Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Yo_Mama

(8,303 posts)
75. There is a public safety exception rom Miranda penalties under certain circs
Sat Apr 20, 2013, 01:31 AM
Apr 2013

That's included with Miranda rights.

This is a very obvious case in which public safety is of concern.

There are public safety exemptions or exceptions to most of the Bill of Rights. So, police can't come into your house without a warrant, but if a policeman hears gunshots and screams, the police officer is allowed to break in - in the cause of protecting life.

This is not a strained interpretation of the public safety provision, so no one's rights are being injured here and it sets no bad or new precedent.
http://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/publications/law-enforcement-bulletin/february2011/legal_digest

Whenever the prosecution seeks in its direct case to introduce a statement made by a suspect while in custody and in response to interrogation, it must prove that the subject was warned of specific rights and voluntarily waived those rights.4


Now the penalty for not following Miranda procedures is that statements gained from the non-Mirandized statements cannot be introduced in court, and evidence developed from those statements will be thrown out. The public safety exception just means that evidence gained from such questions can be introduced in court.

That's really the only "teeth" that Miranda has, but those are big teeth.

However in this case there is tremendous evidence accumulated before arrest combined with the physical facts of the arrest and the prosecution does not need to rely on any of these statements to do anything except possibly protect the public, so the authorities would have to be crazy to immediately read the guy his Miranda rights. No, instead they are going to ask questions about other bombs and materials out there. Stuff like that.

There's a reason why the public safety exception exists, it exists to protect other people's rights, and they are not doing anything odd or illegal here. They took him to the hospital for medical treatment, so questioning will be limited anyway.

Even if a judge later found that their questioning crossed the acceptable line, all it would mean wouldevi be that his answers to those questions, or any evidence found on the basis of those questions, would not be admissible. It would not contaminate all the other evidence.

If you stop and think about what law enforcement priorities are supposed to be, failure to allow the public safety exception would force cops to ask those questions any way. At all stages of any investigation or arrest, public safety is supposed to be preeminent. It isn't always, but it is supposed to be. The courts are not going to create a situation that forces cops and prosecutors to abandon prosecutions in order to protect the lives of others.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

