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Democracyinkind

(4,015 posts)

63. What you write is probably true for military drones as used in Iraq and Afghanistan

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 02:33 PM

Feb 2013

As pertains to the civilian - we assume it is CIA, although contractor involvement is confirmed at this point - assassination program that we are running; we are left to guess that these decisions are made in good faith. If we concentrate on a specific theater of operations, such as Waziristan, we can certainly say that not all of these decisions are made in good faith. The presence of "double dip" attacks and "signature strikes" exposes this undertaking as anything else than something done in good faith; it is Terrorism - it is perceived this way by the people of Waziristan (who suffer living under the drones as a bold experiment for humanity, and my suspicion is that it is intended that way. Coming from the interviews, I now believe what we are doing in Waziristan is only to a part targeted assassinations; to a larger part, it is a campaign of terror intended to send the message of "behave or be gone" to the general populace. It seems like a concerted effort to socially engineer Waziristan away from social structures that are conducive to Taliban and Al-Qaeda operations by using mass terror.

Overall, I agree with your assessment in the OP, almost on all points. Our military has definitely found a reasonable and responsible way to use these drones - checks and balances and all (sure, they too, make mistakes, but I'd wager to say that the system they came up with is as good as it gets). But what the CIA, and that odd cabal of contractors are playing - who really knows? I have stated my reasons for not believing their assertions. "Double Dip" and "Signature Strike" attacks are the very opposite of "surgical strike in a conflict short of war", as the Mighty Wurlitzer would have us believe.

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A Note On 'Drone Strikes', Ladies And Gentlemen [View all] The Magistrate Feb 2013 OP

DU rec... SidDithers Feb 2013 #1

-1 blkmusclmachine Feb 2013 #295

+2... SidDithers Feb 2013 #296

K & R. n/t FSogol Feb 2013 #2

You do realize that the problem that arises from treating terrorism as warfare... redgreenandblue Feb 2013 #3

The Chief Problem With Your Response, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #9

To emphasize your point, how many Americans either travel or live overseas vs how many stevenleser Feb 2013 #11

No, we do *not* know whether these decisions are made 'on a whim'. redgreenandblue Feb 2013 #13

Yes we do, from simple mathematics. How many Americans have traveled abroad stevenleser Feb 2013 #16

What Obama has done and what the powers enable any future president to do redgreenandblue Feb 2013 #21

It's really not. There is nothing expansive about this power unless you believe that stevenleser Feb 2013 #27

Stateless combatant groups have existed off and on for very, very, very, very long. JDPriestly Feb 2013 #108

They have existed for a long time. I think in some respects, drones and the corresponding AUMF stevenleser Feb 2013 #124

Mathematics? moodforaday Feb 2013 #205

No. stevenleser Feb 2013 #228

Slippery Slope, Sir, Is A Slippery Ground On Which To Take a Stand.... The Magistrate Feb 2013 #24

Slippery slope is precisely the issue with executive powers. redgreenandblue Feb 2013 #30

Present Needs Must Be Met, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #33

Obama will not fire a missle at Assange. redgreenandblue Feb 2013 #39

No One Will, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #53

No one knows that. You're a fool if you think unbelievable shit isn't possible. Dawgs Feb 2013 #68

No One Will Strike Mr. Assange With A Hell-Fire Missile, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #76

Bullshit. There is no way you can know that. Dawgs Feb 2013 #80

No One Will Strike Mr. Assange With A Hell-Fire Missile, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #90

You or I can't prove it, so the only one that's pretending is you. n/t Dawgs Feb 2013 #131

No one (except for someone listening to John Yoo.) OnyxCollie Feb 2013 #164

I am astonished that you would repeat such a statement, Sir. malthaussen Feb 2013 #176

I Will Happily Repeat It Again, Sir: No One Will Strike Mr. Assange With A Hell-Fire Missile The Magistrate Feb 2013 #178

Pfui, Sir, such an argument amounts to nothing more malthaussen Feb 2013 #187

"Which is all very well if your wish is only to thunder in rhetorical periods..." cleanhippie Feb 2013 #298

Would all the idiots who believe the earth may implode LanternWaste Feb 2013 #199

Common sense has nothing to do with logic, dude. n/t malthaussen Feb 2013 #202

You're not serious because HE SAYS you're not serious. :-) eom tledford Feb 2013 #183

