General Discussion

99Forever

(14,524 posts)

232. Never had much popularity anyway...

Sat Feb 4, 2012, 12:01 PM

Feb 2012

.. so I've always hoped to have the courage to stand up for my convictions. It's gotten me knocked down a few times, but I always get back up.

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I guess it is a stupid way to get your idea across... and it does tend to alienate people. [View all] LanternWaste Feb 2012 OP

THANK YOU! n/t librechik Feb 2012 #1

IT'S NOT HARD TO FUCKING OFFEND PEOPLE! Bicoastal Feb 2012 #20

A few people always get overexcited. JDPriestly Feb 2012 #98

No it isn't hard to offend people. GeorgeGist Feb 2012 #154

OMG - occupying lunch counters, fronts of buses! How anti-American! leveymg Feb 2012 #2

Not to mention, these folks only started the movement, there was plenty Lionessa Feb 2012 #45

Rosa Parks should have torched a flag on the bus. Skinner Feb 2012 #3

And if she did that, everyone would know exactly what her cause was arcane1 Feb 2012 #5

Oh come on, it's practically the same exact thing! redqueen Feb 2012 #9

This message was self-deleted by its author arely staircase Feb 2012 #90

A tiny group of people burned the flag in Oakland. JDPriestly Feb 2012 #101

It is absurd, but that's what the MSM do... redqueen Feb 2012 #103

...and what people here help them do...nt Union Scribe Feb 2012 #132

Thank you! nobodyspecial Feb 2012 #10

Same here! loyalsister Feb 2012 #120

True that both would have been unpopular. LanternWaste Feb 2012 #15

I don't think you understand--activism is not JUST about offending the other side. Bicoastal Feb 2012 #37

"It hasn't even worked here" Union Scribe Feb 2012 #131

It wouldn't have been as appropriate at the time as it is now. Lionessa Feb 2012 #21

I don't see the economic hardship and cronyism today as equal to Nuclear Unicorn Feb 2012 #32

Please refer to our conversations in any other related thread. You and I have covered Lionessa Feb 2012 #36

Have you ever made less that $10000 a year in your adult life? sudopod Feb 2012 #54

Look beyond today cbrer Feb 2012 #136

+1 Wait Wut Feb 2012 #38

That's the first overt snark I've heard from you, Skinner. leveymg Feb 2012 #82

THANK YOU! n/t librechik Feb 2012 #111

LOL. Good one Skinner. tabasco Feb 2012 #118

Especially if she STOLE the flag from a public building! tabasco Feb 2012 #119

doing what she did was incendiary Union Scribe Feb 2012 #130

Of course she should have done it. And, as I said, Skinner Feb 2012 #140

Clever sarcasm - check whatchamacallit Feb 2012 #147

So, just more sarcasm. Union Scribe Feb 2012 #164

By that logic, Occupy should sit down. On buses. In this day and age ... T S Justly Feb 2012 #142

Maybe she should have smashed the bus windows windows as well. alphafemale Feb 2012 #165

Flag burning was taboo until the 1980s. Black people sitting on busses... joshcryer Feb 2012 #172

+1000 Cleita Feb 2012 #4

Yeah! Imagine how much more Rosa Parks would have accomplished... Bicoastal Feb 2012 #6

heh Nuclear Unicorn Feb 2012 #8

Weird. I thought Rev King won by appealing to what was best about people Nuclear Unicorn Feb 2012 #7

They are as false or as true as we see them to be. LanternWaste Feb 2012 #11

No, they are as alienating as mainstream society sees them to be. nt redqueen Feb 2012 #13

Then we must ask ourselves an unpleasant question LanternWaste Feb 2012 #17

How is that unpleasant? It's very basic PR. redqueen Feb 2012 #25

Censoring a statement or a thing you yourself believe is just and true LanternWaste Feb 2012 #58

I can't believe you're comparing stealing and burning a flag redqueen Feb 2012 #64

