General Discussion

Orrex

(67,117 posts)

221. I'm sure that you believe that

Sat Apr 13, 2013, 09:37 PM

Apr 2013

So, in your view, making a movie entitles one to hire based on appearance. Fair enough.

What other forms of entertainment qualify? And why or why not?

You have declared that, for the entertainment industry, it's a matter of free speech. Why is it not also free speech for other industries? Why does entertainment get to enjoy this special privilege, but other industries must not?

I don't "applaud" discrimination, nor am I a Libertarian, so that's two baseless accusations that you've made. Instead, I'm asking you to identify where you draw distinctions between acceptable appearance-based hiring and unacceptable appearance-based hiring.

I'm sure that you'll go to sleep tonight thinking that you've proven your point, and if you want to believe that then I say more power to you.

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Hooters of the shoe-shine world--Shine Shoes At New Wall Street Shop [View all] KoKo Apr 2013 OP

I would think they would want them to wear their hair back. Just sayin'. Safetykitten Apr 2013 #1

Not what the men want. :-) WinkyDink Apr 2013 #215

And people say Feminists are outdated and no longer needed. MattBaggins Apr 2013 #2

you cannot relieve the gals of any responsibility Skittles Apr 2013 #7

Degrading? redqueen Apr 2013 #27

I would not do that either Skittles Apr 2013 #36

I would not have thought so... my point is that girls are raised to see this redqueen Apr 2013 #37

I never said otherwise Skittles Apr 2013 #77

I will not criticize the women MattBaggins Apr 2013 #98

Some muslim women like to wear scarves and such The Straight Story Apr 2013 #17

Um, because they don't have to do it to get paid? Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #40

And these ladies had no other choices? The Straight Story Apr 2013 #43

Phil Donahue once asked Gloria Steinem about the stereotype feminists hate sex. Bucky Apr 2013 #49

And that has exactly what to do with head scarves? Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #72

Can men apply for this job? Elderly women? Overweight women? MattBaggins Apr 2013 #99

I don't find it appealing myself and get what folks are saying The Straight Story Apr 2013 #100

Wrong MattBaggins Apr 2013 #103

Yeah, see how well that goes over The Straight Story Apr 2013 #112

Hiring based on looks should be illegal MattBaggins Apr 2013 #114

For movies, magazines, ads, etc? The Straight Story Apr 2013 #118

Hiring based on looks should be illegal MattBaggins Apr 2013 #121

Ok.... The Straight Story Apr 2013 #130

You're still not getting it MattBaggins Apr 2013 #131

In cases where appearance isn't the job, yes. Shivering Jemmy Apr 2013 #183

Incorrect MattBaggins Apr 2013 #184

Apparently not incorrect Shivering Jemmy Apr 2013 #210

Oh I see we are in agreement. MattBaggins Apr 2013 #214

I can't begin to tell you the number of jobs I got because I was juajen Apr 2013 #238

Why? Orrex Apr 2013 #135

Really? MattBaggins Apr 2013 #146

Why not? Orrex Apr 2013 #153

I have some business ideas MattBaggins Apr 2013 #162

excellent post. thank you mattbaggins. nt seabeyond Apr 2013 #163

"Hiring discrimination outside of true entertainment or artistic venues is illegal" Orrex Apr 2013 #166

Explain specifically why 1+1 equals 2 MattBaggins Apr 2013 #169

You're not actually answering the question Orrex Apr 2013 #172

There is a far cry from cleanliness and good hygiene MattBaggins Apr 2013 #175

Nope, try again Orrex Apr 2013 #180

Nope not going to try again MattBaggins Apr 2013 #181

In other words, you can't defend your point. Orrex Apr 2013 #187

I can defend my post and did so MattBaggins Apr 2013 #188

Calling it silly isn't the same as answering it Orrex Apr 2013 #192

You're being absurd and you know it MattBaggins Apr 2013 #193

No, I'm simply trying to identify the boundaries that you will not Orrex Apr 2013 #199