Bush didn't unilaterally make the decision to invade Iraq because.... OldDem2012 Feb 2013 #100

I didn't say that exact same thing could or would happen again. Dawgs Feb 2013 #129

Assange is only an example. redgreenandblue Feb 2013 #112

There are a lot of questionable assumptions in your argument, The Magistrate. JDPriestly Feb 2013 #113

Thank you for saying this, redgreen. Practically everyone who supports the drone strikes truth2power Feb 2013 #69

Let's deal with reality, shall we? Kelvin Mace Feb 2013 #44

It seems that Cheney, Rice, Wolfowitz and others decided to attack Iraq amandabeech Feb 2013 #138

My point exactly Kelvin Mace Feb 2013 #145

I'm with you on this. amandabeech Feb 2013 #161

People need to remember that Kelvin Mace Feb 2013 #169

Many lawyers get so deep in the minutiae of decisions, regulation, etc., amandabeech Feb 2013 #180

Precisely! Kelvin Mace Feb 2013 #185

A lawyer's job is to represent his or her client's interests. amandabeech Feb 2013 #190

Well put. At the risk of triggering Godwin's Law, I would note that Nazi Germany coalition_unwilling Feb 2013 #253

Perhaps you meant..."The Correct Thing to Do" for the Common Good? KoKo Feb 2013 #300

It was actually the exact opposite of a whim... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #290

I'm well aware of the PNAC. I can't believe that anyone posting here would not be. amandabeech Feb 2013 #297

Flimsy? Yes. Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #299

Perhaps I should have used a different word. amandabeech Feb 2013 #301

My reply was harsh? Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #312

Well, you're obviously not a nice person, wherever you're from. amandabeech Feb 2013 #323

Ahem... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #337

It's PNAC, not PANC elias7 Feb 2013 #388

No. You're just experiencing some mild dyslexia. Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #392

What you write is probably true for military drones as used in Iraq and Afghanistan Democracyinkind Feb 2013 #63

you should do more research Warren Stupidity Feb 2013 #81

Certainly We Have Killed a Number Of Non-Combatants, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #99

We are not in any valid sense of the phrase, restricting drone strikes to Warren Stupidity Feb 2013 #123

I Disagree, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #173

"You know perfectly well these decisions are not made on a whim;" But they are made Vincardog Feb 2013 #101

I Hold No Brief For 'War On Terror', Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #106

You limit the discussion to your specific situation. In reality the argument is against a Vincardog Feb 2013 #126

There is always recourse. Congress can impeach him. That is the Constitutional recourse. nt stevenleser Feb 2013 #135

Without notice or review, how would Congress know the facts of the crime? Vincardog Feb 2013 #137

Part of the impeachment process is discovery. nt stevenleser Feb 2013 #139

I prefer an easier means of correction. Checks and Balances. The American way. Vincardog Feb 2013 #143

That IS the check and balance on the Presidency. And it is the American and Constitutional way. nt stevenleser Feb 2013 #146

My argument is that the power to kill without notice review or oversight is unconstitutional. We Vincardog Feb 2013 #148

I argue we are talking combatants in a war, as does the Magistrate and many others. stevenleser Feb 2013 #150

So you are arguing to Unlimited unconstrained executive power? Vincardog Feb 2013 #153

I reread the magistrates OP. I can't see that anywhere. Can you cite? nt stevenleser Feb 2013 #154

Did you read my post? Can you defend your position? Or are you saying I agree with the Vincardog Feb 2013 #156

I'm saying I agree with the magistrate's OP. In fact, in a rather long OP, I cannot find anything on stevenleser Feb 2013 #158

I have seen you "parse legal language" ..I've disagreed with you in past KoKo Feb 2013 #303

Much Appreciated, Ma'am The Magistrate Feb 2013 #349

"decide on a whim" is totally irrelevant moodforaday Feb 2013 #207

Obama Equals Stalin, Sir: Got It --- Points For Mention Of Felix, Though.... The Magistrate Feb 2013 #208

I think your 'straw man' is a bit unfair. The person to whom you are coalition_unwilling Feb 2013 #256

There Is a Stalin Correlary To Godwin's Law, Sir, Or there Ought to Be The Magistrate Feb 2013 #258

