General Discussion

Silent3

(15,909 posts)

264. How do people make decisions without information?

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:18 PM

Feb 2013

People openly discussing topics like the OP is a big part of how information gets "out there" for others to have it as part of their decision making process.

It's ridiculous to think that expressing opinions like the OP is some sort of horrible infringement on.... well, what exactly? A person's supposed "right" to base decisions only on information (or disinformation) they already possess or actively seek out, perhaps without ever having stumbled across a reason to seek out more information because so many people around them were following a ridiculous standard of politeness or non-interference by keeping their opinions to themselves"?

What do you recommend? A world where all non-specialists keep their opinions to themselves, and where specialists keep their advice and knowledge to themselves until people actively seek it out? And this world would the proper world where people's decision are "their own"?

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Do you use Homeopathic "remedies"? Do you understand just what it is you are taking? [View all] cleanhippie Feb 2013 OP

People often buy things that statistically cause them more harm than good. Robb Feb 2013 #1

Perhaps, but homeopathy is proven to be false. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #3

Applying common sense to either would save lives. Robb Feb 2013 #6

Maybe, but I want to bring attention to the scam that is Homepathy. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #12

I appreciate your efforts to help educate people. eShirl Feb 2013 #67

Agreed, these terms are not interchangeable. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #69

So your point is to decry what a 'sham and scam' homeopathy is. icymist Feb 2013 #215

Really? MattBaggins Feb 2013 #233

I'm not sure, But I am sure of what it isn't; science based medicine. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #244

Homeopathic medicine is water. ZombieHorde Feb 2013 #276

Look now. I don't really care what you guys think. icymist Feb 2013 #299

+1! bama_blue_dot Feb 2013 #300

Respect? You want respect for ignoring reality? Really? cleanhippie Feb 2013 #301

umm. a belief in god defies reality. but I still respect people who believe in god. robinlynne Feb 2013 #302

I too, respect people who believe in a god. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #303

Yes, I see that A LOT on here obamanut2012 Feb 2013 #126

That's what I always thought. Good to know. cui bono Feb 2013 #242

That's not true, as far as I know. Modern medicine is derived from homemade plant medications Honeycombe8 Feb 2013 #305

...a LOT of cayenne pepper. Hardly homeopathic. SwissTony Feb 2013 #306

I think that you may be mistaken on what "homeopathy" actually is. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #308

But But But... "Water has mem'ry!!!!" Democracyinkind Feb 2013 #2

Agreed. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #4

"Molecular memory" has caused me more bruised foreheads than any other phrase Recursion Feb 2013 #7

A mean prank just came to my mind: DetlefK Feb 2013 #10

I was just going to write something about oceans and pissing ;) Democracyinkind Feb 2013 #31

Aha! But that's not what homeopathy says. longship Feb 2013 #32

Not to mention the whole problem of "in some patients" MattBaggins Feb 2013 #98

I've been studying the history of homeopathy in America - it's actually rather fascinating derby378 Feb 2013 #5

Didn't the "pro-science" wing turn into osteopathy? Recursion Feb 2013 #8

Osteopathy grew out of the chriopractic movement, I think derby378 Feb 2013 #11

It is quite fascinating. And the way people have been duped into believing it works is not unlike cleanhippie Feb 2013 #13

I'm always on the lookout for someone proposing a return to humorism. FSogol Feb 2013 #9

We read Galen in college. It's actually kind of fascinating Recursion Feb 2013 #14

I'll do you one better: Trepanation name not needed Feb 2013 #279

Heh-heh from Wiki: FSogol Feb 2013 #286

Anyone here used Arnica Montana to control swelling after surgery? Nye Bevan Feb 2013 #15

I think that would be considered "natural" medicine, not homeopathy. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #16

There are homeopathic preparations of Arnica Montana. Heidi Feb 2013 #19

I would feel differently about an extract of AM, but any Homeopathic version is cause for alarm. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #20