Those cases were badly decided MattBaggins Apr 2013 #202

Well, you can see how this will go, can't you? Orrex Apr 2013 #205

They could TRY to declare themselves entertainment MattBaggins Apr 2013 #206

Lots of windmills in your posts Orrex Apr 2013 #207

I have explained it well enough MattBaggins Apr 2013 #212

I'm sure that you believe that Orrex Apr 2013 #221

And you believe you have made a point so more power to you as well. MattBaggins Apr 2013 #225

i have fallen in love with you. nt seabeyond Apr 2013 #102

I worked in a building in which "these" men got their shoes shined by black men... WhaTHellsgoingonhere Apr 2013 #56

yup. i feel the same. nt seabeyond Apr 2013 #62

When I saw this right away I thought about the history of white guys getting their shoes shined by limpyhobbler Apr 2013 #81

exactly. thank you. nt seabeyond Apr 2013 #82

I did too. And in the old days, where the grown men "shoe-shine boys" were a common sight, Squinch Apr 2013 #147

Just an observation... Bay Boy Apr 2013 #156

Why do they? Are the shoes crazy glued to their feet? And a shoe without a foot in it Squinch Apr 2013 #194

LOL well barbers are working on their heads Bay Boy Apr 2013 #195

Tis is the future they are offering our daughters - flirtstitution and worse. grahamhgreen Apr 2013 #3

I'd like to shine those guy's shoes with a sledge hammer . olddots Apr 2013 #4

Um, so you'd fight dehumanization with dehumanization? Bucky Apr 2013 #50

"I'd like to shine those guy's shoes with a sledge hammer ." NoPasaran Apr 2013 #139

She could make a fortune in tips MattBaggins Apr 2013 #177

the pic is kind of degrading Liberal_in_LA Apr 2013 #5

Yet, many women, especially single moms will do it because Cleita Apr 2013 #13

They'll have to wear low cut blouse and flirt to make good tips. degrading. Liberal_in_LA Apr 2013 #16

and then they'll complain about not being taken seriously Skittles Apr 2013 #22

And to think some men even here on DU MattBaggins Apr 2013 #105

Yet that has been the way since I remember. Cleita Apr 2013 #25

When the Soviet Union collapsed, female physicists and other highly-educated women Nay Apr 2013 #32

I heard a story about woman in New York who graduated with a PhD and limpyhobbler Apr 2013 #84

Equal Pay? Riftaxe Apr 2013 #60

Well, they are making more than cashiering at Wal-Mart, I would assume. n/t Cleita Apr 2013 #61

This message was self-deleted by its author MattBaggins Apr 2013 #123

well. that is just disgusting. thank you so much for sharing, nt seabeyond Apr 2013 #6

I hope you weren't snarking at me. It's a reality of KoKo Apr 2013 #58

it is disgustingly demeaning as the men snark, getting their shoes done to objectify the gals seabeyond Apr 2013 #66

Thanks for clarifying...your post to me seemed to say I was posting KoKo Apr 2013 #74

no. they do not gotta do. you wouldnt do. i wouldnt do. nt seabeyond Apr 2013 #80

It would be a Last Resort for Me...but Today's Females are More Diversified KoKo Apr 2013 #83

that is not the whole story, as i have said in my posts. yes, they make their choice seabeyond Apr 2013 #85

I edited my post..don't know if you caught that..will wait to see. KoKo Apr 2013 #87

and again, even with the edit, yes. there would be women that think it fun. seabeyond Apr 2013 #89

Young Women Today are in Competitive Sports, Military, Sailing around the World KoKo Apr 2013 #96

i competed against men for a life time. that is an equalizer. what these women are doing is shiftin seabeyond Apr 2013 #104

lets not be fooled. or play otherwise. the women are shining shoes because of the racial signifcance seabeyond Apr 2013 #93

seabeyond...there is NO ONE making them do that...like a SlaveMaster.. KoKo Apr 2013 #97

You didn't answer my "Young Women Today" post... KoKo Apr 2013 #106

Ugly truths need to be exposed imo. Rex Apr 2013 #65

as i have said about 3 times today. it hits hard when a girl kills herself because of raging male seabeyond Apr 2013 #67

I know which thread you are talking about. Rex Apr 2013 #70

Class warfare and sexism all in one pic... limpyhobbler Apr 2013 #86

The owner just needs to come clean and admit Rex Apr 2013 #136

See? Wall Street = job creators.... deutsey Apr 2013 #8

Lemme see. Little shorts; a little scanty tank top; beer and wine served too. Cleita Apr 2013 #9