Well put. - n/t coalition_unwilling Feb 2013 #251

ditto, this stuff is not 'decided on a whim' pasto76 Feb 2013 #331

Except political suicide and impeachment. randome Feb 2013 #10

Actually there is as defined in their rules. It would not be permitted on us soil still_one Feb 2013 #203

Stop reading my mind. WilliamPitt Feb 2013 #4

Thank You, Mr.Pitt The Magistrate Feb 2013 #26

Message auto-removed i am taking a_luvvah Feb 2013 #47

Thank You and rec nt independentpiney Feb 2013 #5

Why are there people who don't like the US? leftstreet Feb 2013 #6

Because the U.S. has done some evil things, but that does not mean that everyone who patrice Feb 2013 #109

I am conflicted on this, but good post. longship Feb 2013 #7

It is a conversation that we MUST have. annabanana Feb 2013 #278

Well said and I agree 100% nt stevenleser Feb 2013 #8

would you say that also applies within the United States? quinnox Feb 2013 #12

What's the difference between a drone strike and a firefight that kills the suspect? randome Feb 2013 #14

ever read the declaration of independence? quinnox Feb 2013 #22

They don't have those rights when they commit crimes in other countries. randome Feb 2013 #29

The troubling drone attacks are not the ones that target enemies during fighting. JDPriestly Feb 2013 #117

Our government is ALWAYS constrained by the constitution, it is the source of TheKentuckian Feb 2013 #201

Why do you jump to the conclusion that a suspected terrorist will engage in a firefight? Luminous Animal Feb 2013 #28

I agree, within the United States, when possible, use of lethal force should be avoided. randome Feb 2013 #32

Your scenario is conjecture. Conjecture doesn't cut it for me particularly Luminous Animal Feb 2013 #48

Of course it's conjecture. So is the idea that Obama is planning to assassinate political enemies. randome Feb 2013 #66

Would a warning shot help? DaveJ Feb 2013 #121

A firefight has to be started by someone. JDPriestly Feb 2013 #116

Then there are those who participate in firefights by building bombs in a basement. randome Feb 2013 #132

If you have evidence that someone is building a bomb somewhere out of your jurisdiction, JDPriestly Feb 2013 #140

Part of this is the immense distances involved. randome Feb 2013 #151

IEDs are only useful locally. If they are a danger to our troops engaged in war, then drones JDPriestly Feb 2013 #159

ALL targeting is based on intelligence that may or may not be reliable. randome Feb 2013 #167

Last night I woke up with the horrible question as to whether we are capable of stopping foreign JDPriestly Feb 2013 #280

Our first drone kill of an american citizen was against a person who ran a web site. Warren Stupidity Feb 2013 #177

He Was A Recruiter And Lead Propagandist, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #181

The ground begins to look less firm and the stance taken less reasonable. Bonobo Feb 2013 #218

If I Am Solipsistic, Sir, You Would Have a Hard Time Proving To Me You Exist.... The Magistrate Feb 2013 #219

LOL. Well played! cliffordu Feb 2013 #289

I would suggest that you do a little more reading up on Mr. Awlaki's involvement msanthrope Feb 2013 #357

True, Ma'am The Magistrate Feb 2013 #358

"Non-violent" was how one long-time DUer described him. msanthrope Feb 2013 #359

One Is Reminded Of A Passage From Mr.Orwell, Ma'am The Magistrate Feb 2013 #361

"A louse is a louse...." All this handwringing over a man who would kill every one of us, without msanthrope Feb 2013 #362

People Who Are Themselves Good-Hearted, Ma'am The Magistrate Feb 2013 #381

I am a criminal defense attorney. I am far more cynical than that--people adopt the stance of msanthrope Feb 2013 #382

Unsurprising that DUer would defend a murderous terrorist. joshcryer Feb 2013 #389

That isn't the issue though. There doesn't have to be a clear and present threat. TheKentuckian Feb 2013 #206

Isn't this, in apart, about accessability? Sheepshank Feb 2013 #15

It Would Seem Excessive To Me, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #18

thanks for the answer quinnox Feb 2013 #19

And 'employing military means' at the request of that country's government. randome Feb 2013 #20

