The Rude Pundit - Sorry, Gun Nuts: Hitler Actually Relaxed Most Gun Laws

[happyslug]

79. Actually your history is a little off.

In 1939, all resistance in Poland came to an end, just like it did in Iraq after US forces took Baghdad. At that point the Poles accepted the fact they had lost and waited to see what would happen in the West.

Hitler moved his forces to the West during the winter of 1939-1940 and hit France in May 1940, by June the war in the West was over. Britain would hold on, claim a Victory in the Battle of Britain and then, like the Poles and the French waited for something to happen.

Hitler moved against the Balkans in the Spring of 1941, this moved seems to have convinced Stalin that Hitler had no plans to attack Russia in 1941, instead Hitler would wait for the Spring of 1942. There is some indications that Stalin was planning to attack first, the Red Army was posed to attack in June 1941, not defend.

Side note: It was due to this position that the Germans ended up taking as much as Russia as they did, An Army on the Offensive wants its supplies at the start of the Offensive as close to the front lines as possible, on the other hand, on the Defensive an Army wants the supplies further back so they can fall back to it. Thus it is in many ways advantageous to attack an army about to launch an attack itself. You surround it and take its supplies for yourself, the Army you are attacking thus has no fuel, no food and no ammo and can be left behind and taken prisoner later. On the other hand, if the Army is geared for the Defensive, the attacking army just pushes the Army back onto its supplies, strengthening the Defensive army while the Offensive army uses up its food, Fuel and Ammo (Kursk in 1943 was an example of a German Offensive facing a Russian Army on the Defensive, and ended up with the German's offensive being stopped and the Germans driver out of the Eastern Ukraine by the Red Army as the Red Army counter attacked). The Russian Army in June 1941 had its supplies to close for a defensive stand, and out flanked by the Germans to go on the Offensive and thus the terrible losses of the Russians in 1941.

Anyway, in 1941 the German Army moved against Stalin. At that point the situation in Poland and France changed. Germany no longer had the ability to control both countries and thus, especially in Poland, retreated to the main cities and the rail lines. The Rural Areas fell under the real control of the Poles. Now the Germans could still get food out of Poland, but paying for it instead of stealing it (and this is noted in reports to the Vatican, the situation in Poland improved with the attack on Russia). This permitted more and more actions by the parts of the Poles against the Germans. This included quite large number of troops, under armed but large. None that could attack and hold any urban areas, but large enough to keep all but the largest Germans forces along the lines of Supplies to the Army in Russia.

When the German Army failed to take Moscow, the situation in Russia deteriorated for the Germans. They main source of fuel had been cut off in June 1941, when they attacked it (i.e. Russia, which had been supplying something like 90% of the Fuel the Germans were using in 1941). Thus the German Army could no longer do a massive attack like it did in 1941. The German Army could still go on the Offensive, but only on one front (instead of the three attacks on Russia in 1941) and then it was more to secure a source of fuel then anything else (and it this it failed).

This further reduced the ability of the Germans to control the countryside of the lands behind their lines. It is into this inability that the Poles, Ukrainians, Belorussians etc all started to participate in guerrilla activities against the Germans (again much like Iraq AFTER Bush had declared the war over). The Germans in response tried to get local minorities to support they side against the people in armed revolt. For example Kosovo ended up supporting the Germans against the Serbs. The Croats were recruited against the Serbs and the Communists. Ukrainians were recruited to fight the Russians (and used against the Poles, but as to that the Ukrainians protested and were withdrawn).

In France, a similar situation developed, small groups fighting the Germans, tying up German resources (Through the most extensive Guerrilla activity was in Northern Italy after Italy had surrendered and the Allies moved up the Italian Peninsula, and like the situation in Serbia and France Communist dominated).

All of the above forces needed weapons, and did they best to make them, obtain them from the Germans or the Allies and to use them to tie up German forces. This is much like the situation in Iraq after the US took Baghdad, Guerrillas groups organized on a local level, using whatever arms they had, and commenced operations against the occupying power. Thus the real guerrillas war in Poland was from 1943 (some give 1942) to 1945 not from 1939. At the same time, weapons were needed and the Guerrilla did all they could to obtain them (including making some in Warsaw under the German's control). Unlike the Iraqis who had access to arms from Iran and Saudi Arabia, Poland was surrounded by German occupied or allied countries and thus had a hard time obtaining weapons.