Exactly. Heidi Feb 2013 #21

Good morning to you, Heidi! cleanhippie Feb 2013 #25

This message was self-deleted by its author Heidi Feb 2013 #40

There are homeopathic preparations of dog shit... SidDithers Feb 2013 #86

What is that supposed to treat? Incontinence? eShirl Feb 2013 #91

! Heidi Feb 2013 #164

Agreed timdog44 Feb 2013 #255

You treat Republicanism with it? jmowreader Feb 2013 #252

Nailed it!...nt SidDithers Feb 2013 #260

A Friend Used Only AM After Surgery otohara Feb 2013 #197

I had a coronary bypass two summers ago MattBaggins Feb 2013 #214

I have used Arnica bama_blue_dot Feb 2013 #54

Do you have a double blind study to support the claim MattBaggins Feb 2013 #181

Nope, sorry.. bama_blue_dot Feb 2013 #188

Not even remotely MattBaggins Feb 2013 #192

You obviously need a blind study bama_blue_dot Feb 2013 #199

This is about Science MattBaggins Feb 2013 #208

What exactly do you mean bama_blue_dot Feb 2013 #258

I did not mean like that MattBaggins Feb 2013 #262

no obamanut2012 Feb 2013 #227

I've used it on my foot Retrograde Feb 2013 #177

Try it- you might be surprised! ellaydubya Feb 2013 #278

I use arnica Dorian Gray Feb 2013 #288

I use homeopathetic eye drops. Atman Feb 2013 #17

Could you not get the same result from using a saline solution instead? cleanhippie Feb 2013 #18

I don't deny that it seems goofy. Atman Feb 2013 #23

I agree with your disdain of chemicals in Visine. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #28

you are now giving medical advice JanMichael Feb 2013 #35

This message was self-deleted by its author cleanhippie Feb 2013 #39

Not only have I been at DU since almost JanMichael Feb 2013 #44

Who cares how long you have been here or who you know. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #48

you deleted it, but you accused me of "trolling" JanMichael Feb 2013 #53

No, you made an inference, I implied no such thing. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #59

You wrote "go troll another thread." Of course you are "done." JanMichael Feb 2013 #63

Good for you! Thank you for your opinion, I appreciate it. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #65

+1 green for victory Feb 2013 #73

Discussing the relative merits of OTC products is not kestrel91316 Feb 2013 #99

He knows that. Most would recognize ridiculous comments like that for what they are. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #105

ahhhh there's that word again JanMichael Feb 2013 #108

Never denied using the word "trolling." cleanhippie Feb 2013 #112

you most certainly did. The problem is that you did not delete JanMichael Feb 2013 #116

Yawn. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #118

You are aware as a Feline Veterinarian that the term "medical advice" JanMichael Feb 2013 #113

Ok, thank you for your concern. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #120

You would rather drop a chemical in your eye than drop a chemical in your eye? MattBaggins Feb 2013 #26

What is confusing you? Atman Feb 2013 #34

Mercurius sublimatus in similason dry eyes remedy MattBaggins Feb 2013 #42

Are you reading the same website I am? cleanhippie Feb 2013 #56

Yeah, that was kind of my point. Atman Feb 2013 #70

I have a degree in biology MattBaggins Feb 2013 #76

Ahh, I see. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #78

The point is MattBaggins Feb 2013 #85

I agree, but don't you think people are implying a slightly different meaning? cleanhippie Feb 2013 #102

You Are Much Nicer RobinA Feb 2013 #140

What do you care bama_blue_dot Feb 2013 #58

Homeopathy is not just some innocent form of CAM MattBaggins Feb 2013 #83

So everything that is FDA approved bama_blue_dot Feb 2013 #88

bzzzzt... wrong answer MattBaggins Feb 2013 #90

Yea, way to avoid the question.. bama_blue_dot Feb 2013 #92

It wasn't a true question MattBaggins Feb 2013 #95

Your "question" is ridiculous and deserves nothing more than what it got. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #107

I didn't realize that diluted opiates weren't chemicals CreekDog Feb 2013 #51

To be fair, in a homeopathic application, there would be no chemicals at all. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #52

Water's a chemical in itself... derby378 Feb 2013 #80

Very true! cleanhippie Feb 2013 #101

It also rots pipes and fish make love in it. That's why I won't drink it or put it in my eyes. Hassin Bin Sober Feb 2013 #316

Can I suggest a little lemon? (n/t) derby378 Feb 2013 #317

What difference does it make to you? JanMichael Feb 2013 #22

I always wait for the next shoe.... Junkdrawer Feb 2013 #24

No kidding...we are the two biggest skeptics we know JanMichael Feb 2013 #29

You think homeopathic medicines are less likely to use mercury? MattBaggins Feb 2013 #45