John Yoo disagrees. OnyxCollie Feb 2013 #114

I believe it could, conceivably, be exercised. joshcryer Feb 2013 #198

That's the piece I was looking for. Sparkly Feb 2013 #231

No - we have the LAPD to take care of that shit. cliffordu Feb 2013 #288

We need better, independent oversight, Sir. bemildred Feb 2013 #17

There Will Be Errors, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #23

Face it. The type of governance you are advocating is authoritarianism. redgreenandblue Feb 2013 #36

I Am Recognizing What is In Fact Present, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #78

Amazing what 5 years can do to people LittleBlue Feb 2013 #182

Indeed Sir, and drones will be misused, and for expediency's sake, and that is the problem. bemildred Feb 2013 #37

It Is a Very Seductive Weapon, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #88

You appear to be in favor of a monarchy or a dictatorship, sir. JDPriestly Feb 2013 #122

The courts DO have a place in war. RC Feb 2013 #155

Who would you like to suggest as the provider of "better, independent oversight"?.... OldDem2012 Feb 2013 #34

It's not really a tricky question unless you are worried about avoiding oversight. bemildred Feb 2013 #40

Is Congress At Present Even Capable Of Doing Its Job, Sir? The Magistrate Feb 2013 #51

One assumes the capability is there Sir. bemildred Feb 2013 #54

House votes 253-167 to require balanced budget date from Obama bemildred Feb 2013 #60

I Appreciate Your Making My Point For Me, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #64

Quite. A matter of emphasis perhaps. bemildred Feb 2013 #77

... leftstreet Feb 2013 #79

All that work on forcing a budget Paulie Feb 2013 #328

For the FISA court there a judge on call 24/7 SpartanDem Feb 2013 #57

Exactly. nt bemildred Feb 2013 #61

Possibly....but would they be ready to make decisions involving life and death.... OldDem2012 Feb 2013 #83

At last someone has come up with an alternative! randome Feb 2013 #84

Well-reasoned argument. Thank you. nt. OldDem2012 Feb 2013 #25

While I disagree with you - I wish you wrote xchrom Feb 2013 #31

I was contemplating writing an OP on this Tom Rinaldo Feb 2013 #35

I Am Not Particularly Happy About It Either, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #43

Hard, but I think worthy of a good faith effort Tom Rinaldo Feb 2013 #62

Just a point Kelvin Mace Feb 2013 #38

al'Alawi, Sir, Did Adhere To A Body Engaged In Hostilities Against The United States The Magistrate Feb 2013 #49

Again, based upon what evidence? Kelvin Mace Feb 2013 #144

Question: who is to decide? Taverner Feb 2013 #41

Persons Willing To Abuse This, Sir, Would Act As They Will, Precedent Or No The Magistrate Feb 2013 #45

Labor Organizers are murdered by government agency TODAY Taverner Feb 2013 #50

True, Sir, On a World-Wide Basis The Magistrate Feb 2013 #59

Sometimes it's just a matter of "blessing" them. See: Salvador Allende Taverner Feb 2013 #70

A well stated point of view Still Sensible Feb 2013 #42

Excellent analysis as always, Magistrate. malthaussen Feb 2013 #46

Yes, that bothered me, too dreamnightwind Feb 2013 #238

Very well said. Thank you. n/t MirrorAshes Feb 2013 #52

Then let's get those drones trained on the Far-Right Militias! WinkyDink Feb 2013 #55

I think your point on insurrection is important. JoePhilly Feb 2013 #56

Your problem is you are blindly accepting YOUR definition of drone strike as justifiction rustydog Feb 2013 #58

Just curious, but how many Confederate soldiers were afforded the protections of Amendment 6..... OldDem2012 Feb 2013 #165

So could they have taken out David Koresh? G_j Feb 2013 #65

He was Dealt With By Ordinary Police Power, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #73

In other words, yes.. nt G_j Feb 2013 #96

Actually, no. And beyond that, the point is moot. ConservativeDemocrat Feb 2013 #281

Did he pose an imminent threat? G_j Feb 2013 #287

The DOJ Memo... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #292

I don't think all your words trump the simplicity of the Constitution on the matter. xtraxritical Feb 2013 #67

