General Discussion

gulliver

(14,055 posts)

117. Your post is very misleading.

Sat Jan 5, 2013, 01:31 PM

Jan 2013

It only has one number (2,305), and the rest is all airy rhetoric.

You need to break down how many of these were strikes on military targets, and how many innocent lives were lost vs. militants. That would allow readers to assess the true balance of the situation.

For example, http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/8139739.stm (from references on the Wikipedia page) is much, much less cut-and-dried than your rhetoric would indicate. Fifty "suspected militants" were killed, and the drones were "suspected" U.S. drones. And the territory was in Northwest Pakistan, and the target was the Taliban, and there was an official Pakistani offensive gearing up...

Would I rather have drones covertly assist the Pakistani military in attacking the Taliban than, say, U.S. jets or helicopter gunships? Yup. Do I think the Pakistanis hate us for helping their military attack the Taliban in the northwest? Nope.

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2,305 killed by Obama in drone strikes in Pakistan by my count [View all] Bonobo Jan 2013 OP

'surgical' that poor, abused word. Nt xchrom Jan 2013 #1

If we were a licensed surgeon we would be in prison for malpractice. sammy27932003 Jan 2013 #60

Yup, it makes it seem like war doesn't hurt anyone who isn't supposed to be hurt Victor_c3 Jan 2013 #84

I still don't get it quaker bill Jan 2013 #2

It seems YOU are pre-occupied with them. Bonobo Jan 2013 #4

The title of the OP is the 2300 killed by drones quaker bill Jan 2013 #22

Those 2300 human beings are extremely relevant to their friends and families cpwm17 Jan 2013 #109

If you believe that the US would have killed 2,300 Pakistani citizens with regular aircraft, you're Democracyinkind Jan 2013 #6

This. Bonobo Jan 2013 #8

We have killed alot more people with piloted aircraft quaker bill Jan 2013 #21

While I strongly agree with tomg Jan 2013 #96

Almost all of it is done by machines quaker bill Jan 2013 #97

I do agree with you tomg Jan 2013 #99

You know, I might be concerned about increased distance quaker bill Jan 2013 #124

Cheapness of proliferation and complete removal of risk aka lower cost. TheKentuckian Jan 2013 #121

This deserves its own OP. leveymg Jan 2013 #126

It's so true. Bonobo Jan 2013 #134

Thank you. Couldn't have elaborated on my point any better. Democracyinkind Jan 2013 #135

K&R idwiyo Jan 2013 #127

Those are not the only options. morningfog Jan 2013 #42

True, not killing would always be the better option quaker bill Jan 2013 #91

One of the distinctions is the sanitization of death. Ms. Toad Jan 2013 #50

I would hope AFSC and FCNL would take equally strong stands quaker bill Jan 2013 #88

They do. Ms. Toad Jan 2013 #118

I know our Peace and Social Concerns committee quaker bill Jan 2013 #119

:) Ms. Toad Jan 2013 #125

Friends at our Meeting have always appreciated the work of FCNL quaker bill Jan 2013 #128

Why are we killing people in foreign countries? You're not seriously saying sabrina 1 Jan 2013 #56

This message was self-deleted by its author sammy27932003 Jan 2013 #62

I oppose all killing quaker bill Jan 2013 #90

It provides good jobs to Americans. raouldukelives Jan 2013 #98

Sabrina, you know why... Mimosa Jan 2013 #136

Hi Mimosa, sabrina 1 Jan 2013 #140

18,000+ Russian troops were sacrificed in Afghanistan for same reason Mimosa Jan 2013 #142

Of course they did. That's how England got so battered....bombs and such... Honeycombe8 Jan 2013 #87

We are at war any place where we are using the military to kill quaker bill Jan 2013 #92

brought to you by... KG Jan 2013 #3

Well when you use drones they're aren't people anymore Puzzledtraveller Jan 2013 #5

There was plenty of gun camera video quaker bill Jan 2013 #95

Do we think the number of people who fear and hate us is going down yet? kenny blankenship Jan 2013 #7