The question is not whether the flag-burning was offensive. JDPriestly Feb 2012 #125

It will be as alienating as the undecideds determine. Nuclear Unicorn Feb 2012 #16

OWS is not running for office. nt EFerrari Feb 2012 #23

More is the pity. Nuclear Unicorn Feb 2012 #29

I'm guessing you'll need to ask yourself that questions. LanternWaste Feb 2012 #31

Way to get lost in the sauce. Nuclear Unicorn Feb 2012 #43

That's what I thought as well. nt MADem Feb 2012 #19

King didn't operate in a vacuum. There were radical alternatives that applied pressure to the debate TheKentuckian Feb 2012 #27

You are right Art_from_Ark Feb 2012 #182

Exactly the right comparison. I've tried to verbally Lionessa Feb 2012 #12

Not even close. nobodyspecial Feb 2012 #41

Are they burning flags at that lunch counter or on that bus? MADem Feb 2012 #14

No, but if they were burning the confederate flag in those instances, would it bother you? Lionessa Feb 2012 #28

So why DIDN'T they burn the Confederate flag? Bicoastal Feb 2012 #44

Ultimately we burned the USA flag, and STILL managed to have the issues addressed, go figure. Lionessa Feb 2012 #53

Why are you comparing the Confederate flag... Wait Wut Feb 2012 #47

That's as silly as saying "If they were burning Barbie dolls would it bother you?" MADem Feb 2012 #66

If you can't see the relevance, then there's no ground for us to discuss the matter. Lionessa Feb 2012 #80

I can't see the relevance, and it's pretty clear I'm not alone. nt MADem Feb 2012 #85

And I'm not alone in seeing it, WTF does that have to do with anything? Afraid to have your own Lionessa Feb 2012 #86

I've made my opinion very clear in this thread. MADem Feb 2012 #87

Then why point out that you're in a group of like opinions if not to make that Lionessa Feb 2012 #89

I have contributed a number of comments to this thread, that express my feelings on the topic. MADem Feb 2012 #96

Alas history doesn't support your perception. Lionessa Feb 2012 #100

Again, let's get back to this OP and stop wandering all afield to find a hook upon which to hang MADem Feb 2012 #104

Bless your heart. Lionessa Feb 2012 #108

Right backatcha, y'all. nt MADem Feb 2012 #109

no you are not. Bluerthanblue Feb 2012 #88

+ a brazilian nt arely staircase Feb 2012 #95

MADem, the Civil Rights movement turned quite disorderly. JDPriestly Feb 2012 #126

I invite your attention to the OP, once again. MADem Feb 2012 #139

Don't Worry... they aren't harming your modern day staus quo fascisthunter Feb 2012 #194

Pardon me for making an observation shared by most. MADem Feb 2012 #212

no... it was I who hit a nerve fascisthunter Feb 2012 #213

What, bite down on a piece of peanut brittle and break a tooth? Go see a dentist! MADem Feb 2012 #216

Just admit it... fascisthunter Feb 2012 #217

You are only an apprentice at baiting behavior. MADem Feb 2012 #218

No, I was wrong... you aren't on my side fascisthunter Feb 2012 #219

By your words I know you. MADem Feb 2012 #223

Not all that similar, really. MineralMan Feb 2012 #18

Similar in that they are both LanternWaste Feb 2012 #22

I don't know a soul who was "pissed off" at those civil rights demonstrations. MADem Feb 2012 #68

And did the subsequent flag burning and riots stop the movement, or end the possibility of making a Lionessa Feb 2012 #91

Martin Luther King never burned a flag. Nor did anyone following him. MADem Feb 2012 #99

Neither MLK nor his direct followers won the Civil Rights movement alone, Lionessa Feb 2012 #102

You're failing to make the argument postulated in the OP. MADem Feb 2012 #107

During the Civil Rights era flags were burned. Did that change your mind about the major sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #110