Good essay, I disagree on some points. Warren Stupidity Feb 2013 #71

I generally trust Obama not to abuse this power. Nye Bevan Feb 2013 #72

That has been my feeling on this and other thorny issues. DCBob Feb 2013 #279

Well sir... 99Forever Feb 2013 #74

Did the Confederates in the Civil War receive this "due process" ? ConservativeDemocrat Feb 2013 #282

So now two wrongs make a right? 99Forever Feb 2013 #284

I do not consider preserving the Union and breaking the back of slavery to be a "wrong"... ConservativeDemocrat Feb 2013 #329

Any means to an end, right friend? 99Forever Feb 2013 #330

If ending slavery requires violence, so be it. ConservativeDemocrat Feb 2013 #360

Two May Not, Sir, But Three Do.... The Magistrate Feb 2013 #342

To the armchair, Monday morning quarterbacks .... Raggaemon Feb 2013 #75

The US has 17+ Intelligence Agencies leftstreet Feb 2013 #85

Even the Sunday quarterbacks have to play within the rules of the game TheKentuckian Feb 2013 #233

Well reasoned argument. nt Progressive dog Feb 2013 #82

Drones are a must have to support our Democratic allies think Feb 2013 #86

a heaven05 Feb 2013 #87

Isn't this what we all wanted? deminks Feb 2013 #89

Message auto-removed shelly_moskwa Feb 2013 #91

Shit, that's bad enough I am tempted to alert on you. randome Feb 2013 #95

I don't necessarily agree with categorizing these people as belligerent parties alcibiades_mystery Feb 2013 #92

Given the nature of terrorism ProSense Feb 2013 #93

I understand your view, The Magistrate. JDPriestly Feb 2013 #94

"If drones are to be used as weapons..." randome Feb 2013 #98

Grenades, machine guns, bayonets, etc. are generally used in war zones. JDPriestly Feb 2013 #147

Expecting Obama or anyone else to adhere to the Golden Rule or the Categorical Imperative of Kant... randome Feb 2013 #149

How do you know whether someone is a part of the Taliban? That is part of the problem. JDPriestly Feb 2013 #160

It's more than just the Taliban. I should have listed others we know about. randome Feb 2013 #166

A Few Points, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #172

K&R. A Never Ending War with American citizens potentially targeted think Feb 2013 #263

+1. sagat Feb 2013 #97

Drone Strikes Are Acts of War triplepoint Feb 2013 #102

When we are invited by other countries to use them? I don't see that happening. randome Feb 2013 #103

Invited........... think Feb 2013 #104

Pakistan also provided intelligence about OBL's whereabouts then denied to their people they did so. randome Feb 2013 #115

You realize that we did have drones operating out of Pakistan with permission at one time stevenleser Feb 2013 #162

Do we have permission now? Seriously.......... think Feb 2013 #179

Maybe we should start calling them "buzz bombs" to make it clear. nt bananas Feb 2013 #240

GOP Rep. On Drone Strikes: �There Is Oversight� Great Cthulhu Feb 2013 #105

Bullshit whatchamacallit Feb 2013 #107

Brevity Is Said To Be a Virtue, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #110

Looks like your opinion is consistent with John Bolton's sadalien Feb 2013 #111

If one engages in violence against civilization, no matter the cause, then civilization has the Yavin4 Feb 2013 #118

No problem with using drones against people engaged in violence against civilization. JDPriestly Feb 2013 #127

Let me offer you a slight counterpoint...two actually. nadinbrzezinski Feb 2013 #119

I've never bought the idea that you'll see armed drone use in the US SpartanDem Feb 2013 #133

Well there was a time people said nadinbrzezinski Feb 2013 #136

Not for a while yet, no. sibelian Feb 2013 #168

Thank you for writing your Cha Feb 2013 #120

Still it's easy to identify your enemies infantry, they have uniforms SpartanDem Feb 2013 #125

Solution: Only fight wars on "Casual Friday" (nt) Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #130

It sucked when Bush did it, it is awesome now the Obama does it AngryAmish Feb 2013 #128

I don't think anyone is saying this is 'awesome'. randome Feb 2013 #134

Nor can that person point to anyone who said it sucked that Bush did it and now is in favor nt stevenleser Feb 2013 #142

