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Swede Atlanta

(3,596 posts)
51. My only comment is this did not start with Obama.....
Sat Mar 30, 2013, 01:55 PM
Mar 2013

If you recall Senator Ted Kennedy worked with the GWB administration (and others) to establish NCLB. I sincerely believe Kennedy intended the best outcome and believed this program was one instrument that would help improve the performance of American schools. But as we know under NCLB the federal government imposed another mandate on states without providing a funding mechanism. So the program has suffered both from a lack of funding but also comprehensive evaluation and monitoring.

Unfortunately, to the poster's point, Obama has bought into this program. Whether that is because they believe in it or have chosen other priorities and don't want to pick another fight with Congress is anyone's guess.

I have always maintained that standardized tests do not test knowledge nor aptitude, at least not for children and adolescents. Yet in our society we use them as part of admissions criteria to universities as well as for graduate programs - GRE, GMAT, LSAT, MCAT, etc.

I have no children but as an outsider looking in I see a number of things that concern me...

(1) Teachers are no longer respected and, unfortunately due to the low starting salaries and the conditions in which they must teach, we don't necessarily attract the best and brightest to the profession. That is not to say that we do not have very capable teachers but the profession as a whole is not exactly a magnet

(2) Curricula are no longer focused on delivering a quality "liberal" education of reading, writing, math, science, social studies and the arts. Curricula are often too light on the things students need to be prepared to enter society and too heavy on sports and electives. Electives are fine once a student is performing in the basics at a competent level

(3) Our politically correct society no longer expects students to respect teachers and administrators and to adhere to rules of decorum and behavior. On the one hand we have "no tolerance" policies for a student that might forget an bring a small pen knife to school but absolve them for tardiness, absences, bullying, etc. There is no longer a sense of respect and order in many classrooms. This has been hammered home to me by several of my friends who are teachers and administrators

(4) Parental and societal involvement and focus on achievement and success is lacking. Some parents see schools as babysitters for their children but will not support the schools when there are disciplinary problems. Some parents, understandably, have little to no time to be involved in their children's lives, let alone their education. Parents are working several jobs, coming and going and sometimes lack or don't take time to monitor their children's education, work with them on homework, school projects, etc.

(5) Schools still seem too focused on preparing students for college. Our focus for K-8 should be on establishing competency in the "core" subjects. Those core subjects are necessary for all children, regardless of the career path they may take. If we accomplished that with some degree of consistency, then we need to find ways to help guide and promote children in education that will help prepare them for their specific areas of interest and career choice. In my view we have come to expect universities to finish the job of the K-12 systems in providing that "liberal" education that used to be accomplished in K-8 or at least K-12. We need to begin to build out programs that prepare children for different career paths including trade schools, technical schools, etc.

(6) Family lives have become merry-go-rounds. There are far too many extra-curricular activities, especially sports. I see parents I work with exhausted each morning after having shuttled 2 or 3 children from school to football or dance lessons and back again. There is no quality time, no family meals, no opportunity to find out what's really going on in a child's life. Our "always connected" world means children are too focused on their tablets, computers or smart phones to engage one another in meaningful interaction.

I don't have an answer but these are some of the things I see as problematic and must definitely contribute to the failure of our educational system to meet the needs of our children and, sadly, for us as a nation going forward. I got a high quality PUBLIC education. There were no private schools, even religious, in the small town where I grew up. But the public schools delivered quality. There was order in the classroom. Parents were actively engaged in children's lives. Extra curricular activities were only AFTER homework and home chores were done.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