Well, they are less likely to use ANYTHING at all. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #49

Agreed. Sheldon Cooper Feb 2013 #30

Yep...the language, tone etc. just screams JanMichael Feb 2013 #33

I know. What's the harm? longship Feb 2013 #37

Adults are free to choose which treatment to use. Sheldon Cooper Feb 2013 #226

Arrogance? longship Feb 2013 #265

It can be scary when one of your family members choses homeopathic over traditional medicine liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #43

And that is incredibly sad. However, his decision JanMichael Feb 2013 #46

Incorrect MattBaggins Feb 2013 #109

Lots of people "use my tax money" (god, that is JanMichael Feb 2013 #143

We only have so much money to use and can't afford to waste it on crap MattBaggins Feb 2013 #149

"WE only have so much money...." JanMichael Feb 2013 #173

You have no interest in an honest assessment of Homeopathy MattBaggins Feb 2013 #176

really. My wife was a paramedic, and is now a librarian JanMichael Feb 2013 #180

Unlike you I support the role of the FDA MattBaggins Feb 2013 #183

and how in the world did you get that JanMichael Feb 2013 #190

You were making things up MattBaggins Feb 2013 #194

I haven't made anything up. I have stated repeatedly JanMichael Feb 2013 #207

Don't read them then MattBaggins Feb 2013 #209

+1 bama_blue_dot Feb 2013 #154

How do people make decisions without information? Silent3 Feb 2013 #264

I don't care how people spend their money. I do care that ignorant people are being scammed. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #309

"Frankly, people who use them are not harming you, so what is the issue? " cleanhippie Feb 2013 #36

at least two of us here knew you were going to bring up vaccines JanMichael Feb 2013 #38

Ok. Thank you for your opinion. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #41

Lying about medical properties of your product is inherently harmful. Scootaloo Feb 2013 #133

Labeling is required on all the packages JanMichael Feb 2013 #184

Because I hate the propagation of stupidity in our society Scootaloo Feb 2013 #196

OK JanMichael Feb 2013 #202

There's a world beyond DU Scootaloo Feb 2013 #212

I think we should realize the same is true of baptism (and holy water if catholic) Dragonfli Feb 2013 #292

What in the world makes you think I draw an exception for religion? Scootaloo Feb 2013 #304

You are on the money MattBaggins Feb 2013 #204

It's not a matter of not harming people personally. Dash87 Feb 2013 #240

And fake "medications" *do* harm people, anyway. Posteritatis Feb 2013 #291

It's not harming you that cleanhippie keeps bring this up, so what's the issue? Orrex Feb 2013 #271

No, I use herbs and nutrition. I went to a homeopath once, when I was like 22, and Zorra Feb 2013 #27

Why not? Gold isn't going to hurt you MattBaggins Feb 2013 #47

You'd be safe. Homeopathic gold solution is like all other kestrel91316 Feb 2013 #100

hahahahaha obamanut2012 Feb 2013 #128

So to keep things interesting (since some posters don't want you to talk about this)... randome Feb 2013 #50

LOL (n/t) athena Feb 2013 #228

Capsasin/Cayenne pep. diluted with cold cream for the feets. Apply 3X in 1 hour with socks. ahhhhh. lonestarnot Feb 2013 #55

Do you make that yourself? cleanhippie Feb 2013 #57

Yes. 1 teaspoon red pep to 1 small jar ponds cold cream (not the big un.) :) lonestarnot Feb 2013 #60

Sounds interesting. Ill give it a try. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #61

Removes inflamation. Careful with the insteps, they are more sensative. lonestarnot Feb 2013 #62

Thank you for this me b zola Feb 2013 #129

You are welcome dearie. lonestarnot Feb 2013 #281

That doesn't sound like a homeopathic "medicine" to me. eShirl Feb 2013 #64

Whatever. lonestarnot Feb 2013 #66

Just wondering why it's posted in a thread about homeopathy? eShirl Feb 2013 #68

Keep wondering then. Why are you shitting on this thread? lonestarnot Feb 2013 #71