Mao Tse Tung was doing the same in China, against both the Japanese and the Nationalist Government. The Key was organization first, then weapons. Even the Germans knew this, thus they desire to keep as many officers and NCOs in POW camps as possible. Notice it also required that most of the German Army be busy someplace else, thus permitting the maximum use of the little resources the Poles had on hand (and a plan to hold onto as much as possible to free Warsaw from German Hands as the Red Army neared Poland, this lead to the Polish 1944 revolt, that was put down by the Germans, as Stalin left the Red Army sit outside Warsaw till the Rebellion was crushed).

After the Germans were driven out of Poland, the Russians took over. Earlier Stalin had made some contact with the Polish Government in Exile but those contacts had broken off by 1944. Stalin thus looked to a Pole to rule Poland and proceeded to give the max support to the communist party in Poland.

People tend to forget, Stalin did NOT impose Communist rule on Poland and the rest of Europe that feel to him, he was smarter to do something like that. Instead Stalin permitted the locals to form a local government, but made sure the Communists were included and made sure the Communists members of the Government had access to resources, including money, food, material to rebuild etc (In fact Stalin opposed the Marshall Plan for it would undermine his control of the Rebuilding of Eastern Europe, and the reason the US did the Marshall Plan was to do to the areas under American Control what Stalin was doing to the area under Stalin's control, making sure the locals saw where the benefits they were getting was coming from, and thus NOT to revolt against the group that was suppling them with what they needed.

The Poles seem to accept Stalin's decision as to who should rule them, he made Poles in charge, he refused to do the Collectivization he had done in the Soviet Union and he removed many of the Germans speakers living in the new borders of Poland that he drew. Yes, Poland would have preferred to be free, but Stalin was not going to permit that, but he was going to make sure the people of Poland had little to complain about when it came to their position in Poland.

Back to the Germans. The Key was organization, which the Poles actually maintain during the German occupation and the later Soviet Domination. A guerrilla war was done only after 1941 for it could bring positive results only after 1941. Italy did the same, after 1943 and France, to a much more limited degree after Vichy France was taken over in the Spring of 1942.

The reason for the Guerrilla activities only starting after 1941, was prior to that date it would have been a waste of time, men and weapons. The German Army was supreme in Europe and NOT tied down with any other active conflict. Yes, Britain was still as war with German, and bombing Germany, but unable to invade Continental Europe without some help, and that meant US AND SOVIET help. When you look at American and the Soviet Union, Britain needed more the Soviet Union for it was ON the Continent, the Americas were restricted by transport (i.e. getting across the ocean) to provide the men needed to tie up to many German forces.

After 1941, both the Soviet Union and the US were at war with Hitler, with Hitler's failure to take Moscow in 1941, it was only a matter of time for the Soviet Union to get its act together and attack a fuel starved German Army. Thus Guerrilla activity promised to speed up the defeat of Germany (or maybe better treatment by the Germans as they try to secure their supply lines and fight off the Russians).

AS to weapons, this mean the use of them prior to 1941 would have been a waste, on the other hand after 1941 the Poles (and others) were telling the Germans they had to be dealt with. The Sunni Moslems in Iraq did the same with the American occupation, the Guerrilla attacks forced the American to deal with them, and the Americans did, they were paid off in exchange for peace. The Shiites had been paid off earlier with control of the Government (just like Stalin did in Poland and the rest of the countries he occupied in 1944 and 1945).

Remember Guerrilla war is only effective if you can maintain some areas of independence, maybe not all of the time, but huge areas. In 1939 the Poles could NOT do that, given their own disorganization due to they defeat AND the greater access to fuel, food, ammo and vehicles the Germans had. By 1941, the Poles had established an internal organization (The Home Army) and were getting they hands on some weapons AND the Germans had invaded Russia which reduced the number of troops the Germans could use against the Poles, but also Fuel and Ammo. Thus attacks occurred, for the Poles could control some areas for some time period so they could form up to launch such an attack AND retreat to with any Civilians who were worried about retaliation by the Germans. Thus the ability to control some land independent of the Germans permitted the Poles the ability to affect the maximum harm, and suffer the minimum damage. The same with the Sunni and Shiites in Iraq, until both were bought off, they did the same. The US had to pay them off OR send it more troops, troops the US could NOT obtain without the Draft (and that would have been the kiss of death to the War in Iraq to what support the war had in the US). Thus the US paid off the Shiites and then the Sunnis and then pulled out.