I invite your attention to the OP, which says that Rosa Parks and a lunch counter sit in is the MADem Feb 2012 #113

I asked a question, your post is very combative for some reason. The OP is a continuation of sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #117

My post is not combative at all. It is very unfortunate for you that you see it that way. MADem Feb 2012 #161

No, what's wrong is your attempt to link one incident of flag burning to the entire OWS sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #166

You apparently have not read my posts. MADem Feb 2012 #168

African American decorated WW11 Veteran, Sydney Street burned his American flag after the sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #177

I'll have to tell James Meredith he's dead--I'm quite sure he'll be very shocked at the news. MADem Feb 2012 #179

'Hoards of Black people'? Did someone make that claim? sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #184

You are the one who keeps mentioning them. Look at all the posts you have made on the topic. MADem Feb 2012 #185

Personal attack, and using the race of respected, historical people to do it. sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #189

It is plainly apparent to me that your posts are full of errors of fact. MADem Feb 2012 #215

Is it too late to reply to this post?? Number23 Mar 2012 #236

This is just yet another example of that business we see all too often. MADem Mar 2012 #237

Massive, massive history fail.... msanthrope Feb 2012 #225

You and I were cheering. But many, many people were not. JDPriestly Feb 2012 #127

The only people that weren't cheering were racists in their hearts. MADem Feb 2012 #138

And burning flags occurred during that era also, and were as irrelevant to that movement as sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #167

"The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral, Nye Bevan Feb 2012 #24

Burning a flag isn't violence. Geez. Lionessa Feb 2012 #30

So if some rednecks wanted to burn a Mexican flag on Cinco de Mayo, you'd support them. Nuclear Unicorn Feb 2012 #40

Absolutely. It's only fabric. Lionessa Feb 2012 #46

Do you think it would help them to build support redqueen Feb 2012 #55

Doubt it would make any long term impression, as flag burning in the past has not Lionessa Feb 2012 #57

"because of or in spite of doesn't matter" redqueen Feb 2012 #61

I don't need historians, I can read. Almost all civil rights movements have Lionessa Feb 2012 #78

I wasn't really thinking about flag-burning when I posted this. Nye Bevan Feb 2012 #69

+1 renie408 Feb 2012 #159

Send that to the Oakland PD. sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #186

nah, that poster like violence against us fascisthunter Feb 2012 #199

S/he seemed confused over where the violence has been coming from, so I sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #220

try HARDER! fascisthunter Feb 2012 #195

Sorry. What was I thinking, quoting Martin Luther King? Nye Bevan Feb 2012 #201

you mean twisting the meaning of his words... yeah, pretty sick actually fascisthunter Feb 2012 #202

Yep. You busted me. I twisted the meaning of his words. Nye Bevan Feb 2012 #204

yup... I did, again fascisthunter Feb 2012 #205

you certainly did! (nt) Nye Bevan Feb 2012 #207

Oh, yes I did! fascisthunter Feb 2012 #208

Thanks! Nye Bevan Feb 2012 #209

Well so long as you were directing his words towards the violent, and not towards OWS sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #221

What about these gentlemen? Nuclear Unicorn Feb 2012 #26

If you believe there was no rioting during the Civil Rights Movement EFerrari Feb 2012 #39

The so-called "race riots" were mostly massacres of innocent blacks by racist white gangs. Nye Bevan Feb 2012 #70

Yes, the overwhelming majority of race riots were whites attacking EFerrari Feb 2012 #73

Oh, dear. Who told you that? JDPriestly Feb 2012 #128

"Who"? The same assholes on FOX NEWS fascisthunter Feb 2012 #203

One of them did. A decorated African American WW11 veteran burned a flag sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #222

They were challenging specific evils hack89 Feb 2012 #33

Responding to the flag burning by flag clutching is easy. EFerrari Feb 2012 #34

Who's clutching? Saying "dumb ass move" isn't "clutching." MADem Feb 2012 #74

Yes, these pictures so clearly illustrate how some OWS actions have NOT nobodyspecial Feb 2012 #35