This message was self-deleted by its author devilgrrl Apr 2013 #10

SCHEDULING DEVILGAL FOR ASS KICKING Skittles Apr 2013 #11

That costs extra. n/t Cleita Apr 2013 #14

That's the spit-shine, and it's pretty expensive. nt Nay Apr 2013 #33

I cannot express what feelings that picture -- Hell Hath No Fury Apr 2013 #12

How so tragic for the women to legally and legitimately earn money this way. zappaman Apr 2013 #15

Oh, you are SO cool and contrarian on these matters! RadiationTherapy Apr 2013 #18

Thanks! zappaman Apr 2013 #20

You're welcome; I tried to use the adjectives it seemed you were seeking the most. RadiationTherapy Apr 2013 #23

And you're all like "hey, I just want to post something about you instead of the OP" zappaman Apr 2013 #24

I love giving attention where it is most sought. RadiationTherapy Apr 2013 #26

Yes, god forbid someone have a different opinion. zappaman Apr 2013 #28

What different opinion? Yours seems to be the same opinion as the wall street guys getting shined. RadiationTherapy Apr 2013 #29

Nononono, you've got it all wrong... redqueen Apr 2013 #47

We are all prudes MattBaggins Apr 2013 #108

. Squinch Apr 2013 #88

Adjectives fail me. HughBeaumont Apr 2013 #19

I see the term 'class' means something different Rex Apr 2013 #21

THIS. Fawke Em Apr 2013 #30

I really wish there were a non-gendered word in the geek tragedy Apr 2013 #31

Hopefully there will be guards to protect from attacks by... L0oniX Apr 2013 #34

this picture boils my blood as much as pictures of cops clubbing civil rights demonstrators in the olddots Apr 2013 #35

Enough of this "degradation" indignation. BlueStreak Apr 2013 #38

'shoe shine boys' Rex Apr 2013 #39

I don't know if black kids felt degraded doing that. And nobody here knows if the women BlueStreak Apr 2013 #44

Speaking of degradation, a friend told me a bit of "reality from the hood" last evening BlueStreak Apr 2013 #46

Wow. Rex Apr 2013 #51

Um, yes, from about a month ago: muriel_volestrangler Apr 2013 #57

Do you beleive what you type ? olddots Apr 2013 #63

Do you think that was a good thing, that the work was expected to be done by grown Squinch Apr 2013 #92

If these girls were referred to as "shoe shine sluts", you would have a point BlueStreak Apr 2013 #128

Oy. Where to begin? You equate the terms "shoe-shine boy" and "shoe-shine slut?" Squinch Apr 2013 #138

Sure, it was acceptable, if it wasn't done in a subjugating way BlueStreak Apr 2013 #141

How does one call a grown man a "shoe-shine boy" without doing it in a subjugating way? Squinch Apr 2013 #144

In a serious defense of blue streak MattBaggins Apr 2013 #186

I don't know about this. Even allowing for ignorance of the demeaning racial history, Squinch Apr 2013 #196

You won't find any argument from me MattBaggins Apr 2013 #198

. Squinch Apr 2013 #201

You did not ask me about the term "boy". You asked me if the JOB BlueStreak Apr 2013 #220

As I responded to your previous "call out," re-read the question and your answer. If you meant Squinch Apr 2013 #224

It should be opbvious to any reader that my response pertained to the job BlueStreak Apr 2013 #235

Nothing of the sort. He misquoted me, and you followed suit. BlueStreak Apr 2013 #219

You misquoted me. That is disingenuous at best. You asked BlueStreak Apr 2013 #218

Here is what I asked: Squinch Apr 2013 #223

I am waiting to see the response to your 'disingenuous' words... Whisp Apr 2013 #253

Yes. Squinch Apr 2013 #258

black shoeshine boys needed to titillate customers for tips? Skittles Apr 2013 #227

Those assholes getting their shoes shined are not paying enough taxes. hunter Apr 2013 #41

They should located around the corner, on Beaver Street badtoworse Apr 2013 #42

Really in poor taste dballance Apr 2013 #52

You're right. Sometimes, I just can't help myself badtoworse Apr 2013 #226

And this, kids, passes as wit among a certain segment of our culture. Hard to believe, I know. Squinch Apr 2013 #142

