General Discussion

krispos42

(49,445 posts)

52. Homicides have dropped 40% in the last 20 years.

Thu Dec 20, 2012, 11:49 PM

Dec 2012

Per capita.

I believe car-related death rates have remained relatively flat.

Not that the dead people are any more or less dead from one particular mode or another. But the background death rate of automobiles is something like 40,000 dead a year during normal, legal usage. The rate of guns is far lower for normal, legal usage.

We're talking 200 or so civilian justifiable homicides, 400 or so police justifiable homicides, and a couple of hundred (IIRC) negligent discharges and other sorts of accidental deaths during normal, legal usage.

The vast majority of gun-related deaths are self-inflicted wounds (suicide) at about 18,000 a year (of course, we don't know how many traffics deaths are disguised suicides), and 12,000 or so murders, which are of course criminal activities.

I'll note that most school buses are off the road by 4pm or so, and the drunk-driving problem doesn't kick in for a few more hours.

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Can anyone make a coherent argument that guns are LESS dangerous than cars? i doubt it... [View all] farminator3000 Dec 2012 OP

Currently a given gun in the US is less likely to kill or injure someone than a given car Recursion Dec 2012 #1

a chart farminator3000 Dec 2012 #8

The car deaths are evenly distributed among all cars Recursion Dec 2012 #11

what does that mean? farminator3000 Dec 2012 #35

what does that mean again? farminator3000 Dec 2012 #53

Most guns are never used, whereas most cars are driven every day. yardwork Dec 2012 #34

thank you! that makes sense! farminator3000 Dec 2012 #42

You are missing the point Aerows Dec 2012 #107

Not sure how you run over 20 kids in a classroom. tblue Dec 2012 #2

right. guns kill people, they are designed to. farminator3000 Dec 2012 #7

Precisely Aerows Dec 2012 #108

Is a load of bricks heavier than a football field is long? jberryhill Dec 2012 #3

yes farminator3000 Dec 2012 #4

The whole gun cars argument is ridicules on it's face. Guns are manufactured to kill. Cars are not. Lint Head Dec 2012 #5

you can stop at 'guns are made to kill and cars aren't" farminator3000 Dec 2012 #12

I don't understand your reply. Guns are manufactured to kill just like nuclear weapons. Lint Head Dec 2012 #18

sorry, were you agreeing with me? farminator3000 Dec 2012 #25

it isn't totally ridiculous farminator3000 Dec 2012 #55

I recomend this post. Lint Head Dec 2012 #58

Republicans are always saying "Cars kill people too" AgingAmerican Dec 2012 #6

So why not regulate guns as much car design and operation is regulated? aint_no_life_nowhere Dec 2012 #10

Again, this is a horrid comparison Lurker Deluxe Dec 2012 #16

If you haul that home-made vehicle on public streets aint_no_life_nowhere Dec 2012 #41

It is a horrible comparison Lurker Deluxe Dec 2012 #48

I've had to obtain moving permits and moving insurance every time aint_no_life_nowhere Dec 2012 #63

CA is not the rest of the US. beevul Dec 2012 #70

I am not a "gun libertarian" by any means Lurker Deluxe Dec 2012 #73

Sorry but I have yet to see a convincing argument that the comparison is foolish aint_no_life_nowhere Dec 2012 #76

We will have to agree to disagree. Lurker Deluxe Dec 2012 #77

Same here compadre aint_no_life_nowhere Dec 2012 #86

on point, sir! farminator3000 Dec 2012 #68

it just got more foolish- my cat hit a button and changed 'car' to 'gun' somehow in your thing here farminator3000 Dec 2012 #67

This makes no sense at all. Lurker Deluxe Dec 2012 #74

i most certainly am not talking about removing gun regs., i am saying regulate the crap out of them farminator3000 Dec 2012 #87

Exactly my point, cars are not regulated. Lurker Deluxe Dec 2012 #93

that is backwards. farminator3000 Dec 2012 #96

You are still wrong. Lurker Deluxe Dec 2012 #120

'you are wrong' is not the proper way to begin an argument farminator3000 Dec 2012 #125

if you want to regulate guns? farminator3000 Dec 2012 #89

Guns are out on the public streets and in public places treestar Dec 2012 #124

Hours of usage need to be factored in mainer Dec 2012 #9

huh? farminator3000 Dec 2012 #15

That's exactly the point. Cars used every day. Guns aren't. mainer Dec 2012 #17

wha? farminator3000 Dec 2012 #22

Firearm death rates have been pretty steady for many years. Vehicle death rates have fallen. slackmaster Dec 2012 #13

i'm not going to look up statistics to prove your point farminator3000 Dec 2012 #19

Firearms are weapons. They're supposed to be dangerous. slackmaster Dec 2012 #20

the argument being guns vs. cars / danger vs. safe farminator3000 Dec 2012 #24

Gun safety doesn't have to be the result of a law. slackmaster Dec 2012 #27

Kudos to you for being a responsible person. Toronto Dec 2012 #51

not driving drunk doesn't have to be a law, either. but it should farminator3000 Dec 2012 #71

The law doesn't prevent anything from happening. slackmaster Dec 2012 #75

there are millions of people who don't have that third beer at the bar farminator3000 Dec 2012 #79

"just because you are a responsible gun owner, you have no idea about the other 99,999,999." Rex Dec 2012 #119

so they should be into smart guns if they are responsible? right? farminator3000 Dec 2012 #128