I'm not. Why are you shitting on me? eShirl Feb 2013 #72

If you mix up some crap yourself and you can't by it, it's homeopathic by my definition and you lonestarnot Feb 2013 #75

I know. WTF. eShirl Feb 2013 #79

Maybe a less controversial word for what you prepared would be "home remedy", not homeopathic? cleanhippie Feb 2013 #121

WTF, indeed, you are arguing because you cannot be bothered to learn what homeopathy means....? xocet Feb 2013 #235

You probably won't want to sell cars for a living then. What? I have to look up homeopathic to lonestarnot Feb 2013 #282

My problem isn't with you, or with people who buy & use homeo products knowing what they're buying. eShirl Feb 2013 #284

I see. lonestarnot Feb 2013 #294

No, what you have to do is read the OP - the definition is there muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #289

I did and I dilute red pepper with cold cream. I don't call myself walgreens. So there is an lonestarnot Feb 2013 #295

If you prefer your ignorance, please continue. n/t xocet Feb 2013 #313

You apparently prefer being annoyed. Have at it pal. I can help you if you like. Snort lonestarnot Feb 2013 #314

He's actually right. That's a home remedy, not homeopathy. Dash87 Feb 2013 #296

You know that feeling in your throat you get just before a cold? randr Feb 2013 #74

A tincture is not the same thing as a homeopathic "remedy." cleanhippie Feb 2013 #77

Did you test this to make sure you were not just experiencing MattBaggins Feb 2013 #89

That proves nothing. athena Feb 2013 #222

The amount of ignorance on this thread is astonishing to me Nancy Waterman Feb 2013 #81

Thank you.. bama_blue_dot Feb 2013 #84

This is exactly why homeopathy should be declared illegal MattBaggins Feb 2013 #93

You do know that in a 30C potency, there's not a single molecule left in the solution?... SidDithers Feb 2013 #96

Wow. While ignoring the basic laws of mathematics, you accuse others of being ignorant. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #103

I agree - I use homepathy womanofthehills Feb 2013 #106

"If you have never tried homeopathy, why put it down so vehemently." Because it is bunk bullshit. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #110

Works big time at what? MattBaggins Feb 2013 #125

I drink a Reed's Ginger Reed obamanut2012 Feb 2013 #135

Who is this Doctor? MattBaggins Feb 2013 #169

Well, water IS hydrating, and the placebo effect is real obamanut2012 Feb 2013 #132

Please look at the evidence before your favoured treatments kill again intaglio Feb 2013 #219

I buy my arnica in a cream and rub it on my boo's .... MindMover Feb 2013 #267

Take these things into consideration: Dash87 Feb 2013 #297

Also, many, many, many people get Homeopathic mixed up with Naturopathic... SidDithers Feb 2013 #82

And the defenders appear in 3 - 2 - 1 GoneOffShore Feb 2013 #87

Thank you!! GoCubsGo Feb 2013 #136

I prefer to use science and doctors to cure what ails me. Apophis Feb 2013 #94

They are sold at Whole Foods by people with dreadlocks and Che Guevara t-shirts Dreamer Tatum Feb 2013 #97

Winner! cleanhippie Feb 2013 #104

Homeopathy is 100% unmitigated bullshit. No question. Warren DeMontague Feb 2013 #139

Latte sipping arugula munchers demanding abortions on their way to a save the whales pot rally! Warren DeMontague Feb 2013 #134

LOL laundry_queen Feb 2013 #171

The real question to me is what to do about it. Should it be illegal? DanTex Feb 2013 #111

I do not have the answer to that, but there certainly IS harm. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #114

Is there any quantifiable evidence of the harm that homeopathy causes? DanTex Feb 2013 #122

"What is harmful is when people forgo actual medical treatments and use homeopathy instead" cleanhippie Feb 2013 #124

Is it illegal to mislabel a product or lie to consumers about what a product does? MattBaggins Feb 2013 #127

I would assume there has to be some disclaimer on the packaging about how the claims are not tested. DanTex Feb 2013 #147

Right there under drug facts MattBaggins Feb 2013 #152

"According to homeopathic principles"... DanTex Feb 2013 #163

which go away on their own, can be sold without a prescription MattBaggins Feb 2013 #167