Sounds like a good business idea to me. MrSlayer Apr 2013 #45

Stand for something or fall for anything olddots Apr 2013 #64

Choose your battles wisely. MrSlayer Apr 2013 #79

This message was self-deleted by its author olddots Apr 2013 #134

If a 300 pound man wanted to apply for this job and was turned away MattBaggins Apr 2013 #109

It would be discrimination. Laelth Apr 2013 #254

Not fully correct MattBaggins Apr 2013 #256

And they are all college students siligut Apr 2013 #48

OMFG redqueen Apr 2013 #53

I know siligut Apr 2013 #54

Waaaaiiiiittt a minute!!! Squinch Apr 2013 #234

can someone please lock this thread before it gets worse dballance Apr 2013 #55

What's bothering you about this thread? Replies are to News Article. KoKo Apr 2013 #91

Post removed Post removed Apr 2013 #59

OMG wtf? limpyhobbler Apr 2013 #90

And that's the third one in this thread. nt redqueen Apr 2013 #208

They're infantile, creepy, AND stunningly unoriginal! I wonder if that takes effort. Squinch Apr 2013 #236

Some people need to lighten up cpwm17 Apr 2013 #68

This message was self-deleted by its author devilgrrl Apr 2013 #69

I have no daughter cpwm17 Apr 2013 #75

This message was self-deleted by its author devilgrrl Apr 2013 #78

do you not understand Skittles Apr 2013 #107

I understand where you're coming from cpwm17 Apr 2013 #116

we MUST take advantage? Skittles Apr 2013 #117

I meant CAN (with slightly different wording) cpwm17 Apr 2013 #119

Yes it does make the world worse MattBaggins Apr 2013 #110

ugh. look at the look on those faces. Whisp Apr 2013 #71

So why can't they wear jeans and a t-shirt to do this job. with hair in a ponytail undeterred Apr 2013 #73

You think those guys would go get their shoe polished by folks in Jeans? KoKo Apr 2013 #76

Or why can't boys be hired for the job? treestar Apr 2013 #113

Because wall street males think they deserve a hard on during a shoe shine. undeterred Apr 2013 #115

For folks saying these women chose to do it... limpyhobbler Apr 2013 #94

Well said. I think everyone knows this deep down. Those who insist: Squinch Apr 2013 #127

yeah. pretending to love the job is part of the job. limpyhobbler Apr 2013 #174

Ever hear of Suzy Favor Hamilton? WinniSkipper Apr 2013 #190

I never ran into more aggressive, more pervasive, more entitled sexism than in the Squinch Apr 2013 #95

You are not alone...Many Business Blogs have addressed this... KoKo Apr 2013 #125

they are probably the worst i have seen, they think they own the place and can have their JI7 Apr 2013 #137

And the feeling is so pervasive that they think it's OK that they went out and did Squinch Apr 2013 #140

Be a shame if that shoeshine stand caught fire some night. mwrguy Apr 2013 #101

I shined shoes as a youth, Denis 11 Apr 2013 #120

The customers are pigs MattBaggins Apr 2013 #122

Guess it's better than pole dancing treestar Apr 2013 #111

And another thing... Only a fuckwad needs someone else to shine their shoes MattBaggins Apr 2013 #124

Message auto-removed Name removed Apr 2013 #126

Really? Do we really need upscale shoe shining? Initech Apr 2013 #129

Hooters of the shoe-shine world expands to France . . . can't find any employees. pa28 Apr 2013 #132

Or is it because the French aren't such prudes about sexuality? BlueStreak Apr 2013 #143

How does that follow from a report of a lack of women willing to take a demeaning job? Squinch Apr 2013 #145

The French probably aren't titillated so much by that. Ergo, it is just a crap job BlueStreak Apr 2013 #217

At one time when I was in college, I got a very well paying job as a cocktail waitress in a place Squinch Apr 2013 #232

I understand all of that. I'm simply saying it is free will BlueStreak Apr 2013 #245

bogus argument. no one is "letting" them or not, do the job. that is not the discussion or the issue seabeyond Apr 2013 #246

Demeaning and below one's aspirations are worlds apart. Which makes me pretty sure that Squinch Apr 2013 #249

