Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

hfojvt

(37,573 posts)
81. swing some more?
Thu Mar 28, 2013, 09:37 PM
Mar 2013

There's a lot of verbiage flying around.

In my own post as well, including some words I clearly forgot to say.

I said, first, that GREED is part of the problem.

So it has nothing to do with income. It's not about the $80,000 a year or the $19 an hour.

MY perspective is 1) that $19 is very good money.

Many other DUers seem to be much richer, so from where they sit $19 is practically a poverty wage.

To me, it sounds like greed to say that a $19 an hour worker needs to, or should, make more money.

The vet is another fairly obvious case in point. Her income comes at least partly from the $54 she charged me for the last ten minute visit. It's pretty obvious that if she charges me more that hurts me and helps her, income wise. If her income drops from $80,000 to $60,000 because of lower prices then her customers are collectively $20,000 better off.

It is trickle down theory to claim that increasing the income of somebody who makes $60,000 a year to $80,000 is somehow gonna benefit those in the community who make $20,000 a year. That we, in the working class, should somehow be upset if a moderately rich person ends up making less money, because that somehow hurts us all. Because if they suddenly make more money that just won't allow them to buy more and better stuff. It will somehow trickle down to that guy making $20,000 a year.

As for making policy, yes, that $80,000 to $200,000 group is very influential, because collectively they make a lot of donations. They certainly provide more campaign money than the group of households who make less than $40,000 a year.

And it is no accident when policies benefit them a whole lot. Like the Backstreet Boys, they want it that way.

See, if it was up to me, taxes would go up a little bit on the group making $60,000 to $200,000, and then maybe that tax revenue could be used to provide more money for people who need TANF. Because I read somewhere that TANF benefits have not at all kept up with inflation and that many fewer poor people are getting TANF benefits, thanks in part to the NEW Democrats.

And complaining about the taxes that those rich people pay? Where have I heard that before? Seriously? California has one of the most progressive state income taxes around, but even in California the tax rates by quintiles are - 10.6%, 9.2%, 8.2%, 7.6%, 7.4% http://www.itep.org/pdf/ca.pdf As for Federal Taxes, even those in the top 25% are only paying an average rate of 9.29% http://journals.democraticunderground.com/hfojvt/169 So I don't see how people are paying 40%, much less 65% in taxes. 9.29 + 7.65 + 8.2 is only about 25%. Granted that is an average and some people may be far about the average, but Chebyshev says it is not very many.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

