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In reply to the discussion: OK...the million dollar question. Why would you want to kill someone? [View all]GreenStormCloud
(12,072 posts)188. You are the one who is not a legal scholar.
While it is true that being confused is not illegal, BREAKING AND ENTERING IS EXTREMELY ILLEGAL.
I do not have to determine his state of mind. I only need to know that he has illegally broken into my residence while I am there.
For your edification, here is the law: http://www.legis.state.tx.us/tlodocs/80R/billtext/html/SB00378F.HTM
AN ACT
relating to the use of force or deadly force in defense of a person.
BE IT ENACTED BY THE LEGISLATURE OF THE STATE OF TEXAS:
SECTION 1. Section 9.01, Penal Code, is amended by adding
Subdivisions (4) and (5) to read as follows:
(4) "Habitation" has the meaning assigned by Section
30.01.
(5) "Vehicle" has the meaning assigned by Section 30.01.
SECTION 2. Section 9.31, Penal Code, is amended by amending
Subsection (a) and adding Subsections (e) and (f) to read as follows:
(a) Except as provided in Subsection (b), a person is justified in using force against another when and to the degree the
actor [he] reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary to protect the actor [himself] against the other's use or attempted
use of unlawful force. The actor's belief that the force was immediately necessary as described by this subsection is presumed
to be reasonable if the actor:
(1) knew or had reason to believe that the person against whom the force was used:
(A) unlawfully and with force entered, or was attempting to enter unlawfully and with force, the actor's occupied
habitation, vehicle, or place of business or employment;
(B) unlawfully and with force removed, or was attempting to remove unlawfully and with force, the actor from the
actor's habitation, vehicle, or place of business or employment; or
(C) was committing or attempting to commit aggravated kidnapping, murder, sexual assault, aggravated sexual
assault, robbery, or aggravated robbery;
(2) did not provoke the person against whom the force was used; and
(3) was not otherwise engaged in criminal activity, other than a Class C misdemeanor that is a violation of a law or
ordinance regulating traffic at the time the force was used.
(e) A person who has a right to be present at the location where the force is used, who has not provoked the person against
whom the force is used, and who is not engaged in criminal activity at the time the force is used is not required to retreat before
using force as described by this section.
f) For purposes of Subsection (a), in determining whether an actor described by Subsection (e) reasonably believed that the
use of force was necessary, a finder of fact may not consider whether the actor failed to retreat.
SECTION 3. Section 9.32, Penal Code, is amended to read as follows:
Sec. 9.32. DEADLY FORCE IN DEFENSE OF PERSON.
(a) A person justified in using deadly force against another:
(1) if the actor [he] would be justified in using force against the other under Section 9.31; and
(2) [if a reasonable person in the actor's situation would not have retreated; and
[(3)] when and to the degree the actor [he] reasonably believes the deadly force is immediately necessary:
(A) to protect the actor [himself] against the other's use or attempted use of unlawful deadly force; or
(B) to prevent the other's imminent commission of aggravated kidnapping, murder, sexual assault, aggravated sexual
assault, robbery, or aggravated robbery.
(b) The actor's belief under Subsection (a)(2) that the deadly force was immediately necessary as described by that
subdivision is presumed to be reasonable if the actor:
(1) knew or had reason to believe that the person against whom the deadly force was used:
(A) unlawfully and with force entered, or was attempting to enter unlawfully and with force, the actor's occupied
habitation, vehicle, or place of business or employment;
(B) unlawfully and with force removed, or was attempting to remove unlawfully and with force, the actor from the actor's habitation, vehicle, or place of business or employment; or
(C) was committing or attempting to commit an
offense described by Subsection (a)(2)(B);
(2) did not provoke the person against whom the force was used; and
(3) was not otherwise engaged in criminal activity,
other than a Class C misdemeanor that is a violation of a law or ordinance regulating traffic at the time the force was used
[requirement imposed by Subsection (a)(2) does not apply to an actor who uses force against a person who is at the time of the use of
force committing an offense of unlawful entry in the habitation of the actor].
c) A person who has a right to be present at the location where the deadly force is used, who has not provoked the person
against whom the deadly force is used, and who is not engaged in criminal activity at the time the deadly force is used is not
required to retreat before using deadly force as described by this
section.
(d) For purposes of Subsection (a)(2), in determining whether an actor described by Subsection (c) reasonably believed that the use of deadly force was necessary, a finder of fact may not consider whether the actor failed to retreat.
SECTION 4. Section 83.001, Civil Practice and Remedies Code, is amended to read as follows:
Sec. 83.001. CIVIL IMMUNITY [AFFIRMATIVE DEFENSE].
A [It is an affirmative defense to a civil action for damages for personal injury or death that the] defendant who uses force or[, at the time the cause of action arose, was justified in using] deadly force that is justified under Chapter 9 [Section 9.32], Penal Code, is immune from civil liability for personal injury or death that results from the defendant's [against a person who at the time of the] use of force or deadly force, as applicable [was committing an offense of unlawful entry in the habitation of the defendant].
