General Discussion

Aristus

(72,163 posts)

71. I agree 100%. I'm a Gulf War vet, although I have no doubt my experiences were as nothing compared

Thu Jan 10, 2013, 08:11 PM

Jan 2013

yours in Vietnam.

I got all the weapon-firing experience I could ask for in the Army, properly trained and supervised. Never felt the need for a gun once I was out of the Army. Seems kinds ridiculous to own military weaponry as a private citizen, anyway.

I share your dismay that many Americans view war as akin to the Super Bowl, or to a video game, which causes no casualties, and has a reset button. I wonder if universal military service might not take care of some of that?

I used to be a war-war-war, rah-rah-rah kind of guy. It's one of the reasons I enlisted as a tanker in the first place. But all it took was a single Scud-missile attack to change my perception of war. Nothing creates a pacifist quite as effectively as war...

Anyway, well-said. Bravo.

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In 1966 I was trained with the M-14. I was taught [View all] upaloopa Jan 2013 OP

K&R Sherman A1 Jan 2013 #1

Hear Hear, Sir The Magistrate Jan 2013 #2

Recommended NNN0LHI Jan 2013 #28

+ 1000 loyalsister Jan 2013 #68

Recommended, and thank you. DisgustipatedinCA Jan 2013 #3

BIG K&R Ernesto Jan 2013 #4

Bill Mauldin said it best: hedgehog Jan 2013 #5

As a history buff and nephew of 2 wwII vets, I loved Bill Mauldin's books. It made me libinnyandia Jan 2013 #70

I don't follow you. As the daughter of a WWII vet and a niece of others, maddiemom Jan 2013 #87

Bill Mauldin wrote about WWII weren't always treated well when they returned home. libinnyandia Jan 2013 #89

Watch the movie "The Best Years of Our Lives" sweetloukillbot Jan 2013 #94

I didn't see it that way Squaredeal Jan 2013 #151

The movie did eventually have a happy ending... sweetloukillbot Jan 2013 #176

When I got back into college after VN in 1969, I got $130/month on the GI Bill-- Jackpine Radical Jan 2013 #102

My Dad's favorite "Willie and Joe" Mopar151 Jan 2013 #93

+1 uponit7771 Jan 2013 #137

"Sort of like the Super Bowl" really nails it. Speck Tater Jan 2013 #6

Same way during Gulf War I Fumesucker Jan 2013 #8

Ditto OIF 2003-2004 pasto76 Jan 2013 #58

I had the same experience many times. upaloopa Jan 2013 #12

I've often wondered about sports fandom and war cheering and whether they're related. DisgustipatedinCA Jan 2013 #38

Very well said. pangaia Jan 2013 #74

ok, so here's a strange thing DisgustipatedinCA Jan 2013 #77

Probably has to do with the pace of the game. n/t SwankyXomb Jan 2013 #120

I agree again. pangaia Jan 2013 #192

Mr. Carlin Agrees, Sir.... The Magistrate Jan 2013 #130

yes, that one is a classic. pangaia Jan 2013 #173

Hey... druidity33 Jan 2013 #92

Ask you dad The Wizard Jan 2013 #99

wonderful satire, billy lynn's long halftime walk msedano Jan 2013 #172

K&R Waiting For Everyman Jan 2013 #7

I never bought a weapon and don't plan on ever owning one but... LiberalLoner Jan 2013 #9

Well I think you are nuts then. Comfortable with? upaloopa Jan 2013 #14

I agree, that's why I don't own one. But it's the only weapon LiberalLoner Jan 2013 #32

Pretty damned harsh, dontcha think??? southshore Jan 2013 #168

Did you ever walk point on a patrol? Bandit Jan 2013 #47

I had both a sawed off Winchester model 12 and a M-79. upaloopa Jan 2013 #56

Different time, different war, and a different way of doing things Victor_c3 Jan 2013 #149

Things have definitely gotten better for our troops. Bandit Jan 2013 #177

don't take this the wrong way, but I'm not envious at all Victor_c3 Jan 2013 #178