K&R idwiyo Mar 2013 #1
K&R Teamster Jeff Mar 2013 #2
K&R G_j Mar 2013 #3
Post removed Post removed Mar 2013 #4
Damn! That might leave a well earned mark. TheKentuckian Mar 2013 #6
Well, think about it. Le Taz Hot Mar 2013 #5
And Arne Duncan never spent a day in a school teaching and so does not know timdog44 Mar 2013 #44
that is a gross exaggeration, and this cheating occurred before obama was elected. mopinko Mar 2013 #68
When are the links coming that prove what a wonderful job UnrepentantLiberal Mar 2013 #7
That's one thing you will never find here because duffyduff Mar 2013 #59
The sad thing is that a lot of the things in-the-trenches teachers advocate winter is coming Mar 2013 #8
those jerks and their minions shoudl be prosecutedunder RICO, elehhhhna Mar 2013 #9
And it is the kids who suffer most of all Fearless Mar 2013 #10
I'm not sure how protecting the integrety of the system... reACTIONary Mar 2013 #11
Maybe because tests abelenkpe Mar 2013 #16
Absolutely Iwillnevergiveup Mar 2013 #20
In general, what is wrong with "teaching to the tests"... reACTIONary Mar 2013 #23
Tests don't -- and can't -- measure understanding starroute Mar 2013 #28
I think your observation may refer to a restrictive subset of tests... reACTIONary Mar 2013 #38
Au contraire. AdHocSolver Mar 2013 #77
+1 Starry Messenger Mar 2013 #79
Ma réplique... reACTIONary Mar 2013 #81
Standardized tests don't necessarily measure anything. AdHocSolver Mar 2013 #91
The Bell Curve... reACTIONary Mar 2013 #94
I was clueless until I had kids in the school system-Ed has changed beyond the comprehension of many lunasun Mar 2013 #97
There is no worse system of education than 'teaching to the test'. sabrina 1 Mar 2013 #56
Fine. But do you have any testing to back that up? reACTIONary Mar 2013 #87
You don't teach to any test. That is not the purpose of testing. You EDUCATE sabrina 1 Mar 2013 #95
+1000s (n/t) bread_and_roses Mar 2013 #107
Nothing. Works fine for lawyers, CPAs, and other industry exams... Comrade_McKenzie Mar 2013 #84
Solidarity, Comrade! (nt) reACTIONary Mar 2013 #88
Except that's not how it works. jeff47 Mar 2013 #114
What would you propose? What would be the best way... reACTIONary Mar 2013 #22
Either the Finnish system which does not test or a portfolio system where kids Orlandodem Mar 2013 #36
I've heard of the "Finnish system" and just looked it up... reACTIONary Mar 2013 #43
Finland, a tiny country with a tiny population, is not the United States duffyduff Mar 2013 #60
How 'bout we trust teachers to solve this? jeff47 Mar 2013 #39
I can give you a very authoratative answer... reACTIONary Mar 2013 #47
No, we don't. jeff47 Mar 2013 #52
I think you make a good point... reACTIONary Mar 2013 #55
You're still missing the central point jeff47 Mar 2013 #57
dumb or hungry? reACTIONary Mar 2013 #92
Apparently, you needed more tests in reading comprehension jeff47 Mar 2013 #113
Teachers can evaluate students... reACTIONary Mar 2013 #118
No. Students are not "products" - nor is knowledge a "product." bread_and_roses Mar 2013 #110
The Hallowed Halls... reACTIONary Mar 2013 #112
The education "reformers" are starting at the WRONG END. AdHocSolver Mar 2013 #82
RE: They did an across-the-board reevaluation of everything... reACTIONary Mar 2013 #85
If you don't understand what is wrong with that, LWolf Mar 2013 #75
I think you make some very good points... reACTIONary Mar 2013 #78
Did you know that, LWolf Mar 2013 #86
Thanks for the reply... reACTIONary Mar 2013 #111
I'm going to have to make this one the last. LWolf Mar 2013 #115
Thanks again, I'll read through it carefully (nt) reACTIONary Mar 2013 #117
When non-teachers who don't know anything about education tell teachers how to do their jobs, duffyduff Apr 2013 #122
Do teachers... reACTIONary Apr 2013 #123
amen to all that (n/t) bread_and_roses Mar 2013 #116
Because tests that do that don't exist. proud2BlibKansan Mar 2013 #108
And she wouldn't have been caught if the teachers hadn't told on her. proud2BlibKansan Mar 2013 #12
Except that isn't how I would generally describe what happened... cherokeeprogressive Mar 2013 #67
There are umpteen versions of how it all came down. proud2BlibKansan Mar 2013 #70
k&r Starry Messenger Mar 2013 #13