"marketing that preys on the ignorant" laundry_queen Feb 2013 #172

You know, I'm open to that idea! cleanhippie Feb 2013 #174

Yes. It's a scam... SidDithers Feb 2013 #115

It's kind of a scam, but also kind of not. DanTex Feb 2013 #123

They lie to the consumer about what "ailments" it will relieve MattBaggins Feb 2013 #131

People claimed turn-of-the-20th-century patent medicines helped, too Posteritatis Feb 2013 #293

I drink close to a gallon of water a day, so yes obamanut2012 Feb 2013 #117

+1 cleanhippie Feb 2013 #119

Why Does Homeopathy Attract So Much Controversy? dooner Feb 2013 #130

Award for most bullshit study of the day MattBaggins Feb 2013 #141

There is no controversy over the efficacy of homeopathy. None. At. All. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #162

Did you even READ the nonsense contained on the link you provided? cleanhippie Feb 2013 #166

Even if it's placebo... JuniperLea Feb 2013 #137

Because it turns the ignorant away from real medicine, and in the end, that harms us all. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #148

Excuse me... JuniperLea Feb 2013 #182

Then it needs to be clearly labeled as such: PLACEBO EFFECT. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #191

That would be enough to keep it from working! JuniperLea Feb 2013 #243

Uh, because "People do know what they are taking"? cleanhippie Feb 2013 #248

That argument makes no sense. Dash87 Feb 2013 #298

That's the whole point. It's essentially faith healing, marketed as herbal remedies. eShirl Feb 2013 #151

Placebo effect is real... JuniperLea Feb 2013 #186

You are simply not correct MattBaggins Feb 2013 #218

Con artists selling people the power of their own minds = $$$ eShirl Feb 2013 #224

Same goes for any worthless gadget in the world JuniperLea Feb 2013 #247

As long as people KNOW what they're buying (a "worthless gadget" or "voodoo") fine. eShirl Feb 2013 #259

I partly agree with you. DanTex Feb 2013 #221

Placebos may need regulated too... JuniperLea Feb 2013 #245

Homeopathic medicine is energy medicine. Most Americans don't understand that...it is clear here. libdem4life Feb 2013 #138

Energy medicine... lol MattBaggins Feb 2013 #142

Energy medicine? BWAHAHAHAHAHA! cleanhippie Feb 2013 #145

Ahahahahaha.... SidDithers Feb 2013 #146

I see what you did there AngryAmish Feb 2013 #155

OMG obamanut2012 Feb 2013 #160

The key word - Anecdotes - And Energy Medicine? Really? GoneOffShore Feb 2013 #217

Simple yes or no... Does HiV cause AIDS? MattBaggins Feb 2013 #273

I thought I was corresponding withan intelligent being. My bad. Are you for Fu## real? libdem4life Feb 2013 #274

I asked you for your opinion on the virus and said nothing about homosexuality. MattBaggins Feb 2013 #275

AIDS and Iatrogenic death statistics??? This is not about some guy's junk. Get a life, Dude. libdem4life Feb 2013 #277

Why are you done? MattBaggins Feb 2013 #280

I'm a huge believer in naturopathy or herbology, but homeopathy is 100% BS n/t librechik Feb 2013 #144

Naturopathy is as woowoo as homeopathy MattBaggins Feb 2013 #165

And no homeopathy thread is complete without Mitchell and Webb... SidDithers Feb 2013 #150

James Randi just posted an article about this! obamanut2012 Feb 2013 #153

How funny! I just posted it! cleanhippie Feb 2013 #156

lol obamanut2012 Feb 2013 #161

I try to minimize my use of French but "Doctor" Oz is a fucking idiot. MattBaggins Feb 2013 #157

He is a highly respected cardiologist obamanut2012 Feb 2013 #158

No, that's all a buncha hogwash! But my crystal skull really works! Blecht Feb 2013 #159

Love it... SidDithers Feb 2013 #168

Woo medicine ruins lives Prism Feb 2013 #170

+infinity MattBaggins Feb 2013 #189

Reminds me of the days when doctors who washed their hands were considered Quacks. libdem4life Feb 2013 #175

You make good points, but when it comes to homeopathy, I think the verdict is in. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #178

I respect your opinion, but it flies in the face of mine and many other's experience. libdem4life Feb 2013 #193