If this strategy is working, why are the number of strikes increasing? Bonobo Jan 2013 #9

Simple math former-republican Jan 2013 #13

Oh hey, don't say "never ending cycle" kenny blankenship Jan 2013 #16

Think of how many more it would be if we were doing it the old fashioned way Freddie Stubbs Jan 2013 #10

Read post #6 above. Bonobo Jan 2013 #11

You prefer children be killed by another means? morningfog Jan 2013 #43

Why are we killing people, the old fashioned way or the new fashioned way? sabrina 1 Jan 2013 #57

Guns in the sky.. Puzzledtraveller Jan 2013 #12

Why do threads on this topic die so quickly? bighart Jan 2013 #14

Because Bush isn't in office leftstreet Jan 2013 #18

Because Bush isn't President anymore? sabrina 1 Jan 2013 #67

kr excellent work. In the end, one either believes in the concept of Karma or one does not... green for victory Jan 2013 #15

Probably because the victims do not look like us. Puzzledtraveller Jan 2013 #19

Bonobo read a WIKI page and you're complimenting cliffordu Jan 2013 #26

Bonobo spent time counting. Not very praiseworthy indeed. Bonobo Jan 2013 #34

That's mister asshole to you. cliffordu Jan 2013 #39

You don't deserve the title "mister" in my book. nt Bonobo Jan 2013 #40

And who, in this best of all possible worlds, cliffordu Jan 2013 #45

I think you care, Cliff. Bonobo Jan 2013 #46

Post removed Post removed Jan 2013 #69

Jeezus, that was pathetic. nt Bonobo Jan 2013 #72

Well... cliffordu Jan 2013 #73

I'm beginning to feel the stirrings of pity. nt Bonobo Jan 2013 #74

Then stop looking at your lap. cliffordu Jan 2013 #75

Thanks for the laugh, Cliff. Bonobo Jan 2013 #76

I should have been more clear green for victory Jan 2013 #65

Probably. cliffordu Jan 2013 #70

And do you think some of this same attitude towards video killing rl6214 Jan 2013 #86

K&R woo me with science Jan 2013 #17

Breathing a bit more like into your post. bighart Jan 2013 #20

And now to completely repulse you. Pakistan was allowing Bin Laden to live in a mansion WonderGrunion Jan 2013 #23

I'd say there are monsters right here on DU too. nt Bonobo Jan 2013 #24

You said it. Tien1985 Jan 2013 #28

You think killing 20,000 would have been acceptable because some elements morningfog Jan 2013 #44

Yes, that is exactly what he said and is still saying. Bonobo Jan 2013 #47

Yes, that is exactly what I'm saying WonderGrunion Jan 2013 #49

We have some sick fucks in this place. Comrade Grumpy Jan 2013 #52

So I take it you would be fine with he families of the innocent Pakistanis killed morningfog Jan 2013 #58

Looks like you and Bin Laden had more in common than you realize -nt Bradical79 Jan 2013 #55

Oddly enough, that was the way bin Laden felt about America Fumesucker Jan 2013 #80

You are disgusting. If you really mean that then you are no better than Bin Laden. white_wolf Jan 2013 #83

Bin Laden was once in Dubai MKITEM Jan 2013 #100

We have worse criminals living in the US than any other country cpwm17 Jan 2013 #112

We have had and still do, quite a few monsters living right here in the US under the protection sabrina 1 Jan 2013 #139

Maybe you could post your sources, since you are cliffordu Jan 2013 #25

That is the source. Bonobo Jan 2013 #29

M'kay. cliffordu Jan 2013 #33

2305 is less than those who lost their lives on 9-11, less than our military in Iraq, Thinkingabout Jan 2013 #27

Pakistan was not involved in 9-11. Bonobo Jan 2013 #32

Was anyone living in Pakistan who was or has been a part of those responsible for 9-11? Thinkingabout Jan 2013 #37

Kill tens of thousands of people in a country when a criminal flees there? Bonobo Jan 2013 #41

The 9/11 hijackers were in the United States for long periods of time MKITEM Jan 2013 #102