Except they weren't here defending Bush G_j Feb 2013 #163

Exactly. It's that kind of hyperbole that Cha Feb 2013 #157

Baron von Raschke! OnyxCollie Feb 2013 #141

Thank You! Tarheel_Dem Feb 2013 #152

Excellent post. K&R. DevonRex Feb 2013 #170

I'll say this much for my liberal brethren: Marr Feb 2013 #171

This web site's in danger of having its name changed to D Yoo. Efilroft Sul Feb 2013 #212

There's nothing I could add to that but Marr Feb 2013 #220

Nonesense, Ma'am The Magistrate Feb 2013 #244

And here is what is unreasonable about the policy. Efilroft Sul Feb 2013 #259

I Agree With The Definition Employed, Ma'am The Magistrate Feb 2013 #262

You're omitting one important element. Fantastic Anarchist Feb 2013 #174

That pretty much describes a defacto war to me. stevenleser Feb 2013 #184

Doesn't describe it for me. Fantastic Anarchist Feb 2013 #195

As always, thanks for the clarity of a well-thought-out essay Hekate Feb 2013 #175

Can't add a word to what you wrote. K&R. David Zephyr Feb 2013 #186

Thanks for this n/t malaise Feb 2013 #188

A bold choice sir, and much appreciated quaker bill Feb 2013 #189

Reverse the situation Flying Squirrel Feb 2013 #191

The Situation Does Not Reverse Quite That Simply, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #192

So you do support the right of other countries to attack within our country with drones Flying Squirrel Feb 2013 #193

I Strive To Apply a Uniform Standard, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #194

John Bolton said about the same with much less verbiage. That's got to make you feel good. Bluenorthwest Feb 2013 #196

If He Agrees With Me, Sir, Then For Once In His Wretched Life He Has Stumbled Into A Correct View The Magistrate Feb 2013 #197

Actually Bolton was defending Bush era policies sadalien Feb 2013 #209

Do Not Try And Teach Your Grandmother To Suck Eggs, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #210

I'm sorry I don't get your little folksy witticisms sadalien Feb 2013 #213

Although I disagree with your premise... LanternWaste Feb 2013 #200

Thank you, Magistrate. Well stated. jazzimov Feb 2013 #204

So basically, any abuse by any authority can be justified if you make up situations. I get it. n-t Logical Feb 2013 #211

A good summation followed by a dereliction of responsibility to the precedent being set. Bonobo Feb 2013 #214

As Said Once Up-Thread, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #216

That is a very good point. However there is an argument to be made that by codifying it into law, Bonobo Feb 2013 #221

But It has Not Been Coded Into Law, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #223

Good point. Bonobo Feb 2013 #225

This part explains my position perfectly: cliffordu Feb 2013 #215

So you would do away with all constitutional provisions to rights guaranteed by same to Americans lonestarnot Feb 2013 #217

So I bought my first drone and used it today The Straight Story Feb 2013 #222

Nonesense Of This Grade is Beneath Your Dignity, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #224

Letting a few in power do this The Straight Story Feb 2013 #227

Great analogy. OnyxCollie Feb 2013 #327

After reading a portion of the thread BootinUp Feb 2013 #226

Article III section 3 westerebus Feb 2013 #229

That is A Criminal Charge, Sir, For Someone Taken Alive The Magistrate Feb 2013 #230

Glad to see the spirit intact, my good sir. westerebus Feb 2013 #232

You Mistake The Point, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #234

War has not been declared unless you know other wise... westerebus Feb 2013 #235

We Are Getting Deep Into 'Say Something Once, Why Say It Again?' Territory, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #236

I respectfully agree, good sir. westerebus Feb 2013 #265

Congress broadly authorized war on September 14th, 2001 bhikkhu Feb 2013 #257

What was authorized was a "state of emergency". westerebus Feb 2013 #271

What was authorized was war: "all necessary and appropriate force" bhikkhu Feb 2013 #307

Worth Re-Reading,Sir: People Forget Just How Sweeping That Language Is.... The Magistrate Feb 2013 #310

I stand corrected. westerebus Feb 2013 #320

For the record, I thought it was a bad road to go down, and a bad way to do it bhikkhu Feb 2013 #324

For the record, you lack the conviction of your initial impression on just how bad this would get. westerebus Feb 2013 #326