I agree. Most car deaths are unintentional, most gun deaths are intentional. JaneyVee Dec 2012 #14

The gun kill-rate is thousands of times more than cars bongbong Dec 2012 #21

i wonder why nobody is arguing with you? farminator3000 Dec 2012 #80

It might indeed be all 50 states soon. Lizzie Poppet Dec 2012 #23

actually, suicide is the leading cause of gun death farminator3000 Dec 2012 #29

True. Lizzie Poppet Dec 2012 #30

Of course guns are more dangerous. rrneck Dec 2012 #26

people who are bad? farminator3000 Dec 2012 #28

Well, I just hate statistics, so I won't ask for any. rrneck Dec 2012 #31

probably doesn't count farminator3000 Dec 2012 #32

Who? rrneck Dec 2012 #36

huh? farminator3000 Dec 2012 #46

Here are some graphics you might find interesting. rrneck Dec 2012 #49

I think you fail to interpret the graphs you interpret... Toronto Dec 2012 #54

That second graphic specifies 'leaners' to each party. rrneck Dec 2012 #59

not really. farminator3000 Dec 2012 #57

Look at it like this. rrneck Dec 2012 #62

nope. don't get it. farminator3000 Dec 2012 #65

Political opinions don't change physics. rrneck Dec 2012 #66

political opinions also don't change reality in general. you are not clairvoyant. things don't farminator3000 Dec 2012 #69

Clinton got reelected. Tom Foley didn't. rrneck Dec 2012 #72

how long will it take you to verify this? farminator3000 Dec 2012 #81

Well, lets see... rrneck Dec 2012 #95

stop wasting my and your time, please farminator3000 Dec 2012 #98

There are no simple answers. rrneck Dec 2012 #99

Silly troll....very few deaths caused by firearms are purely accidental, whereas.... OldDem2012 Dec 2012 #33

i don't know what you are talking about, slappy, at least i make sense farminator3000 Dec 2012 #39

My post was in plain English....I should have guessed a troll wouldn't understand it. nt. OldDem2012 Dec 2012 #40

technically, by repeating yourself and saying nothing about what i said, YOU ARE THE TROLL, yes? farminator3000 Dec 2012 #43

Your original OP was a waste of time from your very first word. You have no point to make.... OldDem2012 Dec 2012 #45

this is my point- farminator3000 Dec 2012 #47

also, another point farminator3000 Dec 2012 #50

It would be very nice Toronto Dec 2012 #56

or if the word troll could be changed automatically by the server to farminator3000 Dec 2012 #61

You don't register something by degree of harm it does, do you? Honeycombe8 Dec 2012 #37

The difference between the items you list Toronto Dec 2012 #60

Guns are regulated for safety, as well. Honeycombe8 Dec 2012 #104

Sorry you are a target of criminals- Toronto Dec 2012 #105

I am a woman who lives alone, a common target of criminals. Honeycombe8 Dec 2012 #106

I can see why you would keep a weapon Toronto Dec 2012 #109

I live in Dallas, not an esp. crime ridden city. Honeycombe8 Dec 2012 #121

toronto is right farminator3000 Dec 2012 #83

This is a textbook false equivalency. baldguy Dec 2012 #38

that really is quite vague farminator3000 Dec 2012 #110

gosh H2O Man Dec 2012 #44

Homicides have dropped 40% in the last 20 years. krispos42 Dec 2012 #52

got a link? farminator3000 Dec 2012 #64

You have to do two separate queries at WISQARS, but it does confirm krispos423's claim slackmaster Dec 2012 #88

well, i got 18.4% farminator3000 Dec 2012 #92

1991 (a peak year) - 10.38 per 100,000. 2010 (most recent year available) - 5.29 slackmaster Dec 2012 #94

so what does that mean then? farminator3000 Dec 2012 #97

That means that you are less likely to be a victim of homicide now than you were 20 years ago slackmaster Dec 2012 #100

so guns are less dangerous than they were 20 years ago? or people are? farminator3000 Dec 2012 #112

No, there is a lower percentage of murderous people in the population than there was 20 years ago slackmaster Dec 2012 #113

great. less get murdered. farminator3000 Dec 2012 #115

are you actually human? farminator3000 Dec 2012 #116

Ah, a pleasant surprise on the car deaths. krispos42 Dec 2012 #103

Global warming. Cars. Oil. (nt) The Straight Story Dec 2012 #78

that is really quite a story, thanks! farminator3000 Dec 2012 #85

The question misses the point. wickerwoman Dec 2012 #82

so what is the answer? farminator3000 Dec 2012 #84

Yes. wickerwoman Dec 2012 #91

Guns kill people BY DESIGN joeunderdog Dec 2012 #90

i kind of like the sound of an Offensive Weapons Ban farminator3000 Dec 2012 #111

Not really, but I can prove beyond any doubt that cars are more useful in everyday life for the JDPriestly Dec 2012 #101

Regardless of what is more dangerous... Sancho Dec 2012 #102

Well, cars are meant to get us NashvilleLefty Dec 2012 #114

The "gun/car" argument .... etherealtruth Dec 2012 #122

looks like guns have the upper hand farminator3000 Dec 2012 #117

For a coherent argument, a coherent question or premise is needed... yawnmaster Dec 2012 #118

That's not the real question treestar Dec 2012 #123

Until any soldier of any nation is issued a Ford Fusion instead of a firearm, this line of argument Ikonoklast Dec 2012 #126

the purpose of a gun is too shoot something. samsingh Dec 2012 #127