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jberryhill

(62,444 posts)

21. It makes no difference that she was a victim

Reply to coalition_unwilling (Reply #16)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 12:56 PM

Dec 2012

The drunk guy driving a car who takes 4 passengers with him to their deaths is also a victim.

What does "properly secure" mean?

That's very simple. You might look up the meaning of the legal term "res ipsa loquitur", Latin for "the thing speaks for itself". http:/en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Res_ipsa_loquitur

It is a principle applied in negligence cases involving inherently dangerous instrumentalities or practices. For example, if your neighbor keeps a tiger in a backyard enclosure, and the tiger gets out and kills people, then we do not get into whether the neighbor properly maintained the enclosure, or whether the enclosure was considered good enough. Liability is established by the fact that the tiger - an inherently dangerous animal - was under the control of the neighbor, but nonetheless got out and killed people, which is precisely what we expect from uncaged tigers.

So, what "properly secure" in this context means is just as simple, "if you have an arsenal, it is up to you to ensure that someone doesn't take the weapons and shoot a bunch of people".

It is not up to us to tell people things like "how to cage your tiger". It is the responsibility of the tiger owner to do it in such a way that the tiger doesn't get out and kill people. Because if it does, they are going to be held liable.

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I just noticed that amongst all the 'blame the parents' and 'arm the teacher' threads [View all] coalition_unwilling Dec 2012 OP

Yes. K&R nt abelenkpe Dec 2012 #1

I second that. nt brush Dec 2012 #81

absolutely. barbtries Dec 2012 #2

Pursuant to this, I am reviewing all the mutual funds in my IRA this week to make coalition_unwilling Dec 2012 #8

i'd like to do the same barbtries Dec 2012 #15

The mutual fund company TRowePrice offers a free tool (called coalition_unwilling Dec 2012 #22

thank you barbtries Dec 2012 #38

Huh? Who's blaming the parents? n/t FourScore Dec 2012 #3

E pluribus unum: coalition_unwilling Dec 2012 #10

Holy crap! Your right! It's like a kind of high-jacking of... 6502 Dec 2012 #71

I am jberryhill Dec 2012 #12

I'm not entirely disagreeing with you but, in this case, with the owner of the firearms coalition_unwilling Dec 2012 #16

It makes no difference that she was a victim jberryhill Dec 2012 #21

Wow, I know enough to know when I am in the presence of an expert and coalition_unwilling Dec 2012 #25

Think of it this way . . . ET Awful Dec 2012 #40

her estate will be sued Kyad06 Dec 2012 #62

He killed her with a gun AFTER gaining access to it, tblue37 Dec 2012 #83

Thank you for that annotation. I believe I worded my post to which you coalition_unwilling Dec 2012 #85

Owning a tiger is highly regulated, highly restricted, and highly monitored. IllinoisBirdWatcher Dec 2012 #30

That was a very good post, thanks. People who own guns should thus secure them & be INSURED in the KittyWampus Dec 2012 #48

My husband bought a safe a few weeks ago HockeyMom Dec 2012 #23

She probably had them secured to some degree HooptieWagon Dec 2012 #69

i find myself barbtries Dec 2012 #17

I am a single woman in my late 40's ... Myrina Dec 2012 #32

of course not. barbtries Dec 2012 #39

Agreed, but the relative they spoke to in the article Myrina Dec 2012 #43

okay, i didn't read that barbtries Dec 2012 #44

I'm a disabled woman who lives alone & has a 12 lb watch mutt tpsbmam Dec 2012 #70

Here's a smattering of facts duhneece Dec 2012 #80

I agree with you. kag Dec 2012 #65

Blaming the parents of the shooter, not the victims. tclambert Dec 2012 #74

WMD? IDoMath Dec 2012 #4

I put a weapon like the one used in Sandy Creek at PRECISELY the same level as NBC weapons RomneyLies Dec 2012 #7

Really? You equate a gun to an atom bomb? IDoMath Dec 2012 #33

The purpose is the same, the only disparity is quantity. Erose999 Dec 2012 #60

That's really not my point IDoMath Dec 2012 #61

Yeah, I'd say a weapon that kills 20 people in a single outing coalition_unwilling Dec 2012 #11

