General Discussion

cliffordu

(30,994 posts)

101. I don't resent any of it,

Wed Feb 27, 2013, 03:39 AM

Feb 2013

But to be referred to as a member of a CLASS of people who oppress women and minorities and the GLBT community is broad brush in the extreme. (Not in this thread, but in the latest convulsions about the Patriarchy. I'm a white male. )

I'm just saying that back in the day, I was taught all people were to be respected, and, if you were a 'stand up guy' you wouldn't allow those more vulnerable than you to be attacked or beaten or raped.

Even if you had to risk your life to do it.

This blanket indictment of the "patriarchal oppression" neglects to speak to that.

Maybe some don't know about it

The talk about white knights is glib and worthless. I have had my ass saved by a couple of them and I'll say they have my undying fealty for what they did.

That's what community does for one another.

Or, we can just call the cops and drive home, smug and safe.

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If you are the member of a privileged group AND call yourself progressive [View all] Matariki Feb 2013 OP

Big K&R LiberalLoner Feb 2013 #1

Can I take exception to the word 'privileged'? sadbear Feb 2013 #2

Agreed Lordquinton Feb 2013 #9

I think we know what the OP meant Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #12

Not being able to argue better than everyone else is not the same as being wrong. merrily Feb 2013 #54

Such a simple concept duhneece Feb 2013 #125

Well, the OP claimed no "status as victim" intaglio Feb 2013 #105

In other words... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #133

Did you write this word salad? intaglio Feb 2013 #177

I can't help you... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #190

You do not even write at an fifth grade level intaglio Feb 2013 #200

BAM. Well done. bettyellen Feb 2013 #222

About your points about grammar: you're wrong muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #234

Technically correct, it's just that the subject, the "I", is indeterminate intaglio Feb 2013 #254

it's completely clear and in fact you understood it: HiPointDem Feb 2013 #261

I actually disagree strongly with Jeff's position muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #266

In discussions downthread, I think the OP and I are probably pretty close in our opinion Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #270

You know how to tell when you're losing an argument? Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #248

The subject is still undefined intaglio Feb 2013 #255

Listen up, class Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #267

wtf? massive fail on the writing analysis. the poster writes just fine, and the sentence has HiPointDem Feb 2013 #259

As observed in my response to Muriel intaglio Feb 2013 #260

It's completely clear that the poster was paraphrasing your argument (sarcastically), and that HiPointDem Feb 2013 #263

Post removed Post removed Feb 2013 #221

Suggestion: Keep trying. LanternWaste Feb 2013 #276

Lack of privilege confers privilege. Please get with the program. snagglepuss Feb 2013 #195

So asking for some objectivity Tsiyu Feb 2013 #206

Can you give an example of what you are talking about because I have no idea from Maraya1969 Feb 2013 #126

You know perfectly well what was meant... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #130

I actually was thinking you had another idea besides hating on the poor or the transgendered Maraya1969 Feb 2013 #131

Nailed. First try. Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #136

You obviously did not read the article. That makes sense. But don't try to blame your Maraya1969 Feb 2013 #150

I actually obviously DID read the article... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #163

Context or perspective is really hte issue, not whether or not one's position iemitsu Feb 2013 #145

this mac56 Feb 2013 #156

I understood the OP in the struggle context, as well. ancianita Feb 2013 #189

I meant it exactly in that relative sense. Matariki Feb 2013 #13

I think everyone should listen.... MellowDem Feb 2013 #14

Actual discussions about sexism or racism in our culture Matariki Feb 2013 #16

I agree those are never prefereable... MellowDem Feb 2013 #19

Good post... one_voice Feb 2013 #48

I would say that actual discussions about sexism and racism hfojvt Feb 2013 #64

Straight people should not lecture GLBTQ people on being overly geek tragedy Feb 2013 #66

why not? hfojvt Feb 2013 #83

... Number23 Feb 2013 #108

This message was self-deleted by its author seaglass Feb 2013 #120

Love. Starry Messenger Feb 2013 #238

No, "incorrect" does not = "overly senstitive." bread_and_roses Feb 2013 #123

So did you lecture him about the error of his ways? If not, you are proving the point. Squinch Feb 2013 #134