kr HiPointDem Mar 2013 #1
K&R n/t OneGrassRoot Mar 2013 #2
K&R Sherman A1 Mar 2013 #3
"Austerity for thee, not for me . . ." HughBeaumont Mar 2013 #4
"We're not all in this together." moondust Mar 2013 #8
To "be competitive" ... Puzzler Mar 2013 #5
How is half of 28, 19? trumad Mar 2013 #6
It makes for a better story is my guess madokie Mar 2013 #7
I noted that also. xtraxritical Mar 2013 #66
Raises erpowers Mar 2013 #9
Because the 50% cut was 5 years ago Art_from_Ark Mar 2013 #10
Gotcha trumad Mar 2013 #12
You left a sentence out... we need to know what "that" is bobclark86 Mar 2013 #32
It was cut in half and has now gotten to $19 csziggy Mar 2013 #78
CEOs are the New Royalty Octafish Mar 2013 #11
Is $19 per hour for an entry-level worker really that bad? Nye Bevan Mar 2013 #13
Is $21 million "reasonable" for ... 99Forever Mar 2013 #16
If every company in the US paid entry-level workers $19 per hour, Nye Bevan Mar 2013 #22
No one... 99Forever Mar 2013 #25
+1. IMO, not only do we need a much higher minimum wage, winter is coming Mar 2013 #30
but MANY are actually feasting hfojvt Mar 2013 #36
Way to buy into the fascist bullshit. 99Forever Mar 2013 #38
whatever that means hfojvt Mar 2013 #48
Like crabs in a bucket. 99Forever Mar 2013 #51
yeah I know that one hfojvt Mar 2013 #56
Wrong. 99Forever Mar 2013 #59
oh I know hfojvt Mar 2013 #61
Still wrong. 99Forever Mar 2013 #67
Actually, wages from $25 to $40 an hour do trickle down to the economy at a high rate. haele Mar 2013 #44
1st Rate post Populist_Prole Mar 2013 #49
not really very populist hfojvt Mar 2013 #58
So a wage of $50K a year puts you in the elite? haele Mar 2013 #69
$50,000 a year puts you above about 50% of the rest of the country hfojvt Mar 2013 #72
Deep breath - The benefit is in the taxes and spending that the $50K - $100K does. haele Mar 2013 #74
you just keep repeating the argument for trickle down hfojvt Mar 2013 #75
No I'm making this point because this is part of the research I am doing for my degree. haele Mar 2013 #77
it's certainly not trickle DOWN hfojvt Mar 2013 #79
OK - 95% of my family income going to taxes and local businesses means I'm just like the top 1% haele Mar 2013 #80
swing some more? hfojvt Mar 2013 #81
Swing away - notice that though I tell you the percentage of taxes that come out of my paycheck - haele Mar 2013 #82
Side comment - If you want to know what your vet's life of luxery is, look up kestrel91316 haele Mar 2013 #83
No it isn't... dickensknitter Mar 2013 #18
That's about twice sulphurdunn Mar 2013 #26
sounds pretty darn good to me hfojvt Mar 2013 #33
So....why, out of curiosity... A HERETIC I AM Mar 2013 #57
What is a comfortable living? hfojvt Mar 2013 #60
That is a question only you can answer A HERETIC I AM Mar 2013 #62
except you are not talking about reality hfojvt Mar 2013 #65
So the idea that the person who MAKES the product you are buying BrotherIvan Mar 2013 #40
So, what do you think would be a fair hourly wage for entry-level employees? (nt) Nye Bevan Mar 2013 #41
Here's my answer BrotherIvan Mar 2013 #42
Can't support a family of 4 in the Bay Area. That's right at the poverty level. demosincebirth Mar 2013 #53
When I had an entry-level job in the 1980s I couldn't even afford an apartment of my own. Nye Bevan Mar 2013 #54
This message was self-deleted by its author Tuesday Afternoon Mar 2013 #14
And, I bet this CEO NewJeffCT Mar 2013 #15
Welcome to capitalism. nt TBF Mar 2013 #17
Message auto-removed setab Mar 2013 #19
that's what you take away from that? xchrom Mar 2013 #21
So... He's the new Jack Welch and all the MBA lemmings are following in his lead? Hugin Mar 2013 #20
And you still hear people edhopper Mar 2013 #23
But how many tee times has he sacrificed for that salary? At least, a couple. valerief Mar 2013 #24
The outsourcing was designed to lower our pay out of desperation for a job. Dustlawyer Mar 2013 #27
^^This!^^ BrotherIvan Mar 2013 #39
Is there a profit sharing payout? n/t Mopar151 Mar 2013 #28
If we had Medicare for All, the worker's health insurance costs wouldn't be in car prices. Scuba Mar 2013 #29
It's one of those things that makes all the sense in the world, which is why it'll never happen. HughBeaumont Mar 2013 #35
Both of these are excellent responses nt BrotherIvan Mar 2013 #43
I will say this for Mullaly...he saved Ford from bankruptcy. Ikonoklast Mar 2013 #31
Yup. Agschmid Mar 2013 #46
K&R. Seems like 2 million would be wonderful enough. Overseas Mar 2013 #34
you expect somebody to live on just THAT? hfojvt Mar 2013 #37
Yes indeed. He's not the only one. And stock helps things along. Overseas Mar 2013 #50
k&r n/t RainDog Mar 2013 #45
Ford is also charging 30+ grand for a new car just1voice Mar 2013 #47
Now if the executives salaries was cut by half then the company could return the workers Thinkingabout Mar 2013 #52
Nope. Do the math. Nye Bevan Mar 2013 #55
On the other hand, think about this; A HERETIC I AM Mar 2013 #63
There was a little story created with CEO Mulally in mind ... lpbk2713 Mar 2013 #64
The only real problem with that scenario is this: Without Mulally, there was a very real chance Ikonoklast Mar 2013 #68
Then he's probably worth about $500,000/year salary Duer 157099 Mar 2013 #70
k & r thanks for posting..... nt Stuart G Mar 2013 #71
Ford again in the news for negative shit. Rex Mar 2013 #73
It is the xxqqqzme Mar 2013 #76
Hate to say it, but for $21 million Ford under him ignores design for style... sfpcjock Mar 2013 #84
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Meet the CEO Who Cut Work...»Reply #81