How many drones do we have to look for? cpwm17 Jan 2013 #116

Is that you Dubya? The Link Jan 2013 #71

What a crowd of more than 2000 people looks like AZ Progressive Jan 2013 #30

That is a lot of blood and a lot of children blood and a lot of innocent blood malaise Jan 2013 #31

Here are the actual numbers ProSense Jan 2013 #35

Thanks. Bonobo Jan 2013 #38

I couldn't agree more: Vattel Jan 2013 #36

Bush Sr. made a strong effort to sanitize the image of war during the 1st gulf war think Jan 2013 #48

and in the next war,the first PNAC war- green for victory Jan 2013 #63

I remember when they first launched the phrase "embeds" for reporters... Bonobo Jan 2013 #68

where are the posts defending Dan Rather? I seemed to have missed them. graham4anything Jan 2013 #85

Nobel Peace Prize won cbrer Jan 2013 #51

better than 100000 people if we sent in covert troops larkrake Jan 2013 #53

But we are not at war with Pakistan. nt Bonobo Jan 2013 #54

This message was self-deleted by its author sammy27932003 Jan 2013 #59

Reading is fundamental. n/t demmiblue Jan 2013 #61

That poster was correct. YOU should read. It was half a million kids. Bonobo Jan 2013 #64

The original post is about Pakistan, not Iraq... hence my post. n/t demmiblue Jan 2013 #66

I'm sure he mourns them, unlike you who only exploits them. great white snark Jan 2013 #77

My record of criticizing Obama? Bonobo Jan 2013 #78

obama orders them killed, then mourns them? but bonobo exploits them? that is some twisted HiPointDem Jan 2013 #82

He does not mourn them, from Obama's own mouth: MKITEM Jan 2013 #103

America has always excelled in the killing of non-whites stultusporcos Jan 2013 #79

kr HiPointDem Jan 2013 #81

Did Obama personally aim them and push the buttons? You are using twisted, simplistic thinking. RBInMaine Jan 2013 #89

What does Commander In-Chief mean if not overall responsibility for the US military's actions? nt Bonobo Jan 2013 #93

Yes he did. And it's pretty simple. MKITEM Jan 2013 #104

Did *, Cheney or Rumsfeld personally water-board anyone? n/t hughee99 Jan 2013 #105

mass murder aandegoons Jan 2013 #94

The President Carries The Biggest "Gun" Unfortunately cantbeserious Jan 2013 #101

It doesn't seem fair Turbineguy Jan 2013 #106

Compare to Bush & Cheney's uncountable deaths fadedrose Jan 2013 #107

Oh, please! Who cares? They're different from us. Just kill 'em all and let God sort 'em out. Zorra Jan 2013 #108

We need to cease the drone killings now. nt ladjf Jan 2013 #110

The US military killed them treestar Jan 2013 #111

No one is doing this in my name. And no it is not being done to protect this nation. sabrina 1 Jan 2013 #113

Truth: "We elected Democrats in order to stop what Bush started." Zorra Jan 2013 #114

By your logic Reagan did Iran Contra to protect the nation. MKITEM Jan 2013 #115

Your post is very misleading. gulliver Jan 2013 #117

To avoid counting civilian deaths, Obama re-defined "militant" to mean "all military-age males... woo me with science Jan 2013 #131

Same game JReed Jan 2013 #120

Your text is taken word-for-word from a post made at DU in March 2010... SidDithers Jan 2013 #132

How about from artillery fire? tabasco Jan 2013 #122

That's it? JReed Jan 2013 #123

"the motherfuckers in Pakistan and Afghanistan started it when they blew up New York City. " Bonobo Jan 2013 #130

The hijackers were from Saudi Arabia. morningfog Jan 2013 #133

Pakistan blew up NY City? sabrina 1 Jan 2013 #137

Please spot the "motherfuckers from Pakistan and Afghanistan" in this picture: cpwm17 Jan 2013 #141

Strikes Pound Pakistan in Obama's Ongoing Drone War JReed Jan 2013 #129

War Crimes G_j Jan 2013 #138