+100000000000000, especially that last sentence redqueen Feb 2012 #42

Like Wall Street.. so how much are you invested in that fetid tit? fascisthunter Feb 2012 #196

"fetid tit' redqueen Feb 2012 #224

Great Post! n/t zappaman Feb 2012 #48

You are comparing the air brushed mass media version of the civil rights movement EFerrari Feb 2012 #51

Right on!!! Wait Wut Feb 2012 #52

The lunch counter sit-in participants dressed up for the occasion, were polite and friendly, Nye Bevan Feb 2012 #71

lol fascisthunter Feb 2012 #206

peace AND violence took the civil rights movement forward xchrom Feb 2012 #84

That violence was used does not mean it helped. Donald Ian Rankin Feb 2012 #116

word n/t Bluerthanblue Feb 2012 #122

+2 nt MADem Feb 2012 #170

Yup lunatica Feb 2012 #200

wish I could recommend your reply! Bluerthanblue Feb 2012 #94

Bravo! Bobbie Jo Feb 2012 #124

this right here. nt sudopod Feb 2012 #49

What an incredibly ridiculous comparison Summer Hathaway Feb 2012 #50

It's not more ridculous than taking a tiny group of people for the whole of OWS. EFerrari Feb 2012 #59

I commented on the OP's comparison Summer Hathaway Feb 2012 #62

So then your implicit comparision is between the careful staging of Rosa Parks EFerrari Feb 2012 #67

I'm not the one making the comparison Summer Hathaway Feb 2012 #75

"by showing how non-violence - as opposed to theft, vandalism and flag-burning" EFerrari Feb 2012 #76

The OP begins with quotes Summer Hathaway Feb 2012 #92

Yet you and others here defend that tiny group of people. Which is it? MADem Feb 2012 #79

They are disrupters. JDPriestly Feb 2012 #129

Do you associate yourself with their behavior, or do you believe they were there to disrupt OWS? MADem Feb 2012 #137

I think that at least one of them was there to disrupt OWS. JDPriestly Feb 2012 #233

I think your assessment is probably quite accurate. nt MADem Feb 2012 #234

The guy holding the flag was an Occupier as said by one of the lead Oakland Occupiers. joshcryer Feb 2012 #176

LOL! joshcryer Feb 2012 #175

Suffragettes went around with hammers breaking rich peoples' windows. Strikers blocked traffic. Tierra_y_Libertad Feb 2012 #56

Correction: it's supposed to piss THE RIGHT people off. Bicoastal Feb 2012 #60

Not necessarily. Read this brilliant post: EFerrari Feb 2012 #77

Did they break poor peoples' windows? How about the windows of other suffragettes? MADem Feb 2012 #83

No, and the window breaking was part of an overall strategy. nobodyspecial Feb 2012 #97

You're absolutely right about that. MADem Feb 2012 #115

JHC, breaking ANYTHING with a hammer isn't civil disobedience. renie408 Feb 2012 #158

Burning a flag has nothing to do with what OWS focuses on, but JDPriestly Feb 2012 #235

The media reaction to those protests was negative too. Starry Messenger Feb 2012 #63

"The flag-burning is just being used as a red herring." redqueen Feb 2012 #65

DHS? a simple pattern Feb 2012 #143

Are you somehow under the misconception that the OWSer was fighting for the right to burn the flag?. SidDithers Feb 2012 #72

Oy. Holy false analogies! Bruce Wayne Feb 2012 #81

So how do you feel about all the flag burning that took place during the Civil Rights era sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #114

It didn't happen that much. Mostly people carried flags at marches or wore them on pants. Bruce Wayne Feb 2012 #141

I'd love to see some pictures of all these black people burning flags. MADem Feb 2012 #162

