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rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)

173. So we allow our government to gather massive data on each of us that they promise not

Sun Jun 9, 2013, 01:42 PM

Jun 2013

to use except if they need to. This is only as good as your trust of your government. It is a tool that can easily be misused against citizens that the government decides are threats. Like whistle-blowers, leakers and protestors.

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So all that hysteria yesterday [View all] pnwmom Jun 2013 OP

What do you mean? DisgustipatedinCA Jun 2013 #1

The WA post story has already been walked back pnwmom Jun 2013 #5

Oh, got it. But the massive domestic spying program is ongoing DisgustipatedinCA Jun 2013 #11

The WA Post and the Guardian reported the same thing -- both incorrectly. pnwmom Jun 2013 #20

Sorry, your facts are incorrect DisgustipatedinCA Jun 2013 #23

The Verizon story has also been falsely described. pnwmom Jun 2013 #25

The difference is no direct access, Feds still need judicial oversight. JaneyVee Jun 2013 #28

And that they have to get judicial approval just as they would in any crime case. pnwmom Jun 2013 #29

And here is the judicial approval. JDPriestly Jun 2013 #85

I read it. So what is your point? n/t pnwmom Jun 2013 #115

Judicial review that proves blanket authority to surveil isnt oversight. The idea of judicial rhett o rick Jun 2013 #149

that was the court order to store all the information. The info doesn't even include names. It's the okaawhatever Jun 2013 #171

So we allow our government to gather massive data on each of us that they promise not rhett o rick Jun 2013 #173

I'm okay with that. I would rather the gov't keep it than the phone companies. They have a better okaawhatever Jun 2013 #174

If the govment has it so do the phone companies. Corporations run the govment. nm rhett o rick Jun 2013 #182

Bush/Cheney were spot on then? Eddie Haskell Jun 2013 #157

The tech guys say there is a way to do this so that the Govt gets the info without going to the dkf Jun 2013 #42

But will unwarranted info stand in a court of law? Even the tech companies would sue the Fed JaneyVee Jun 2013 #50

You think the only purpose of information is to convict in a court of law? dkf Jun 2013 #53

What other non-tinfoil hat reason could there be? We know they're using it to convict people JaneyVee Jun 2013 #64

LOL Aerows Jun 2013 #143

They don't need to use it as evidence. They can do a lot JDPriestly Jun 2013 #87

Can you explain to me the damage that can be done? Possibly include links to instances? JaneyVee Jun 2013 #156

In the first place, just by retaining this information at the JDPriestly Jun 2013 #180

SCOTUS ruled on parts of this. There have also been court cases that went to Fed appeals court. nt okaawhatever Jun 2013 #175

How's about this...it would be nice if they would drop the secrets privilege and let the 2 cases dkf Jun 2013 #176

I think opening up secret cases is a slippery slope, but I do want scotus or the legislature to give okaawhatever Jun 2013 #177

Well now that they declassified maybe there are no secrets to protect. dkf Jun 2013 #179

Super. Which parts of it are untrue, and where's the documentation for that? DisgustipatedinCA Jun 2013 #33

The first reports about Verizon claimed that the government pnwmom Jun 2013 #40

This is an opinion piece DisgustipatedinCA Jun 2013 #45

That story was instantly blown up, distorted, and exaggerated pnwmom Jun 2013 #73

Read the court order: JDPriestly Jun 2013 #89

The court order: JDPriestly Jun 2013 #88

Yes. Here is a copy of the court order that set this off. JDPriestly Jun 2013 #84

That order is specific magellan Jun 2013 #103

The order speaks for itself. But I think it fair to draw JDPriestly Jun 2013 #106

Yep. And I know that order doesn't deal with the internet magellan Jun 2013 #109

Pretty good regardless of what the government says. JDPriestly Jun 2013 #112

I came a little late to the game magellan Jun 2013 #119

Implicated in what? Passing on telephone numbers? n/t pnwmom Jun 2013 #116

If you have ever done any paralegal or legal or investigative JDPriestly Jun 2013 #118

Corporations are collecting more information than this every day. pnwmom Jun 2013 #123

You mention the Boston bombing attacks. JDPriestly Jun 2013 #181

I have no doubt Aerows Jun 2013 #144

No, the FISA Court Order expressly said all data from all users. If that is representative, the leveymg Jun 2013 #158

Did Verison's political donations enter into their selection? Why spy on only 66% of phone conversa rhett o rick Jun 2013 #146

Interesting article here. rhett o rick Jun 2013 #153

Same orders have been served on all the major telcos. leveymg Jun 2013 #159

I must have missed that. Can you give me a link? I am not doubting just like to rhett o rick Jun 2013 #161

Here's The WSJ and NYT reports, 6/7: leveymg Jun 2013 #165

Thank you very much for the articles. nm rhett o rick Jun 2013 #167

UR Welcome eom leveymg Jun 2013 #169

Um, nope. woo me with science Jun 2013 #2

It's unreal isn't it? Puzzledtraveller Jun 2013 #8

"It can't happen here" villager Jun 2013 #17

We don't worship Obama. We just aren't stupid enough to fall for the ratfucking hyped-up "scandals" KittyWampus Jun 2013 #34

