Democrats are digging a political hole so deep we may never be able to get out of it?

[Savannahmann]

46. No, war is not good.

That was not the point of the history lesson I gave. It was using a historical example of how we must learn from our defeats. We must learn how we lost, why we lost, and what changes we need to make so that next time, we win.

As far as World War II, it and the suffering of the Jews, and the rest of Europe, was caused by the fools who won WW I. They wanted so much out of Germany, there was no way to get it without causing tremendous hardship, and the resulting negative feelings.

I'm not sure that the invasion of Normandy was daily battles lost. Once they were ashore, there was a lot of close in fighting, but by then victory was if not assured, then nearly given. Perhaps you meant the campaign in Italy, where we were stalemated for all intents and purposes for the rest of the war. Winning inches but never getting the breakthrough we wanted. Because once we were out of the hedgerow country of France, and into the open plains where maneuver was king again, the Allies were nearly unstoppable.

Perhaps you meant the battles for Guadalcanal. Which was jokingly called Operation shoestring. Where our troops held out through unimaginable hardship to win through determination. Even the navy suffered incredible losses. It was there that we were down to one operational carrier in the Pacific, and then no operational carriers in the pacific.

But is war good? Or Just? That is where we discuss the theories of Saint Augustine, and Saint Francis. Their writings are the foundation of that theoretical exercise. That is not germain to this discussion. What the discussion was about, was learning from our mistakes, and winning the debate and getting the people behind our ideals, starting with the Gun issue.

The historical example was an effort to get people looking at the issue from a new point of view, not to demonstrate the extent of my knowledge of the various military conflicts, and the political vision behind those events, in history.