Major Fail treestar Feb 2012 #93

What courage does it take to burn a flag? I mean, whoopee-doo, how TwilightGardener Feb 2012 #105

even the 'legal' aspect is in question in this case, since the flag didn't belong to the burner n/t Bodhi BloodWave Feb 2012 #227

This message was self-deleted by its author Cali_Democrat Feb 2012 #106

Atticus Finch said... ananda Feb 2012 #112

So true, and most movements and revolutions that changed the world, were not supported sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #121

I love a good red herring. HuckleB Feb 2012 #123

How is it a red herring? During the Civil Rights era and the Anti Vietnam era, many people sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #134

THe difference is civil disobedience can be useful while burning the flag never is BrentWil Feb 2012 #133

Really, did flag burning end the Civil Rights movement? Or the anti-Vietnam War movement? sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #135

Sitting at the counter stated "We're people too" Kellerfeller Feb 2012 #144

How Is Trying To End Jim Crow Analogous To Burning A National Symbol Many Find Sacred? DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2012 #145

It's Amazing That The Most Flawed Analogy In The History Of D.U. Got Fifty Seven Recommends DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2012 #146

Thank you. This comparison is absurd. Comparing passive, civil disobedience.. renie408 Feb 2012 #148

I Don't Think Flag Burning Is Tantamount To Vandalism DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2012 #150

Knocking over a 100 year old scale model of city hall is. n/t renie408 Feb 2012 #151

And actually, if you stole the flag you are burning, it is PRECISELY vandalism. renie408 Feb 2012 #152

It would not be vandalism if it were their flag. However, they stole it. MADem Feb 2012 #171

Maybe because it is not flawed. Or are you saying that this event when it happened did not sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #169

How was Trying To Break Jim Crow DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2012 #188

I find it ironic that the people in the pictures are doing what Occupy Oakland was SUPPOSED renie408 Feb 2012 #149

I Don't See How It Got So Many Recommends DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2012 #153

It got so many recs because of the Pavlovian response to a picture of Rosa Parks. renie408 Feb 2012 #157

LOL! redqueen Feb 2012 #160

Why do you find it ironic? Are you saying that all Occupiers around the country and the sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #174

The poutrage at flag burning ... GeorgeGist Feb 2012 #155

No Poutrage But It Has All The Efficacy Of Mooning Somebody DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2012 #156

The poutrage seems to be coming from the one percent within the 99 percent MADem Feb 2012 #173

Got any polls on that? The only people, other than the small number on DU who are 'outraged' sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #178

I've got a link....keep saying this is "No big deal." It's got--like it or not--legs, and it will MADem Feb 2012 #180

Lol, that's what was said about the other flag burnings. No one even remembers them at this point. sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #181

Keep missing the point. Deliberate obtuseness isn't charming, it's sad. MADem Feb 2012 #183

Being right about justice HAS NEVER BEEN POPULAR!!! Ecumenist Feb 2012 #163

Could You Show Me The Nexus DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2012 #187

Could you show us the nexus between the huge Global movment of Occupiers and the sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #190

So If I Go To My Park And Burn A Flag I'm As Brave As Cheney, Schwerner, And Goodman? DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2012 #191

Well that has nothing to do with the question I asked. sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #192

Right On!!! fascisthunter Feb 2012 #193

The f*cking flag does not represent me. L0oniX Feb 2012 #197

I love you! lunatica Feb 2012 #198

Breaking the very laws that you are protesting as unjust ... frazzled Feb 2012 #210

And here's where you lose me... renie408 Feb 2012 #231

They should go home and get a job. The party will take of things. mmonk Feb 2012 #211

I know Right? fascisthunter Feb 2012 #214

Right. mmonk Feb 2012 #226

heh! KG Feb 2012 #230

When a symbol of freedom is held more sacred than freedom itself HillWilliam Feb 2012 #228

If They Really Wanted To Piss Off The One Percenter They Should Have Burned Money DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2012 #229

Never had much popularity anyway... 99Forever Feb 2012 #232