I'd be willing to stop spending trillions of dollars bailing them out after they sabrina 1 Dec 2012 #29

Are you a republican? abelenkpe Dec 2012 #70

I'm fine with Obama's plan to raise the top rate to 39.6%. Nye Bevan Dec 2012 #86

or Haiti n/t SoCalDem Dec 2012 #50

First, there's no "75% tax rate". It's a temporary add-on for income over $1 million. Income below HiPointDem Dec 2012 #25

I like that. The people really cannot afford to keep these people on welfare sabrina 1 Dec 2012 #30

+1 xchrom Dec 2012 #31

Two high-profile examples AlexSatan Dec 2012 #36

The Depp example isn't really a good one Autumn Colors Dec 2012 #83

depp wasn't paying french taxes in the first place & recently split with his french girlfriend. he HiPointDem Dec 2012 #89

Seize their property? AlexSatan Dec 2012 #37

Don't blame me, I just posted a news article. dixiegrrrrl Dec 2012 #54

didn't mean to blame you -- the press always reports like that, like people are being taxed 75% HiPointDem Dec 2012 #88

So what? They still have to pay French tax on French income. ieoeja Dec 2012 #32

So that's why Johnny Depp moved outta France! MADem Dec 2012 #38

Hard to blame him. MrSlayer Dec 2012 #42

It's been a long while since I spent full tax years outside the US. MADem Dec 2012 #43

And another thing: for every one of them there's a J.K. Rowling closeupready Dec 2012 #39

Except JK Rowling hasn't been hit with 75% taxes yet mainer Dec 2012 #44

But her case does rebut the claim in the thread title, closeupready Dec 2012 #46

Taxes in the UK aren't 75%. mainer Dec 2012 #49

Thread title: ""The rich" are fleeing Britain and France following high tax hikes." closeupready Dec 2012 #52

I was replying to your thread about JK Rowling mainer Dec 2012 #56

You respond to a point I didn't make. closeupready Dec 2012 #62

Of course in Rowling's case, vast income and 'working' are no longer tied. Bluenorthwest Dec 2012 #58

Taxation doesn't differentiate between those actively working and those already wealthy mainer Dec 2012 #72

How do the French define wealthy? Is it $250,000 like in the US? mainer Dec 2012 #41

The linked ariticle gives no proof of the OP claim, this is stupid crap uponit7771 Dec 2012 #47

I assumed people could follow the links in the pages. dixiegrrrrl Dec 2012 #57

14 percent of the French are "poor"? mainer Dec 2012 #73

"Thankfully, few are seeking exile to exempt themselves from being in solidarity with fellow French adirondacker Dec 2012 #85

Singapore is going to run out of room Capt. Obvious Dec 2012 #51

I think people like this should live in the places they put their money... liberalmuse Dec 2012 #53

My Masters Thesis dealt with this 99th_Monkey Dec 2012 #63

Better Fleeing than Fleecing, is what I say. 99th_Monkey Dec 2012 #60

A fact check on the British figures: muriel_volestrangler Dec 2012 #71

It mis time for the industrialized countries to impose sanctions on tax avoidance nations. kelliekat44 Dec 2012 #81

And going where? quakerboy Dec 2012 #84

Perhaps we'd be better off without them. NC_Nurse Dec 2012 #87