Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Benton D Struckcheon

(2,347 posts)
6. Yeah, it's probably self-reinforcing,
Sun Apr 28, 2013, 02:55 AM
Apr 2013

where the drop in the population of males that age partially explains it, better policing partially explains it, fewer "mentors" now partially explains it, and the latter two have a persistent effect even when the population of males the right age rises again, because the police still have things under control due to having learned a few things over the past 20 years.
But everyone is actually well aware our crime rate has collapsed. This is especially true in NYC, where pre and post Giuliani NYC is like night and day. Better policing, which actually started under his predecessor, Dinkins, was aggressively rolled out to the entire city after conspicuous success on 42nd Street, and the city has been a lot safer since. A large part of the stats you cite is directly due to NYC having become so safe over the past two decades.
It's not a good argument against gun control though. NYC as I have noted is where things have really improved tremendously, and NYC has very strict gun laws. NJ is reasonably strict as well; we have universal background checks here (I know because I once did a friend a favor by signing off on his competence to own a gun; you need two people as I recall to testify to your being sane on the form). So is NY state, so NYC benefits from its immediate surroundings being decent on gun control, which makes its own laws more effective.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

a criminologist told me BainsBane Apr 2013 #1
That's the basis of the Freakonomics argument Recursion Apr 2013 #2
irrespective of the argument about abortion rights BainsBane Apr 2013 #4
Yeah, it's probably self-reinforcing, Benton D Struckcheon Apr 2013 #6
It's orthogonal to the right's and left's hobby horses Recursion Apr 2013 #8
Not familiar with DC's gun laws, Benton D Struckcheon Apr 2013 #10
DC had a total gun ban. But it was easier to buy a gun in DC than VA. Recursion Apr 2013 #11
And yet criminologists studying the DC gun ban concluded that it saved 47 lives per year. DanTex Apr 2013 #16
That study is from 1991, before the 90s crime spike Recursion Apr 2013 #18
Exactly. It measured the effect of the gun ban itself, before it was dwarfed by national trends. DanTex Apr 2013 #19
Given that it is now 2013 enlightenment Apr 2013 #29
The guys that put together Freakenomics... WCGreen Apr 2013 #3
The Freakonomics guys were ambivalent about lead Recursion Apr 2013 #5
the correlation is POPULATION. Plain and simple. BlancheSplanchnik Apr 2013 #7
Umm... but the population has been increasing Recursion Apr 2013 #9
Hrrrmmmmm.....maybe I was reading the graphs wrong...... BlancheSplanchnik Apr 2013 #25
It's still growth kudzu22 Apr 2013 #35
The biggest difference between then and now is the reporting. Archae Apr 2013 #12
We have great media diversity -- using the same script. Eleanors38 Apr 2013 #34
For something that's "completely ignored", a lot sure gets written about it muriel_volestrangler Apr 2013 #13
Name a politician who has suggested environmental or social solutions to crime Recursion Apr 2013 #14
President Obama: muriel_volestrangler Apr 2013 #15
So it looks like we've made no progress since 1976 on gun violence. DanTex Apr 2013 #17
Like 10,000 gun homicides a year isn't a problem. baldguy Apr 2013 #20
That nonsense again Recursion Apr 2013 #21
Ha.. I LOLed Pelican Apr 2013 #22
Because Brazil, Mexico, Russia, Indonesia etc are so similar to the US. baldguy Apr 2013 #24
Thanks for this post. nt redqueen Apr 2013 #26
Because Russia isn't a kleptocracy jeff47 Apr 2013 #30
Are you saying we aren't a kleptocracy and facing a massive drug war (of our own choosing)? Recursion Apr 2013 #32
Yes. jeff47 Apr 2013 #33
The other 460,000 gun crimes are no big deal, either! tabasco Apr 2013 #23
ban assault weapons and institute background checks for all gun purchases. spanone Apr 2013 #27
Automatic weapons are banned hack89 Apr 2013 #28
thanks, made correction... spanone Apr 2013 #31
The spikes correspond to Prohibition and the War on Drugs NickB79 Apr 2013 #36
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»The most important crimin...»Reply #6