Though you fall for every single "official" explanation of unacceptable policy... villager Jun 2013 #55

Though you fall for every single "Conspiracy Theory" from our notorious right wing corporate sheshe2 Jun 2013 #92

Post removed Post removed Jun 2013 #125

Greenwald works for the Kochs, not Obama. ucrdem Jun 2013 #133

Read the court order: JDPriestly Jun 2013 #91

If you dont ever question his decisions and adamantly defend them to a fault, you can see rhett o rick Jun 2013 #162

It is pure double think. morningfog Jun 2013 #35

in a way I envy them Skittles Jun 2013 #59

It's kind of a red pill/blue pill kind of thing, isn't it? AllyCat Jun 2013 #83

It is amazing and it is the same group of people. nt Mojorabbit Jun 2013 #75

Here is the court order: JDPriestly Jun 2013 #94

I totally agree Mojorabbit Jun 2013 #97

This message was self-deleted by its author BenzoDia Jun 2013 #3

Depends on who you ask. JaneyVee Jun 2013 #4

I think this is just getting started actually quinnox Jun 2013 #6

What's just getting started is the drip, drip, drip of bullshit BeyondGeography Jun 2013 #16

Here is the court order: JDPriestly Jun 2013 #96

Here is the court order. It's pretty awful. Broad as broad JDPriestly Jun 2013 #95

And what will we do with that awareness? Generic Brad Jun 2013 #168

Yep Andy823 Jun 2013 #7

This message was self-deleted by its author freshwest Jun 2013 #76

Here is the court order that backs up what you call "BS." JDPriestly Jun 2013 #98

Yeah, I understand they're opening an investigation of the leak Fumesucker Jun 2013 #9

U bring up a good point. This was leaked in 2006, wouldn't surprise me if its still the same person. JaneyVee Jun 2013 #12

You seem to be confused - jazzimov Jun 2013 #18

I was repeating stuff I've read on DU Fumesucker Jun 2013 #27

This court order does not expire until July 19, 2013. JDPriestly Jun 2013 #100

You're kidding, right? Because no one thinks that. DirkGently Jun 2013 #10

Actually it's gaining steam on social media: JaneyVee Jun 2013 #13

Thanks for the additional link. n/t pnwmom Jun 2013 #14

Yes, apologists are spinning furiously. DirkGently Jun 2013 #19

The WA Post has already walked back its own story. pnwmom Jun 2013 #21

OMG! Rove! Poor Obama. morningfog Jun 2013 #39

I don't know if I'd call it spin, they seem to be bringing more facts than hyperbole with them. JaneyVee Jun 2013 #24

Is the President still spying on Americans? DisgustipatedinCA Jun 2013 #54

I agree, the article agrees to. It's just referring to the hair on fire stuff. JaneyVee Jun 2013 #66

I may already have responded to you with this. JDPriestly Jun 2013 #102

It's cool DisgustipatedinCA Jun 2013 #107

Thanks. JDPriestly Jun 2013 #108

The problem here is that pesky word "spying". THe govment isnt "spying" they are just collecting rhett o rick Jun 2013 #163

Here is the court order signed by the court in April 2014 JDPriestly Jun 2013 #101

Nothing routine or demonstrably legal about it. DirkGently Jun 2013 #148

If it's on social media, IT MUST BE TRUE! OnyxCollie Jun 2013 #22

The link cites sources, not hyperbole. JaneyVee Jun 2013 #26

I wonder whether we have a couple on DU. JDPriestly Jun 2013 #105

Awesome article! jazzimov Jun 2013 #30

^^^^^THIS!^^^^^^ sheshe2 Jun 2013 #41

Ya beat me by a Cha Jun 2013 #46

LOL' two to be exact~ sheshe2 Jun 2013 #61

No, I was talking about my Cha Jun 2013 #68

It's so true, jazz.. Cha Jun 2013 #43

Especially this: JaneyVee Jun 2013 #52

Yeah, that's bullseye, Janey! Cha Jun 2013 #58

Greenwald routinely refers to supporters of the president as "cultists". I hate to tell you how I.. Tarheel_Dem Jun 2013 #136

Greenwald Has An Agenda otohara Jun 2013 #154

Doesnt that apply to all that dare challenge the president? How do you know what his "agenda" is?nm rhett o rick Jun 2013 #160

Oh, I Don't Know, Maybe Because He's otohara Jun 2013 #164

I believe that Hillary Clinton said much the same about trusting Bush. nm rhett o rick Jun 2013 #170

Really? jazzimov Jun 2013 #15

Seems like chicken little is off duty tonight Life Long Dem Jun 2013 #31

LOL. Yeah, I guess that's why I had pnwmom Jun 2013 #32

Don't worry, they'll dig something up. They can always go back to the motherload: freshwest Jun 2013 #114

LOL ucrdem Jun 2013 #121

I was consistently on record in maintaining that this was nothing. NYC_SKP Jun 2013 #36