Does this include people in another country riding in a vehicle on the way to the store? The Straight Story Feb 2013 #239

Often Combatants Are Killed, Sir, Whilst Doing Nothing Particularly Combative At The Moment The Magistrate Feb 2013 #241

Or hitchhiking a ride with a college student and teacher, who died The Straight Story Feb 2013 #245

Five Combatants, Two Non-Combatants, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #246

Can you expand on what they were combating? The Straight Story Feb 2013 #248

You Can Do Better Than This, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #255

Again, are we at war in yemen? The Straight Story Feb 2013 #260

Members Of A Body We Are Engaged In Hostilities With Are, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #264

A willing ally indeed, when we kill innocents there they claim it is their airplanes doing it The Straight Story Feb 2013 #266

Your Use Of 'Suspects', Sir, Points Up The Problem With This Discussion The Magistrate Feb 2013 #267

Combatants The Straight Story Feb 2013 #269

These Apply To Persons Captured, Sir, Not To Engagement With Combatant Persons The Magistrate Feb 2013 #270

So I guess things like this are ok as well (I don't see much difference in drones and this:) The Straight Story Feb 2013 #321

That, Sir, Would Seem To Come Under "SNAFU' The Magistrate Feb 2013 #322

Bookmarking to read later. freshwest Feb 2013 #237

In essence, you think a moderate degree of "martial law" is an appropriate response redgreenandblue Feb 2013 #242

I Consider Addressing Such Acts As Crimes A Proper Course, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #243

Good, thoughtful piece. It does seem to me that the U.S. government seeks to have its cake and coalition_unwilling Feb 2013 #247

I Agree, Sir, We Are In Grave Breach Of Geneva Conventions On Treatment Of Prisoners The Magistrate Feb 2013 #250

Juan Cole: Top Five Objections to the White House�s Drone Killing Memo Hissyspit Feb 2013 #249

I Disagree With His Analysis, Ma'am The Magistrate Feb 2013 #252

I do remember the debates about the wide-open interpretations Hissyspit Feb 2013 #261

Well said, and I fully agree bhikkhu Feb 2013 #254

Excellent piece and very thought provoking. Javaman Feb 2013 #268

One might ask the OP to consider the best strategy for the Executive Vinnie From Indy Feb 2013 #272

A Few Answers, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #276

just a question--I work near a research facility MisterP Feb 2013 #273

I Expect The Drill, Sir, Would Be The Old 'Bend Over And Kiss Your Ass Good-Bye' Routine The Magistrate Feb 2013 #275

You make a good argument... awoke_in_2003 Feb 2013 #274

This message was self-deleted by its author limpyhobbler Feb 2013 #277

The killing of Anwar al-Awlaki may have been legal or otherwise justifiable azurnoir Feb 2013 #283

+1 uponit7771 Feb 2013 #285

K&r... spanone Feb 2013 #286

Under Obama and Bush, the United States has grown up bucolic_frolic Feb 2013 #291

They learned a lesson or two from Kim Philby... AntiFascist Feb 2013 #305

kicked, rec'd and bookmarked eom arely staircase Feb 2013 #293

Well said! I agree southern_belle Feb 2013 #294

Just admit it: You are an object Taverner Feb 2013 #302

You Know, Sir, There Are Sites Which Cater To That Sort Of Thing... The Magistrate Feb 2013 #304

Sir, we should talk Taverner Feb 2013 #306

Tavener...understand what you are saying. KoKo Feb 2013 #308

forget the " Terrorists "... dtom67 Feb 2013 #309

Again, Sir: Slippery Slope Is Not Solid Ground on Which To Take A Stand The Magistrate Feb 2013 #311

K & R Scurrilous Feb 2013 #313

. Ian Iam Feb 2013 #314

And, Sir, If You Are Offering Video Entertainment.... The Magistrate Feb 2013 #315

There must be some mathematical correlation between Bonobo Feb 2013 #316

The Mathematical Correlation, Sir, Is With the Degree Of Precision In Communication Desired The Magistrate Feb 2013 #317

As I learned when I dabbled with Darts... Bonobo Feb 2013 #318

But Precise Execution, Sir, Is Necessary To Accuracy, Certainly To Accuracy Sustained Over Time... The Magistrate Feb 2013 #319