Dad told me no one that ever had to wipe the brains of his fellow Marine off his face would ever Ikonoklast Jan 2013 #10

My dad was a helicopter mechanic and door gunner in Vietnam. Turned down some lucrative Erose999 Jan 2013 #159

Absoutely. ellisonz Jan 2013 #11

The comforting news is that they (assault-type rifles) account for a tiny fraction of gun-homicide. OneTenthofOnePercent Jan 2013 #13

Is all you can do is post stats? Isn't 20 kids dead in upaloopa Jan 2013 #17

Posting stats and facts... as opposed to Logical fallacies? OneTenthofOnePercent Jan 2013 #23

Your about a week behind the times. Society is upaloopa Jan 2013 #26

Don't count on it. LAGC Jan 2013 #152

Passing by too fast.. southshore Jan 2013 #169

first of all the fact those things exist BainsBane Jan 2013 #95

I think you've replied to the wrong subthread. OneTenthofOnePercent Jan 2013 #104

so then you're advocating for prohibiting hand guns? BainsBane Jan 2013 #115

That would appear to be the logical solutions to taking a real bite out of homicides. nt OneTenthofOnePercent Jan 2013 #119

you'll get no argument from me BainsBane Jan 2013 #131

We do have a sick culture BobbyBoring Jan 2013 #186

"1 death is a tragedy. One millions deaths is simply a statistic." LanternWaste Jan 2013 #100

And we live in a nation where laws govern hundres of millions of people. OneTenthofOnePercent Jan 2013 #108

Then banning them will not be a problem.... jpak Jan 2013 #18

And nor will it solve anything. OneTenthofOnePercent Jan 2013 #25

Yes it will - gun massacre nuts will not be able to use them jpak Jan 2013 #31

Most "gun massacre nuts" are already not using them. OneTenthofOnePercent Jan 2013 #42

well ban them, take the off the streets and they'll be using them even less win win uponit7771 Jan 2013 #139

How does banning something seldom used accomplish anything?? HooptieWagon Jan 2013 #143

And then you'll have spent all your political capital sir pball Jan 2013 #181

Oh no! If we try to keep people from dying, Dems will lose!!!! AllyCat Jan 2013 #183

Well you again have to attack my timing of events upaloopa Jan 2013 #19

Correct, your chronological awareness doesn't "fucking detract from what you said". OneTenthofOnePercent Jan 2013 #29

Listen, Americans are tired of the killing upaloopa Jan 2013 #35

If they're tired of killings, why not support laws that can ACTUALLY put a dent in them? OneTenthofOnePercent Jan 2013 #51

It doesn't matter how few or how many. This year they were upaloopa Jan 2013 #55

I'll address it, 1/10-O'-1, BlueNoteSpecial Jan 2013 #43

Protip: It's easier just to type "0.1%" nt OneTenthofOnePercent Jan 2013 #59

@ BlueNoteSpecial Jan 2013 #158

3.7% of all rifles vs. 1 in 4 assault rifles = massively disproportionate representation. ellisonz Jan 2013 #48

Not how I remember things Bandit Jan 2013 #50

Armalite developed the AR10 in '57 OneTenthofOnePercent Jan 2013 #69

Bravo - that is why they are known as "gun nuts". jpak Jan 2013 #15

Then banning them is pointless. Lizzie Poppet Jan 2013 #24

Banning them will take them away from gun nut massacre types jpak Jan 2013 #33

Perhaps. Lizzie Poppet Jan 2013 #75

Sounds like a plan! Nt jmg257 Jan 2013 #81

It should be a felony to own them jpak Jan 2013 #107

*shrug* Lizzie Poppet Jan 2013 #112

keeping them is also pointless.. frylock Jan 2013 #61

True...which then makes the question one of approach. Lizzie Poppet Jan 2013 #78

"That it might cause harm...." thucythucy Jan 2013 #90

Sure...but there's the matter of proportion. Lizzie Poppet Jan 2013 #111

Seems to me, with the proposals I've seen thucythucy Jan 2013 #133

If they were banned long ago sellitman Jan 2013 #145

zzzzzzzzzzzzzz Skittles Jan 2013 #63

Bravo, Skittles! Bravo! LanternWaste Jan 2013 #73

For someone "not listening," you seem oddly driven to respond. Lizzie Poppet Jan 2013 #79