See, that should have been a learning lesson for you. NCTraveler Feb 2013 #139

to learn what? hfojvt Feb 2013 #171

But, you don't know what life experience he has. geek tragedy Feb 2013 #154

of course, I do not know his experiences hfojvt Feb 2013 #169

Just because a perception is incorrect doesn't make it irrational though. geek tragedy Feb 2013 #174

not sure why rationality needs to come into it hfojvt Feb 2013 #201

But, to use the example you cited, he's not imagining anything. geek tragedy Feb 2013 #202

yes, let's compare being black with being iron deficient! bettyellen Feb 2013 #224

Talking over people can happen in conversation, but not on a message board. merrily Feb 2013 #53

Here's my frustration... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #146

If it had been just one person, I might agree with you gollygee Feb 2013 #147

My point is this... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #172

Well, attempting to be satirical doesn't give him a free pass gollygee Feb 2013 #181

Again, my point... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #186

OK. Again, my point . . . gollygee Feb 2013 #204

OK... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #249

it was such a poor attempt at satire it was indisinguishable from frat boy "humor" bettyellen Feb 2013 #225

Imho, Ted is a stupid movie. That is all. n/t Fla Dem Feb 2013 #149

It might well be... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #164

No, that's ok. Everyone has their unique taste in movies. I saw "ted" in the theater because... Fla Dem Feb 2013 #175

Now, you see... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2013 #188

Best post I've read in weeks rjj621 Feb 2013 #161

I'm not sure what privilege has to do with it Major Nikon Feb 2013 #253

" It's a way to exclude someone who you think has it better than you" Better? Absolutely not. merrily Feb 2013 #52

??? I think you misunderstood or misrepresented dreamnightwind Feb 2013 #87

I read his post too quickly. Wish you had left it at "misunderstood" though. merrily Feb 2013 #90

It looked like an unlikely mistake, that's all dreamnightwind Feb 2013 #119

Message auto-removed matwilson Feb 2013 #3

thank you! cally Feb 2013 #4

thank you. Matariki Feb 2013 #7

You seem to have something Jenoch Feb 2013 #57

I'm not baffled by it at all. sibelian Feb 2013 #100

Or maybe your situation is different, tavalon Feb 2013 #137

It's called "Argument from Authority" Lordquinton Feb 2013 #187

That's exactly how I see it. sibelian Feb 2013 #262

Yeah, that! tavalon Feb 2013 #132

I note that you did not say this, but I am curious: Common Sense Party Feb 2013 #205

You make so much sense. smirkymonkey Feb 2013 #278

"It is what I say it is" Confusious Feb 2013 #5

Perfectly stated. cate94 Feb 2013 #6

Amen! Texasgal Feb 2013 #8

K&R Starry Messenger Feb 2013 #10

K&R Squinch Feb 2013 #11

And remember texshelters Feb 2013 #15

Excellent post. dawg Feb 2013 #17

Describe 'privileged' cliffordu Feb 2013 #18

I'll pretend your question isn't disingenuous and answer it. Matariki Feb 2013 #20

You mean like the privilege that demands cliffordu Feb 2013 #26

It's not your job though. galileoreloaded Feb 2013 #32

Nice. cliffordu Feb 2013 #40

yes, please... stop all this white knighting bullshit for everyone's sake bettyellen Feb 2013 #71

Has there ever been a law on the books that anyone put themselves in harm's way? Jamastiene Feb 2013 #86

why pretend to be noble and seethe in resentment and claim special privileges for it? bettyellen Feb 2013 #92

because clearly culture is all codified in laws and something must be 'one's job' or it needn't be HiPointDem Feb 2013 #265

I'm sorry, I have no idea what you are talking about. Matariki Feb 2013 #37

Well played... cliffordu Feb 2013 #39

Oh, so you think being a man makes you the oppressed one? nt geek tragedy Feb 2013 #61

Again, parsing what's actually written cliffordu Feb 2013 #74

is this stolen from Batman, LOL? hoping you forgot the sarcasm smiley.... bettyellen Feb 2013 #69

Nope. cliffordu Feb 2013 #75

well someone sold you a bill of goods, you don't have a heavier burden than anyone on earth bettyellen Feb 2013 #77