NBCs IDoMath Dec 2012 #36

Spoken like a well-trained Gungeoneer. billh58 Dec 2012 #41

there heaven05 Dec 2012 #50

So, Bush told the TRUTH about WMDs in Iraq? IDoMath Dec 2012 #54

Nice try billh58 Dec 2012 #56

And you are lying about me and failing to answer my question. IDoMath Dec 2012 #57

I'll tell you what needs to be adjusted: billh58 Dec 2012 #58

Look, I think everyone on this forum who read my use of 'WMD' understood coalition_unwilling Dec 2012 #73

I guess that depends on your goal IDoMath Dec 2012 #84

Excellent post! nt Tumbulu Dec 2012 #68

killing 26 people in two minutes sounds like mass destruction to me. TeamPooka Dec 2012 #45

Post removed Post removed Dec 2012 #5

Toyotas are not designed to kill people RomneyLies Dec 2012 #9

So what? Lightbulb_on Dec 2012 #19

Your own logic fails the smell test. billh58 Dec 2012 #52

You do accept the possibility that the shooter was experiencing an coalition_unwilling Dec 2012 #13

Bullcrap... Lightbulb_on Dec 2012 #18

You did not respond to my observation about the 'shooter' possibly coalition_unwilling Dec 2012 #20

If that asshole didnt have a gun bowens43 Dec 2012 #26

If he hadn't been a coward piece of shit... Lightbulb_on Dec 2012 #28

There wouldn't be 28 dead men, women, and children had he chosen a knife groundloop Dec 2012 #35

And we have a winner! billh58 Dec 2012 #87

We're blaming the shooter but there is more blame to go around TeamPooka Dec 2012 #46

It's a business, like any other--and they profit anytime TwilightGardener Dec 2012 #6

Unfortunately, they're engaging in legal commerce. toby jo Dec 2012 #14

McDonalds is engaging in legal commerce too Fumesucker Dec 2012 #37

The gun industry has never claimed their product doesn't kill people... Jeff In Milwaukee Dec 2012 #24

Agreed. But his mother was a Glenn Beck type, who stockpiled ammo and guns. progressivebydesign Dec 2012 #27

I don't think they are that responsible for it Lithos Dec 2012 #29

See what I posted below about Cerberus Capital starroute Dec 2012 #51

Goes without mzmolly Dec 2012 #31

Good catch, I didn't notice that! Odin2005 Dec 2012 #34

Typical deflection tactics. They want people to waste time arguing about parents/drugs/teachers jsr Dec 2012 #42

Hey femrap Dec 2012 #47

Bushmaster is now owned by Cerberus Capital Management starroute Dec 2012 #49

Hey, how about " blame the pharmaceutical companies" womanofthehills Dec 2012 #53

That's typical in our pill culture where there's a drug for everything. bulloney Dec 2012 #59

How Can You Hug Your Kid With Firearms? triplepoint Dec 2012 #55

I blame the gun manufacturers for marketing their products to potentially violent, Moses2SandyKoufax Dec 2012 #63

People tried suing the gun manufacturers but the Supreme Court ruled it out. jerseyjack Dec 2012 #64

of course not Skittles Dec 2012 #66

When you say 'blame the parents' threads, you're talking about me. Gregorian Dec 2012 #67

I actually was not talking about you specifically or even generally. At least I don't coalition_unwilling Dec 2012 #72

Spam deleted by OKNancy (MIR Team) Rachel_Martin Dec 2012 #75

I have a measure of difficulty with that statement. What about children who are taught racism. olegramps Dec 2012 #82

Post removed Post removed Dec 2012 #76

When you make people killers and they do their job and kill people, is it the makers or the users or The Wielding Truth Dec 2012 #77

We need to make the gun manufacturers pay just like the Tobacco Industry LynneSin Dec 2012 #78

Amen. nt duhneece Dec 2012 #79

Thank you. Blue Belle Dec 2012 #86