LOLOL Skittles Jan 2013 #191

Nice strawman. Lizzie Poppet Jan 2013 #193

trotting out the STRAWMAN Skittles Jan 2013 #194

If you don't like your comedy-tier errors pointed out... Lizzie Poppet Jan 2013 #195

K &R Squinch Jan 2013 #16

Truely great OP. UnrepentantLiberal Jan 2013 #20

Yessir. 99Forever Jan 2013 #21

Did you get " The Theory of the Bayonet"? pscot Jan 2013 #22

Yeah, I had to stab some target and yell something. upaloopa Jan 2013 #34

What is the spirit of the bayonet? The Wizard Jan 2013 #105

Spirit? That sounds really New Age pscot Jan 2013 #125

New Age? The Wizard Jan 2013 #135

That also was the spirit of the hand to hand fighter. We had to yell kill kill kill also. upaloopa Jan 2013 #126

+1,000 freshwest Jan 2013 #27

Preach It!!! nt MrScorpio Jan 2013 #30

i agree with you about the... actslikeacarrot Jan 2013 #36

I feel the same way! mailman82 Jan 2013 #37

People don't have a problem with hunting type guns upaloopa Jan 2013 #45

Semi-automatics with detachable magazines is "most guns" Recursion Jan 2013 #62

K&R, one gazillion times! ReRe Jan 2013 #39

K&R. Chorophyll Jan 2013 #40

It's sort of like the mentality of people janx Jan 2013 #41

I too was trained on the M-14 and M-16 in 1966 doc03 Jan 2013 #44

Welcome home alcibiades_mystery Jan 2013 #46

NRA talking drones in 3...2....1..... GoneOffShore Jan 2013 #49

Infantry combat vet here. tabasco Jan 2013 #52

What you said... only more so. Semper Fi. nt Bigmack Jan 2013 #53

War is glorified in our society Major Nikon Jan 2013 #54

War is never fun. In_The_Wind Jan 2013 #57

I doubt I would ever buy a rifle, but if I did it would probably be an AR Recursion Jan 2013 #60

I've been screaming the same thing for years ! jaysunb Jan 2013 #64

Since 9/11, we've trained another 5 million people on the M-16 or equivalent FarCenter Jan 2013 #65

war games mozan Jan 2013 #66

K&R, but paintball is kinda fun. dorkulon Jan 2013 #67

I dunno...The one time I went, almost half in the group were kids Blue_Tires Jan 2013 #174

I agree 100%. I'm a Gulf War vet, although I have no doubt my experiences were as nothing compared Aristus Jan 2013 #71

After 6 months in Vietnam I turned against the upaloopa Jan 2013 #85

"Nothing creates a pacifist quite as effectively as war... " nikto Jan 2013 #147

Thank you for your service and this post. erinlough Jan 2013 #179

... TahitiNut Jan 2013 #72

Thank you tavalon Jan 2013 #76

You bring up a good point. LittleGirl Jan 2013 #80

Thank you ismnotwasm Jan 2013 #82

The M-14 itself is a powerful weapon. backscatter712 Jan 2013 #83

An M-14 standard round The Wizard Jan 2013 #109

"the M-14 ... fires 7.62mm cartridges, the same as the AK-47 ..." AnotherMcIntosh Jan 2013 #117

combat training was designed to make us want to run toward the muzzle flash... msedano Jan 2013 #84

We had to crawl under machine gun fire in basic upaloopa Jan 2013 #88

Loved 4Q2u2 Jan 2013 #86

It's going to take more than a band of old fat asses with cool rifles for the "revolution" BeyondGeography Jan 2013 #153

Aww man, and I just maxed out my credit card at Guns-N-Ammo.com too Erose999 Jan 2013 #162

Thanks...talk about central casting BeyondGeography Jan 2013 #167

You Missed 4Q2u2 Jan 2013 #165

So the American citizens, as presently armed, constitute a real threat to the military? BeyondGeography Jan 2013 #170