SECTION 5. (a) Sections 9.31 and 9.32, Penal Code, as amended by this Act, apply only to an offense committed on or after the effective date of this Act. An offense committed before the effective date of this Act is covered by the law in effect when the offense was committed, and the former law is continued in effect for this purpose. For the purposes of this subsection, an offense is committed before the effective date of this Act if any element of the offense occurs before the effective date.
(b) Section 83.001, Civil Practice and Remedies Code, as amended by this Act, applies only to a cause of action that accrues on or after the effective date of this Act. An action that accrued before the effective date of this Act is governed by the law in effect at the time the action accrued, and that law is continued in effect for that purpose.
SECTION 6. This Act takes effect September 1, 2007.
So there is the law. Castle Doctrine and Stand-Your-Ground and Civil Immunity, all in one bill. Don't break into an occupied residence, or business, in Texas. You are likely not to survive. And nothing will happen to the resident. It doesn't matter if you are drunk, playing a prank, confused, or whatever - breaking and entering is illegal and very dangerous.
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OK...the million dollar question. Why would you want to kill someone? [View all]
Taverner
Dec 2012
OP
easy question you kill someone to save yourself or someone else from death or serious injury
loli phabay
Dec 2012
#1
I think he's going to the sense of tragedy in "having" to kill someone that is absent in most
Ed Suspicious
Dec 2012
#179
You resolve your feelings before you put yourself in the position.
socialindependocrat
Dec 2012
#201
in a life or death confrontation i am happy if someone dies as long as its the other guy
loli phabay
Dec 2012
#208
pretty much evolution does or do you still think we are single cell creatures
loli phabay
Dec 2012
#89
I honestly believe that if ever confronted with it live and in person,
Ruby the Liberal
Dec 2012
#122
"If you beat that man to death to stop him from raping you, whatever will you say to his mother"?
Ruby the Liberal
Dec 2012
#111
He's aiming for the greatest page, no matter how asinine a statement must be made.
X_Digger
Dec 2012
#126
DU is full of stories from gun nuts who "defended their family with their glock"
Taverner
Dec 2012
#11
Not kicking down the door, but you can hear someone breaking in, if you're awake.
Honeycombe8
Dec 2012
#17
I have posted about my wife scaring away a would-be mugger. No shots fired.
GreenStormCloud
Dec 2012
#170
If you are a good person, and you kill someone and feel nothing...you are not a good person
Taverner
Dec 2012
#12
Roger That - The Culture Of Death And Gun Enablers Have Debased America Significantly
cantbeserious
Dec 2012
#209
So it's not ok for law enforcement to kill criminals in their defense or the defense of others?
jal777
Dec 2012
#16
Yes. Yes I am. If you kill someone in the process, and you don't feel anything...
Taverner
Dec 2012
#30
If you have a gun and never asked yourself this question, you have no business with one
Taverner
Dec 2012
#24
There is a huge difference between "accidentally blundered" and "breaking and entering".
GreenStormCloud
Dec 2012
#191
Because I think the idea that you are going to stop a determined attacker with a bat is foolish
Taitertots
Dec 2012
#62
My late wife killed a home invader who had a gun on me many years ago
ProgressiveProfessor
Dec 2012
#43
Whether your wife killed him or murdered him he's still just as dead, isn't he?
TheDebbieDee
Dec 2012
#112
Yes, but the justification of the murder is in the eye of the beholder, isn't it?
TheDebbieDee
Dec 2012
#121
His solution to this would be to hide and hit the killer in the knee or he would become a sociopath
jal777
Dec 2012
#71
It is not something one takes lightly, but I would not lose sleep over it
The Straight Story
Dec 2012
#67
If it was a horde of crazy hippies on meth who were trying to hurt me or my family...
renie408
Dec 2012
#104
Just keep in mind that police are not personal security and are not obligated to render aid.
TheKentuckian
Dec 2012
#145
My point was nothing of the kind, I am not fixated on one scenario with every thought revolving
TheKentuckian
Dec 2012
#216
Why would you want to allow yourself or a loved one to die? Would you sleep better THEN?
jmg257
Dec 2012
#142
Having been in positions where I killed people and then failed to kill someone I should have
Victor_c3
Dec 2012
#156
And you've done nothing but WASTE one more opportunity to honestly address your authentic
patrice
Dec 2012
#180
Let's get this straight. No non-psychopathic/sociopathic person "wants" to kill anyone ever
nachosgrande
Dec 2012
#189
If I were in genuine fear for my life, I'd be prepared to use lethal force to defend myself.
Spider Jerusalem
Dec 2012
#198
If someone's trying to harm me, I AIN'T WORRYIN' ABOUT HIS MOTHER, PAL. THAT'S HIS CONCERN.
WinkyDink
Dec 2012
#215