Your post is enlightening and a fine instruction. cliffordu Feb 2013 #78

free your mind, and your ass will follow! bettyellen Feb 2013 #80

Dunno what you're talking about. cliffordu Feb 2013 #81

\you make *your choices* sound like a huge burden- yet say you are comfortable bettyellen Feb 2013 #88

Yep you are exactly right. cliffordu Feb 2013 #91

Good- you needed that! bettyellen Feb 2013 #93

Consider me sufficiently enlightened. cliffordu Feb 2013 #94

better enlightened than a white knight with a martyr complex. bettyellen Feb 2013 #99

That would be me. cliffordu Feb 2013 #102

Since when? Jamastiene Feb 2013 #85

The cops can take an hour to show up. cliffordu Feb 2013 #89

Then, don't resent it. Jamastiene Feb 2013 #97

I don't resent any of it, cliffordu Feb 2013 #101

you seem to be blissfully unaware that just as many women and minorities bettyellen Feb 2013 #227

Your post enlightens and instructs. cliffordu Feb 2013 #228

Well what a load of self justifying and content light verbiage intaglio Feb 2013 #111

Golly gosh. cliffordu Feb 2013 #143

Who said it was roses and beer? intaglio Feb 2013 #173

So do I know as much as you do about the guilt feelings the patriarchy instills in men, or Squinch Feb 2013 #140

Neither. cliffordu Feb 2013 #144

But you know that my post is just really restating the OP, right? Squinch Feb 2013 #159

I am Jewish. Cary Feb 2013 #153

This message was self-deleted by its author cliffordu Feb 2013 #155

Even when privilege is pointed out there are those here who ignore or dismiss it Major Nikon Feb 2013 #256

someone who doesn't have to believe in a god in order to get through the daily routine of life? snooper2 Feb 2013 #36

Thinking you might be right. cliffordu Feb 2013 #41

A privilege is ANYTHING that is taken by means of ANY advantage & not through any consensual patrice Feb 2013 #113

I'm not ignoring you - I will respond to your post later as my day is turning out to be hectic. cliffordu Feb 2013 #152

I don't even like the term progressive Mnpaul Feb 2013 #21

Error #1 ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2013 #22

It's like fish thinking there's something wrong with other creatures drowning in water Matariki Feb 2013 #24

I have used that exact analogy ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2013 #25

It's woven into our very language Matariki Feb 2013 #30

Just a minor nitpick. And it really is a nitpick. white_wolf Feb 2013 #50

It is confusing to me on the dark=evil thing especially. Jamastiene Feb 2013 #95

I love the night too. I like it alot better than day actually. white_wolf Feb 2013 #96

But the ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2013 #178

Good point. white_wolf Feb 2013 #277

How refreshing ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2013 #279

Being more privileged than someone else is not the same as being unable to listen or emphathize. merrily Feb 2013 #55

Nailed. It. Number23 Feb 2013 #82

But...but...but....we have a black president now Cali_Democrat Feb 2013 #106

I know, right??! Number23 Feb 2013 #107

I call that The Beyonce Defense gollygee Feb 2013 #118

That's not the issue quite a few people have with the post... MellowDem Feb 2013 #170

I agree, though there may be a limit somewhere treestar Feb 2013 #23

Matariki, they get it. They really do... Jasana Feb 2013 #27

K&R ChaoticTrilby Feb 2013 #28

Look at these priviliged tykes Demo_Chris Feb 2013 #29

It is possible to be part of a privileged group while being part of a non-privileged group. ChaoticTrilby Feb 2013 #31

Thank you. Matariki Feb 2013 #35

No problem. ChaoticTrilby Feb 2013 #43

thank you for your excellent post hopemountain Feb 2013 #44

I missed nothing, nor do I desire to erase anything Demo_Chris Feb 2013 #47

So, rich black people don't get pulled over for DWB? geek tragedy Feb 2013 #68

You are over-simplifying the matter. ChaoticTrilby Feb 2013 #103

You just lumped all white people, all straight people, and all men together Confusious Feb 2013 #183