But but but ... 99Forever Mar 2013 #14
K&R formercia Mar 2013 #15
LOL, someone alerted this and lost badly! Here are the results! Logical Mar 2013 #17
"birtheresque comment" zeemike Mar 2013 #24
I thank you jury and my child thanks you too. liberal_at_heart Mar 2013 #62
You get what you measure. nt antigop Mar 2013 #18
And one wonders why anyone would be against measurement. (nt) reACTIONary Mar 2013 #26
depends upon what is being measured and what we are "getting". In this case, look what allegedly antigop Mar 2013 #33
Agreed. And I hope this serves an example for others. (nt) reACTIONary Mar 2013 #89
There are so many answers and I wish I could go into them all now. BrotherIvan Mar 2013 #40
My bet is... reACTIONary Mar 2013 #90
Since learning is strictly up to the desire or ability of kids to learn, it can't measure duffyduff Mar 2013 #64
You don't believe that teachers can be inspiring... reACTIONary Mar 2013 #83
K&R!!!!! Public not profit! Dark n Stormy Knight Mar 2013 #19
A very hearty K&R! demmiblue Mar 2013 #21
45 years ?!? Geez, it's not like she crashed the economy or lied us into war. eppur_se_muova Mar 2013 #25
A good article, a stupid OP bhikkhu Mar 2013 #27
Would you say that Obama and Duncan have pushed back on MannyGoldstein Mar 2013 #32
As far as I can see, they've done nothing in 4 years on that bhikkhu Mar 2013 #37
Race to the Top is Obama's baby and is 1,000 times worse than NCLB. n/t duffyduff Mar 2013 #63
+10000000 nt woo me with science Apr 2013 #120
Check this Salon article it's happening in other places. erinlough Mar 2013 #34
Cheating Runs Rampant/Salon/May2012 ReRe Mar 2013 #98
Good post! A very astute point... reACTIONary Mar 2013 #106
We get it. savebigbird Mar 2013 #109
Arne Duncan following NCLB is a trainwreck for public education PufPuf23 Mar 2013 #29
It sure has been. nt LWolf Mar 2013 #30
sssshhhhhh... we best be silent.. nt PufPuf23 Mar 2013 #31
As much as DU hates Bush with a passion you would think more people would liberal_at_heart Mar 2013 #74
This article is more sulphurdunn Mar 2013 #35
Interesting, thank you. Starry Messenger Mar 2013 #41
I was chased off another site for daring to speak against the Gates foundation BrotherIvan Mar 2013 #42
Not sure what you said to get chased off timdog44 Mar 2013 #48
He has plenty of money to buy good PR though BrotherIvan Mar 2013 #53
Here's the problem: for the "reformers", it isn't about education. Marr Mar 2013 #45
Absolutely. BrotherIvan Mar 2013 #46
Sadly, both Eli Broad sulphurdunn Mar 2013 #50
Even convicted criminals are. Case in point: Michael Milken. n/t duffyduff Mar 2013 #61
Yea, he's come along way sulphurdunn Mar 2013 #69
He and Bill Bennett are in cahoots with K-12 duffyduff Mar 2013 #76
yes, the democratic politicians are perfectly fine with sacrificing unions to get some corporate liberal_at_heart Mar 2013 #72
K & R !!! WillyT Mar 2013 #49
My only comment is this did not start with Obama..... Swede Atlanta Mar 2013 #51
+1 freshwest Mar 2013 #58
I think you have timdog44 Mar 2013 #66
As a former public school teacher, I say you have pretty good insight into the situation. Regarding Dark n Stormy Knight Mar 2013 #71
It didn't start with Obama. LWolf Mar 2013 #73
So what? woo me with science Mar 2013 #102
Virtually everything junior foisted upon America was imo either: illegal, immoral, inhumane, indepat Mar 2013 #54
Du rec. Nt xchrom Mar 2013 #65
K&R Canuckistanian Mar 2013 #80
Atlanta could do for education "reform" what Newtown did for reasonble gun control. hay rick Mar 2013 #93
I’m an Obama guy and think many of his center right positions were always as a result of his busterbrown Mar 2013 #96
Dr Beverly Hall/Atlanta School cheating/NYTimes ReRe Mar 2013 #99
K&R woo me with science Mar 2013 #100
An embarassment? Yea, but very profitable. AnotherMcIntosh Mar 2013 #101
Ed reform is the sh/t. blkmusclmachine Mar 2013 #103
It's not complicated: Follow The Politicians fredamae Mar 2013 #104
Passed on to my state ed committee ranking member. Thav Mar 2013 #105
You've probably read this, but... savebigbird Apr 2013 #119
Chris Hayes is doing a segment on this tonight octoberlib Apr 2013 #121
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