Stop trying to use Europe to bolster homeopathy MattBaggins Feb 2013 #213

Just depends on who you choose to read. All the Medical Associations are trying to get rid of it. libdem4life Feb 2013 #220

No it does not work no matter how you use it MattBaggins Feb 2013 #223

Thank you for the sane post. zappaman Feb 2013 #229

Confusing.. MattBaggins Feb 2013 #210

First an idea is laughed at, then it is studied, then it is accepted as truth libdem4life Feb 2013 #225

The answer to the problems in medicine MattBaggins Feb 2013 #232

Accupuncture? Are you kidding me? Kaiser Permanente pays for it. libdem4life Feb 2013 #234

Bullshit they don't pay for things that don't work MattBaggins Feb 2013 #236

Homeopathy is not handwashing jmowreader Feb 2013 #257

Hylands remedy for colic costs a couple of bucks. Get off your hysteria and ask a parent with a new libdem4life Feb 2013 #266

Sugar water works and you have the stuff for that jmowreader Feb 2013 #283

They laughed at Columbus, they laughed at Fulton, they laughed at the Wright Brothers... SidDithers Feb 2013 #261

Okey dokey. Please, proceed... libdem4life Feb 2013 #268

Translation: you are wearing the floppy shoes. n/t xocet Feb 2013 #310

Iatrogenic Deaths are Rampant...but I don't knock or mock Modern Medicine.It's just not all there is libdem4life Feb 2013 #179

I don't understand what that has to do with homeopathy. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #185

You don't!? JanMichael Feb 2013 #187

For someone who thinks that time on DU and knowing the admins lends credibility cleanhippie Feb 2013 #200

All these dire warnings about the danger of homeopathy ...these are figures of the dangers of libdem4life Feb 2013 #195

Indeed, and homeopathy plays a part in those numbers. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #201

I don't see where any other method would significantly contribute. libdem4life Feb 2013 #216

But we agree! cleanhippie Feb 2013 #246

Education, yes. I don't know about safer...it's worked for me and mine for decades. libdem4life Feb 2013 #270

The statistics are of iatrogenic deaths...conditions the patient did not have when they began libdem4life Feb 2013 #231

Of course homeopathy could be involved. MattBaggins Feb 2013 #237

I am sorry to be so harsh but so far MattBaggins Feb 2013 #238

That's OK...I don't take it personally. I've had this conversation many times. Mostly friends and libdem4life Feb 2013 #250

This goes beyond that MattBaggins Feb 2013 #253

By definition...the people didn't have the condition they died with BEFORE entering the medical libdem4life Feb 2013 #241

Perhaps that word doesn't mean what you think it means. MattBaggins Feb 2013 #254

Don't argue with me...it's statistics. It's your own folks reporting this. Not the "wackos". libdem4life Feb 2013 #269

By the way did the unibomber write that site? UPDATE numbers are BS MattBaggins Feb 2013 #272

Comes off a bit pompous oberliner Feb 2013 #198

Perhaps, but it is effective. And factual. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #203

Rubbed me the wrong way oberliner Feb 2013 #205

Dawkins seems to have that effect on many. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #206

Ben Goldacre would be a better choice MattBaggins Feb 2013 #211

I like his writing better than his videos oberliner Feb 2013 #239

Water. With memory. Taverner Feb 2013 #230

IT'S GOT WHAT HOMEOPATHS CRAVE! n/t xocet Feb 2013 #311

I use homeopathic remedies all the time and they work great jmowreader Feb 2013 #249

+1!!!1 cleanhippie Feb 2013 #251

Excellent! obamanut2012 Feb 2013 #263

If you make it JNelson6563 Feb 2013 #256

Holy crap. Off topic, but I begin to see how some people get such high post counts.... Thor_MN Feb 2013 #285

agreed! eShirl Feb 2013 #287

Not really off topic. It is the fact that companies prey on the ignorant, and keeping them ignorant cleanhippie Feb 2013 #290

Here is an example of the reinforcement of the ignorance of the masses.... xocet Feb 2013 #312

Haven't seen this mentioned in this thread but James Randi and others "overdosed"... SwissTony Feb 2013 #307

Yes I drink lots of water RedCappedBandit Feb 2013 #315