What? ChaoticTrilby Feb 2013 #214

So the white male hetrosexual bum Confusious Feb 2013 #216

No. I don't think so. ChaoticTrilby Feb 2013 #229

Well, you see herein lies the problem Confusious Feb 2013 #233

Colorblind racism gollygee Feb 2013 #243

Hmm...I see what you are getting at. ChaoticTrilby Feb 2013 #244

Sure it is Confusious Feb 2013 #79

It's still called "don't be an ass hole." ChaoticTrilby Feb 2013 #115

You hit all the social justice warrior buzzwords Confusious Feb 2013 #207

Social justice warrior buzzwords? ChaoticTrilby Feb 2013 #226

No, I'm not calling you a hypocrite Confusious Feb 2013 #239

Okay, good. I was just a little uncertain because most of the Tumblr meme focused on hypocrisy. ChaoticTrilby Feb 2013 #245

Nice post. But it's important to remember, that even those poor white kids Number23 Feb 2013 #104

I wasn't sure when those pictures were taken, so I was mostly speaking in a more modern context. ChaoticTrilby Feb 2013 #112

No, I don't think your post negated anything. Number23 Feb 2013 #192

Your 2 cents are appreciated. ChaoticTrilby Feb 2013 #231

It's my pleasure. I appreciate your efforts to educate. And judging by the poster you are Number23 Feb 2013 #235

I always take my vitamins! ChaoticTrilby Feb 2013 #246

African Americans have been graduating from Yale since the 1840's Confusious Feb 2013 #176

Oh my God. No, really? gollygee Feb 2013 #184

Good gravy. Number23 Feb 2013 #191

Moving the goalposts Confusious Feb 2013 #194

Segregation and racial discrimination would have precluded the vast majority of blacks from attendin Number23 Feb 2013 #198

Still moving the goalposts Confusious Feb 2013 #199

No, "most of the north" had not integrated by the 30s gollygee Feb 2013 #203

That one has his head buried in the sand and a bulldozer couldn't get it out Number23 Feb 2013 #212

Five edits for that foolishness? Number23 Feb 2013 #213

Wow, you are the model social justice warrior Confusious Feb 2013 #217

The fact that you are working so hard to condemn people who are concerned about social justice Number23 Feb 2013 #218

Par for the course Confusious Feb 2013 #230

OK. Why nobody can see it. gollygee Feb 2013 #241

Jury results: JackBeck Feb 2013 #219

Thanks, Jack. I tried, you know. I edited, but the sentiment most certainly remains Number23 Feb 2013 #220

Why do some people act like pointing out societal priviledge is just a ploy to make them feel guilty Matariki Feb 2013 #33

You weren't pointing out societal privilege... MellowDem Feb 2013 #167

Point well taken customerserviceguy Feb 2013 #34

I dare you to post this in meta and see the response you get. LOL boston bean Feb 2013 #38

+1 redqueen Feb 2013 #45

Or TMG. Nt geek tragedy Feb 2013 #70

Well stated. October Feb 2013 #42

r-e-s-p-e-c-t hopemountain Feb 2013 #46

Yes! I tried to sketch the rational basis for why respect is absolutely essential to this patrice Feb 2013 #114

Some would regard me as under privileged for being DeadEyeDyck Feb 2013 #49

Matariki, I want to thank you NeeDeep Feb 2013 #51

I would have expected that OP to be uncontroversial among Democrats. Silly me. merrily Feb 2013 #56

Part of privilege means being able to pretend privilege doesn't exist. nt geek tragedy Feb 2013 #58

I would think that's part of being an asshole, not part of being a privileged Democrat. merrily Feb 2013 #59

The ability is different than the propensity. geek tragedy Feb 2013 #60

Yes, but I would expect that of most Democratic males. merrily Feb 2013 #62

People like to think of themselves as the underdog. nt geek tragedy Feb 2013 #63

But, also as winners and also as reality based, rather than delusional merrily Feb 2013 #65

Well, yeah, they're a winner for what they've done, not the advantages they have! Nt geek tragedy Feb 2013 #67

I would have thought that my post 56 was not terribly controversial, either. merrily Feb 2013 #76