I heard ya! Cha Jun 2013 #38

Me too madokie Jun 2013 #134

"Misread"!? Say it ain't so! Cha Jun 2013 #37

It's over? Puzzledtraveller Jun 2013 #44

jazzimov, sheshe2 Jun 2013 #48

Do you mean Cha Jun 2013 #62

Nothing has changed. The spying continues. GoneFishin Jun 2013 #47

Under court supervision, with congressional oversight bhikkhu Jun 2013 #86

Dear lord~ K and effing Rec! sheshe2 Jun 2013 #49

How do you explain this? LittleBlue Jun 2013 #51

The Republicans are framing Obama for the crimes committed under Bush!!! Initech Jun 2013 #56

This real scandal is not going away until our gov abandons it's Stasi policies. usGovOwesUs3Trillion Jun 2013 #57

Right on brother! OilemFirchen Jun 2013 #70

That's why I noted got a Constitutional professor. tblue Jun 2013 #72

Yep, you broke the code . . . OldRedneck Jun 2013 #60

Yeah, that's why the NSA want a criminal probe into the leaks MotherPetrie Jun 2013 #63

I No Longer Trust The US Government And The Politicians That Run It cantbeserious Jun 2013 #65

Uh-huh. a2liberal Jun 2013 #67

The media went into hysterics over an overblown, inaccurate story pnwmom Jun 2013 #74

If it wasn't true a2liberal Jun 2013 #135

The government isn't going into hysterics. They're responding appropriately pnwmom Jun 2013 #137

So... a2liberal Jun 2013 #138

Is This Post RobinA Jun 2013 #69

I'm sure it's satire. Some people here have no sense for irony Douglas Carpenter Jun 2013 #151

DU rec... SidDithers Jun 2013 #71

Damage Control Unit 3, do you copy? nt Zorra Jun 2013 #77

It's like Ghandi said: Marr Jun 2013 #78

It's like stumbling into the hotel hosting Denial-Con 2013 in here kenny blankenship Jun 2013 #93

It's the "FOX-i-fication" of the news, and Greenwald is perfect for it. Is there any wonder.... Tarheel_Dem Jun 2013 #79

As Bill Maher said, Reagan began the process of just 'making shit up.' The media has that script... freshwest Jun 2013 #122

You're right. Sadly, the telecommunications act allowed for the fusion of news & entertainment. Tarheel_Dem Jun 2013 #130

The Washington Post decided to rile up the Crazies alcibiades_mystery Jun 2013 #80

exactly! kooks and cranks like Al Gore have been exposed as the crazies that they are Douglas Carpenter Jun 2013 #99

Has Gore commented on PRISM? alcibiades_mystery Jun 2013 #147

Al Gore calls Obama administration�s collection of phone records �obscenely outrageous� Douglas Carpenter Jun 2013 #150

And the band plays on.... LovingA2andMI Jun 2013 #81

Here. Read the court order for yourself. JDPriestly Jun 2013 #82

I agree with you. OnyxCollie Jun 2013 #120

That court order is only to store the info. Not access individual numbers. In other countries the okaawhatever Jun 2013 #172

No. I am not OK with that. JDPriestly Jun 2013 #178

If the Food Stamp/Farm Bill is to be Voted on this Monday... Lady Freedom Returns Jun 2013 #90

Too many scandals bunched together should raise a red flag. pacalo Jun 2013 #104

No, most of the "hysteria" was over the Verizon thing. JoeyT Jun 2013 #110

You do realize they have government owned equipment duplicating 50+ companies data? dkf Jun 2013 #111

I think Obama's in a catch-22. pnwmom Jun 2013 #113

That's even worse, that they have all this access and still can't prevent things... dkf Jun 2013 #117

It's because, well, they don't really know what to do, but... Amonester Jun 2013 #124

If they actually seemed competent with the info maybe I would consider it. dkf Jun 2013 #126

Hey, nobody's perfect. Amonester Jun 2013 #127

Honestly that was almost comedic though. dkf Jun 2013 #128

Get ready because, one thing is for sure... Amonester Jun 2013 #131

No, it's not worse. The system mostly "looks back" after a crime has occurred pnwmom Jun 2013 #129

The problem is there is too much data, not enough focus. dkf Jun 2013 #132

What specific rights have you given up BeyondGeography Jun 2013 #139

How would it harm you if everyday a stranger walked a circle around your house snapping GoneFishin Jun 2013 #141

Arne Svenson, is that you? BeyondGeography Jun 2013 #142

Then I understand now why you are perplexed by the outrage. GoneFishin Jun 2013 #145

Yeah, people are over-reacting to this for sure. DCBob Jun 2013 #140

Give away your rights as you wish. 99Forever Jun 2013 #152

why do Obama and others keep threatening to send the leaker to jail burnodo Jun 2013 #155

Yup. another day another smear another Darrell Isaa yawner. Yet they persist. graham4anything Jun 2013 #166

Another Day - More Confirmation That The Scandals Are Real cantbeserious Jun 2013 #183

First of all, knock off the "hysteria" crap. Secondly, if it's much ado about nothing, you think the WinkyDink Jun 2013 #184