No... Dorian Gray Apr 2013 #1
Yup. nt Poll_Blind Apr 2013 #3
No... randome Apr 2013 #5
If they don't mirandize him, they can't use anything he says to prosecute him Dorian Gray Apr 2013 #11
Exactly. Some think using the exemption is equivalent to waterboarding or something. randome Apr 2013 #18
Do you wonder why people have that perception of law enforcement so often? Fumesucker Apr 2013 #61
Far more people have a good encounter with LE than suffer abuse. randome Apr 2013 #91
I've had both very good and absolutely horrible experiences with LE myself Fumesucker Apr 2013 #93
+1 freshwest Apr 2013 #44
I don't see the point of not giving them BainsBane Apr 2013 #2
It jeopardizes the prosecution...IN AN EPISODE OF MATLOCK. In this case, in THIS case... Poll_Blind Apr 2013 #7
There is a SCOTUS-approved 48 hour exemption for public safety reasons. randome Apr 2013 #10
okay, so the exemption means they can question him BainsBane Apr 2013 #20
Apparently they cannot use anything he says against him during this period. randome Apr 2013 #22
That's what I figured BainsBane Apr 2013 #27
Cite it. You think it exists so you should be able to settle this quickly. cthulu2016 Apr 2013 #32
You already saw the Quarles link but here it is again. randome Apr 2013 #45
You win! dems_rightnow Apr 2013 #87
Explain how? Yo_Mama Apr 2013 #71
I could. It's about preserving rights- and not just his. cali Apr 2013 #4
IMO, there are scores of victims in the hospital right now who are more deserving. Poll_Blind Apr 2013 #13
I find it disgusting that you are using that kids photo in such a manner. Gravitycollapse Apr 2013 #17
Dead Eight Year Old > His Murderer. Deal with it. nt Poll_Blind Apr 2013 #31
That suspect has rights and priveleges afforded to him. One of them is innocence... Gravitycollapse Apr 2013 #34
You didn't read my OP: The guy may not even be conscious yet. nt Poll_Blind Apr 2013 #37
Your OP has nothing to do with your gross exploitation of that childs photo. Gravitycollapse Apr 2013 #41
Still didn't bother to read my OP. It's not arguing for his deprivation of rights, it's... Poll_Blind Apr 2013 #46
Again, not talking about your OP. I'm talking about your disgusting use of that child's photo. Gravitycollapse Apr 2013 #50
Eat it. On ignore forever. If you knew how short that list was, you'd feel special. nt Poll_Blind Apr 2013 #53
Like I give a single shit. Have a great life. Gravitycollapse Apr 2013 #59
there certainly are, but cali Apr 2013 #23
Well said. nt Mojorabbit Apr 2013 #38
A lot of people cannot comprehend what you just said... Gravitycollapse Apr 2013 #39
prosecution and rights are about us as a people BainsBane Apr 2013 #24
I have no compassion for him. His soul is lost. But we obey the laws for all our sakes. Honeycombe8 Apr 2013 #19
Very well stated, Honeycombe8 suffragette Apr 2013 #95
I agree, Cali. Blue_In_AK Apr 2013 #21
No one here knows him. He may be every bit a monster as the acts he perpetrated. randome Apr 2013 #26
Perhaps, Blue_In_AK Apr 2013 #63
There is a public safety exception rom Miranda penalties under certain circs Yo_Mama Apr 2013 #75
Same people who complain about torture MaineLinePhilly Apr 2013 #6
what a horridly ironic post. HiPointDem Apr 2013 #12
I know right! nt Mojorabbit Apr 2013 #40
"At least there is symmetry". - Zathrus n/t Egalitarian Thug Apr 2013 #73
His rights will be read Shivering Jemmy Apr 2013 #15
I have no doubt that they will. nt Poll_Blind Apr 2013 #35
whatever is done to allow me to continue having freedoms RedCappedBandit Apr 2013 #49
Wow. Apophis Apr 2013 #57
FR's hamster died again. freshwest Apr 2013 #74
sorry but that is just sick Skittles Apr 2013 #58
Snort Solly Mack Apr 2013 #92
And I bet they even didn't run to give blood to help save their victims. Amonester Apr 2013 #8
Well, that speaks volumes about poll_blind cthulu2016 Apr 2013 #9
Exactly ~ add Zorra to the rolls of those could give less of a shit. nt Zorra Apr 2013 #14
I give a shit this "exception" appears to be broad policy. DirkGently Apr 2013 #16
I am not talking about broad policy, I am talking about the unusual FIXATION as to... Poll_Blind Apr 2013 #28
It matters when we modify civil protections over terrorism. DirkGently Apr 2013 #42
Fuck the 5th Amendment! 'Murika! Fire Walk With Me Apr 2013 #25
Didn't read my message. nt Poll_Blind Apr 2013 #29
I do. Arctic Dave Apr 2013 #30
Did you read my op? This guy may not even be conscious yet. That's the point. nt Poll_Blind Apr 2013 #33
If a person is unable to respond then the question is moot. Arctic Dave Apr 2013 #36
We do NOT disagree. My point was there have been a flurry of articles... Poll_Blind Apr 2013 #43
I think you called it by "clock watching". Arctic Dave Apr 2013 #52
Clock watching- while not taking into account they guy is probably unconcious. Poll_Blind Apr 2013 #62
I would assume there is a pre-determined point. Arctic Dave Apr 2013 #66
Do let me know when it's all about Poll_Blind, would you? flvegan Apr 2013 #47
All that matters for me is the law. GitRDun Apr 2013 #48
I'm saying the guy is probably not even CONSCIOUS to respond to whether they've been read at all. nt Poll_Blind Apr 2013 #51
I think 48 hours starts when he is able to answer questions. nt GitRDun Apr 2013 #60
+1 Zorra Apr 2013 #65
Yes, that is the same point I've been making davidpdx Apr 2013 #80
all of his rights should be respected markiv Apr 2013 #54
Didn't read my OP. Of course they should be respected, and they will be. nt Poll_Blind Apr 2013 #56
It's astounding how naive the average American is with regard to the justice system. Zorra Apr 2013 #55
I have to agree. As you and I think at least one other person pointed out, people... Poll_Blind Apr 2013 #64
Yes, and besides, this is the crown jewels for both the DA .and the FBI Zorra Apr 2013 #69
Cute that you think it hilarious, but can you answer this? cthulu2016 Apr 2013 #67
Only helps if he's conscious to acknowledge. nt Poll_Blind Apr 2013 #68
In this case, they don't want to. The public safety exception makes it so they are not required to. Zorra Apr 2013 #70
Rights apply to all or they apply to none. That is why I give a flying fuck. Luminous Animal Apr 2013 #72
+1 LAGC Apr 2013 #76
And this applies to all: they have 48 hours with no Miranda to figure out if there are others Recursion Apr 2013 #78
I find this OP hurtful, over-the-top and otherwise inappropriate, snot Apr 2013 #77
I think if you get past the harshness of his post & read through the entire thing it does make sense davidpdx Apr 2013 #81
Thank you for your courteous reply. snot Apr 2013 #82
The OP assumes his guilt, but can't definitely prove it. That's a flaw in his argument davidpdx Apr 2013 #83
Agreed. snot Apr 2013 #88
One thing I don't think many people are considering is how badly he may have been hurt davidpdx Apr 2013 #79
The danger is the precedent. Donald Ian Rankin Apr 2013 #84
When they arrested this guy, from what I read, he was basically half dead. Poll_Blind Apr 2013 #85
And provided it doesn't result in people who aren't half dead getting their rights late that's fine. Donald Ian Rankin Apr 2013 #86
"This particular guy" is an American citizen Cal Carpenter Apr 2013 #89
Not on the grounds you give treestar Apr 2013 #90
Law is not about this or any "particular guy", whenever it does it is eroded. TheKentuckian Apr 2013 #94
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Poll_Blind could give les...»Reply #75