The message is inherent in your posting style, "sir". We all knew you'd find some excuse. Romulox Feb 2013 #336

Glad That You Suffered No Disappointment, Sir.... The Magistrate Feb 2013 #350

We have actually faced, as a nation, this dilemma *twice* before: apocalypsehow Feb 2013 #325

We have raised a few thousand disconnected radicals to the dignity of a state jpgray Feb 2013 #332

As Noted In The Initial Comment, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #338

People will draw the line differently no doubt - but there is something to remember jpgray Feb 2013 #365

I Am Certain Mistakes Have Been, And Will Be, Made, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #367

that's some hilarious and insulting nonsense stupidicus Feb 2013 #333

If You Want To Consider Yourself Insulted, Sir, Wear It In Good Health The Magistrate Feb 2013 #339

who said I did? stupidicus Feb 2013 #343

So Much Effort, Sir, And For So Little Effect.... The Magistrate Feb 2013 #344

hardly stupidicus Feb 2013 #345

You Are Getting A Little More Proportionate, Sir.... The Magistrate Feb 2013 #346

I thought so stupidicus Feb 2013 #347

Well, At Least You Think You Thought, Sir.... The Magistrate Feb 2013 #348

and I apparently articulated those thoughts with so much depth and breadth stupidicus Feb 2013 #371

Bit Late, Sir, For That Attempt At Snappy Rejoinder To Have Any Sting.... The Magistrate Feb 2013 #374

bit late for continued dodging to help you stupidicus Feb 2013 #387

Trusting the inherently untrustworthy never leads to anything good eridani Feb 2013 #334

While You Say You 'Get It', Ma'am, You Show Remarkably Few Signs Of Having Done So The Magistrate Feb 2013 #340

Our foreign policy mainly serves imperial bullying, and is mostly untrustworthy for that reason eridani Feb 2013 #363

That May Well Be True, Ma'am The Magistrate Feb 2013 #366

Given that most data used is suspect, the policy is wrong, and will likely backfire eridani Feb 2013 #368

I Think That Here, Ma'am, You Are Getting Out a Bit Ahead Of What Can Be Taken As Fact The Magistrate Feb 2013 #375

I saw the OP's name, and KNEW this was going to be a huge excuse/justification. Romulox Feb 2013 #335

K&R - nt Ohio Joe Feb 2013 #341

Very well stated ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2013 #351

Senator Angus King (Maine) wants oversight: mainer Feb 2013 #352

If A Workable Arrangement Can Be Made, Sir, I Certainly Would Not Object The Magistrate Feb 2013 #354

To read later snagglepuss Feb 2013 #353

Excellent post. I think you explain the situation very well, and I think you would msanthrope Feb 2013 #355

Thank You,Ma'am: Much Appreciated The Magistrate Feb 2013 #356

Hear! Hear! Or whatever a magistrate... reACTIONary Feb 2013 #364

I don't believe your last line, not one bit... Humanist_Activist Feb 2013 #369

You Are Free To Be Mistaken, Sir The Magistrate Feb 2013 #372

All I see are people who sacrifice long term solutions for short term satisfaction... Humanist_Activist Feb 2013 #383

Doesn't fit within familiar categories? caseymoz Feb 2013 #370

Deliberate Misunderstandings, Sir, Help Make The Point: Thank You For Your Assistance The Magistrate Feb 2013 #373

No, I didn't misunderstand you. caseymoz Feb 2013 #377

It would seem that ad homs, couched in eloquent prose, are the new MO. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #378

Why Should I Want To Impress You, Sir? The Magistrate Feb 2013 #379

I'm supposing you posted to be persuasive. caseymoz Feb 2013 #385

Message auto-removed SquirrelHill4444 Feb 2013 #376

Outstanding Sir. great white snark Feb 2013 #380

The correct term for this, Sir, is "whitesplaining". redgreenandblue Feb 2013 #384

I Expect, Sir, That Strikes You As Devastatingly Witty And Cogent.... The Magistrate Feb 2013 #386

Assuming there is Congressional oversight... Benton D Struckcheon Feb 2013 #393

A very well put together explanation except... Oakenshield Feb 2013 #390

Nice reasoning but the fact is that the primary reason for the US being in Zorra Feb 2013 #391