This message was self-deleted by its author Apophis Apr 2013 #133

I see nothing wrong with this. pintobean Apr 2013 #148

This message was self-deleted by its author Upton Apr 2013 #149

Um..are these women being forced to do this? Upton Apr 2013 #150

Just your all american red blooded man sufrommich Apr 2013 #151

We need a choice on the alert page MattBaggins Apr 2013 #157

Right next to the pintobean Apr 2013 #161

There is no specific wording in the ToS, mission statement and community standards MattBaggins Apr 2013 #164

The idea that women should make their own choices pintobean Apr 2013 #165

Legal Hiring Discrimination MattBaggins Apr 2013 #167

Then, alert on my post and check the TOS box pintobean Apr 2013 #168

Sense of importance? MattBaggins Apr 2013 #170

In other words pintobean Apr 2013 #171

How the hell did I make this about you MattBaggins Apr 2013 #173

I can say whatever I want pintobean Apr 2013 #182

+100 n/t zappaman Apr 2013 #185

Agreed. If I wanted a morality lecture, I'd go to a church LittleBlue Apr 2013 #231

Given the right opportunities and connections the roles could easily be reversed. DCBob Apr 2013 #152

I just don't get it. I'm a heterosexual man, but I would feel TheManInTheMac Apr 2013 #154

ya. i think maybe it is all that. seabeyond Apr 2013 #160

Thank you for seeing women as people, and not decorations. redqueen Apr 2013 #176

You are a man among men, Mac. Would that there were more of you in the world. nt Nay Apr 2013 #242

there are tons of these men, hence why there is not one of these or hooters on every corner. seabeyond Apr 2013 #244

hugs to you MacMan Whisp Apr 2013 #251

THIS whisp. this is all the difference. in a daughter choosing a husband. the gift that keeps on seabeyond Apr 2013 #252

wish this post was an OP so I could DU Rec it. thank you. Tuesday Afternoon Apr 2013 #255

This was actually a really good idea for a business quinnox Apr 2013 #155

Here's Another Place I'd Avoid... KharmaTrain Apr 2013 #158

Sure, it's his boss he's worried about NoGOPZone Apr 2013 #159

Places who employ scantily clad women are seldom 'classy' or 'upscale'. Sheldon Cooper Apr 2013 #178

30 years ago the word "classy" MattBaggins Apr 2013 #179

This message was self-deleted by its author tammywammy Apr 2013 #197

Anything that shows more than this... zappaman Apr 2013 #200

Sorry, I self deleted since I didn't want to get in a back and forth over it. tammywammy Apr 2013 #203

Well, I certainly don't want to get into any "back and forth" either. Sheldon Cooper Apr 2013 #216

Great way to discriminate against workers. athenasatanjesus Apr 2013 #189

Totally demeaning. I just hope they are receiving some really big tips. n/t RebelOne Apr 2013 #191

Good grief. Does Everything have to be sexed up? Ilsa Apr 2013 #204

Yes, hot-n-sexxxy men served up as decorations for the gals is a solid business model. redqueen Apr 2013 #209

"What's next? Speedo-clad butchers in the meat market for the gals?" edbermac Apr 2013 #211

Oh, I'm sure it's a "Gentlemen's Shoeshine." Why aren't the roles reversed? WinkyDink Apr 2013 #213

Do a lot of women have their shoes shined? Orrex Apr 2013 #222

we do it ourselves Skittles Apr 2013 #228

Interesting badtoworse Apr 2013 #229

Ditto on both WinniSkipper Apr 2013 #250

Who cares? This has been going on at Hooters for decades. LittleBlue Apr 2013 #230

i care olddots Apr 2013 #237

when women are passed over for other jobs and these are the only options JI7 Apr 2013 #239

What are the alternatives? LittleBlue Apr 2013 #241

your argument sounds like what i hear about people that work all day for two bucks a day. seabeyond Apr 2013 #243

Ah yes....the men sit there and fantasize the women are giving them bjs. Avalux Apr 2013 #233

yuck. HiPointDem Apr 2013 #240

If the 1%ers want some 99%er T&As to look... 99Forever Apr 2013 #247

Gross. Iggo Apr 2013 #248

How many males here would take this job if the roles were reversed? octothorpe Apr 2013 #257