We are now 4Q2u2 Jan 2013 #180

Same here madokie Jan 2013 #91

Post removed Post removed Jan 2013 #96

It was 1966 that our Army switched over from the M14 to the M16 1-Old-Man Jan 2013 #98

They jammed a lot especially if you get into any moisture or dirt. upaloopa Jan 2013 #123

The one they issued to me had a machining error, the bullets would not load 1-Old-Man Jan 2013 #155

Hey that machining error nadinbrzezinski Jan 2013 #187

I think you are saying I killed innocent people. Maybe I did, I'm not sure. My draft notice upaloopa Jan 2013 #124

Post removed Post removed Jan 2013 #136

Whoa, he was drafted. What reason did he have to doubt his government was lying to him? Selatius Jan 2013 #138

Post removed because I accidentally hit post before I completed my post Taitertots Jan 2013 #140

I never defended involvement in Viet Nam. My family suffered that war personally. nt Selatius Jan 2013 #141

My previous post was edited... Taitertots Jan 2013 #142

K&R CrazyOrangeCat Jan 2013 #97

What about making "tactical weapons" an elite class, with a license/registration/security deal? Mopar151 Jan 2013 #101

In 1966" leanforward Jan 2013 #103

Did WWI vets think the same about bolt action rifles? hack89 Jan 2013 #106

That's clearly not the point. This is 2013. Last year there were several mass shootings where the upaloopa Jan 2013 #121

And the fixation on rifles obscures a much bigger point hack89 Jan 2013 #134

I'm willing to bet that the AWB will be renewed this year and soon. The NRA the right the gun lobby upaloopa Jan 2013 #164

What if the next mass shooting is a repeat of Va Tech? hack89 Jan 2013 #175

Re: The OP SCVDem Jan 2013 #110

Wow! Powerful stuff! Bay Boy Jan 2013 #171

Perfect. Thank you! MannyGoldstein Jan 2013 #113

That's why I stick with civilian sporting rifles like my AR's ileus Jan 2013 #114

K&R. We're In An Era Where A Lot Of Firearms Aren't Designed For Grown-ups. (nt) Paladin Jan 2013 #116

Thank you for this... peace13 Jan 2013 #118

Yeah, because civilians shouldn't enjoy the benefits of incremental improvements in gun technology! krispos42 Jan 2013 #122

I feel your pain. Poor thing. Hugs. Hoyt Jan 2013 #127

I know, I have such unreasonable expectations. krispos42 Jan 2013 #128

6 yr old citizens should have the right to grow up not be murdered in school. If that means you upaloopa Jan 2013 #129

Go shovel your false equivalency someplace else. krispos42 Jan 2013 #132

But privacy is actually important. DanTex Jan 2013 #157

With all due respect, you're not the king of DU. The OP is as welcome as you to share his views Heidi Jan 2013 #160

And I'm sharing my opinion of where his false-equivalency arguments should be krispos42 Jan 2013 #190

I wouldn't mind an M1A because it fits me well riqster Jan 2013 #144

Cowboys and Indians. It's all pretend horror just like in books and movies. Kablooie Jan 2013 #146

Very well put judesedit Jan 2013 #148

"In war they fucking shoot back!" It is all captured there, isn't it? Buzz Clik Jan 2013 #150

And that, in a nutshell, is why the use of drones is murder, not an act of war. 1-Old-Man Jan 2013 #156

Well, okay. Is that relevant? Buzz Clik Jan 2013 #163

The Anerican public thinks of war like a football game. Dash87 Jan 2013 #154

I agree 100%. We should be preaching to our children that there is nothing sinkingfeeling Jan 2013 #161

War is the greatest sin mankind commits randr Jan 2013 #166

I get the appeal of playing army when you are 11. lumberjack_jeff Jan 2013 #182

I was trained ip5683 Jan 2013 #184

We're not talking about kids playing war. upaloopa Jan 2013 #185

I've not been to war- digonswine Jan 2013 #188

All class upaloopa toby jo Jan 2013 #189