Welcome to DU Number23 Feb 2013 #215

I Reject the Framing AndyTiedye Feb 2013 #72

A pretty silly and somewhat obnoxious post. MrModerate Feb 2013 #73

Agreed but also I find the OP to be rather odd. Cary Feb 2013 #138

My favorite quote ismnotwasm Feb 2013 #84

I tried to break down some of the problems in recognizing this in my post #113 above. patrice Feb 2013 #117

I see that ismnotwasm Feb 2013 #135

There is so much that is about process, how to_____ ,everything else can be affected by that. nt patrice Feb 2013 #157

It is also important for the "disinfranchised" AND progressive to remember... Behind the Aegis Feb 2013 #98

That is very important. boston bean Feb 2013 #141

"If more people would focus on the issue versus those pointing it out, we might get somewhere." redqueen Feb 2013 #165

+1 leftstreet Feb 2013 #180

trust the person making the claim sigmasix Feb 2013 #109

From my experience with this subject TM99 Feb 2013 #110

Your response to the OP FlaGranny Feb 2013 #121

As I said, TM99 Feb 2013 #162

There's a saying ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2013 #182

Oh I DO like that. MuseRider Feb 2013 #237

As is the norm ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2013 #185

That is a very good phrasing of the problem! KitSileya Feb 2013 #208

I, initially, had added ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2013 #210

I note that 90 people have Rec'd this, not 6 gollygee Feb 2013 #116

I have a good illustration.... Burma Jones Feb 2013 #122

Progressive is a DLC term formercia Feb 2013 #124

The reason I say 'progressive' DaveJ Feb 2013 #129

but do "progressives" exist? Puzzledtraveller Feb 2013 #160

liberal assumes a commitment BainsBane Feb 2013 #196

This thread has earned the Ron Obvious Award. nt valerief Feb 2013 #127

And precisely who... 99Forever Feb 2013 #128

I cannot see one instance in the OP where who is privileged and who is not is pointed out. KitSileya Feb 2013 #209

The implication is quite clear. 99Forever Feb 2013 #211

Isn't it only privileged people who call themselves "progressive"? harmonicon Feb 2013 #142

I posted in Meta about something similar Aerows Feb 2013 #148

the concept of "offending" or "offensive" have been dumbed down alc Feb 2013 #151

Yes. But it cuts both ways. Don't put up a wall and call it a door. nolabear Feb 2013 #158

Being a white male has made life so goddamn easy for me, I tell you. Comrade_McKenzie Feb 2013 #166

A good 50 or 60% of the developing world wickerwoman Feb 2013 #223

The problem with the privilege meme is that, like your post, snagglepuss Feb 2013 #232

In the context of this discussion, wickerwoman Feb 2013 #247

yes, and their lives are no doubt harder than yours as well. now what? with that revelation HiPointDem Feb 2013 #264

See the OP. wickerwoman Feb 2013 #268

kind of circular. accepting your privilege leads to respect when other people tell you they're HiPointDem Feb 2013 #273

It leads to social change in the sense that wickerwoman Feb 2013 #274

if people don't know better than to call each other racists and bitches, i doubt telling them HiPointDem Feb 2013 #275

I had no idea that "Aunt Nancy" was the LGBT equivalent of "Uncle Tom" KamaAina Feb 2013 #168

You seem to have brought the MRAs out in force intaglio Feb 2013 #179

sexism BainsBane Feb 2013 #193

MRAs? WilliamPitt Feb 2013 #236

Mens Rights Activists intaglio Feb 2013 #252

Thanks WilliamPitt Feb 2013 #269

I just wish the privileged would acknowledge it and SHUT UP FOR ONCE AngryAmish Feb 2013 #197

Notice the members of privileged groups in this very thread who took offense with your OP... YoungDemCA Feb 2013 #240

Re: the concept of privileged frazzled Feb 2013 #242

Okay, but what if you've listened to the opinion, and considered it, and thought about it. BlueCheese Feb 2013 #250

Your first point is interesting intaglio Feb 2013 #257

I guess what I see here is a lot of disagreement. BlueCheese Feb 2013 #258

You might choose not to have an opinion about it wickerwoman Feb 2013 #271

I think we agree more than we disagree. BlueCheese Feb 2013 #272

I'm nothing except me. babylonsister Feb 2013 #251