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MADem

(135,425 posts)

11. I think the confusion comes from the fact that he was working at NSA. For years.

Tue Jun 11, 2013, 06:25 AM

Jun 2013

In several jobs.

I mean, come on--he wasn't unclear on the concept. They aren't making pizza at NSA. They're intercepting electronic data. It's their damn job. It has always been their damn job. Why, then, is he now surprised, shocked, and disappointed?

They're going to do it every which way they can, legally, and if this guy was really all that smart, he would have taken concerns he had about the legality of collection methods up to oversight agencies first, rather than publicly shit out sources and methods in excruciating detail.

Five years from now, he'll have his crisis under control, and I'll wager, if he can, he'll kick himself in the ass. I don't think he's got a handle on himself. His actions are not "brave," they're bizarre. There were better ways of fixing any issues he thought he may have had.

I know who's loving that guy, though--the new Premier of China.

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Maybe it's because I've held a Top Secret security clearance once... [View all] MrScorpio Jun 2013 OP

Just my first thoughts Sherman A1 Jun 2013 #1

Very good essay. Some more info to add to the pile: MADem Jun 2013 #2

Top secret clearance here madokie Jun 2013 #8

I hear ya! nt MADem Jun 2013 #9

Yep, those outbriefings were always effective on me ..... oldhippie Jun 2013 #81

Ha ha ha!!! I wouldn't be surprised...! MADem Jun 2013 #96

... Voice for Peace Jun 2013 #120

I suspected that. I posted it here somewhere. At first I thought he just got the job to out all this okaawhatever Jun 2013 #109

The boxes in the garage may have been an odd habit of the girlfriend. MADem Jun 2013 #117

Nothing in that post changes the fact that the government is JDPriestly Jun 2013 #135

Your claim is not proven. And if you think the government is "spying on ALL its citizens" I have a MADem Jun 2013 #162

The whole story seemed slick, managed. Thanks for showing why it had that apperance. freshwest Jun 2013 #172

The making of a Crystal Ball. napoleon_in_rags Jun 2013 #3

I think the confusion comes from the fact that he was working at NSA. For years. MADem Jun 2013 #11

In five years we would not know there is a crisis without people like him. He risks GoneFishin Jun 2013 #87

Nonsense. He didn't even TRY. And the son of his political hero is sitting in the Senate on the MADem Jun 2013 #90

You don't get to try one road, then use the other if it doesn't work out. GoneFishin Jun 2013 #95

He had a clear path to the Senate Intel Committee. MADem Jun 2013 #97

I can't dismiss the possibility, because Rand is squirrely. I truly don't know. GoneFishin Jun 2013 #98

I have some experience with Hill staffers and principals. MADem Jun 2013 #100

How much do we know about Snowden's military injury? Eddie Haskell Jun 2013 #103

Obviously he was treated in a MMF--military medical facility. MADem Jun 2013 #105

Just thinking ... maybe he did complete his training. Eddie Haskell Jun 2013 #107

Army has said no. MADem Jun 2013 #118

the mos for that program is 18X. Apparently they call the recruits X Rays. Here's the training okaawhatever Jun 2013 #112

He was in and out in four--some say five--months. MADem Jun 2013 #121

But, had Snowden taken the route you suggest, the Rand JDPriestly Jun 2013 #138

His testimony would not have been public. MADem Jun 2013 #146

Regardless. I am grateful that he came forward. JDPriestly Jun 2013 #148

I think that's still up for debate. There's a lot we don't know, still. nt MADem Jun 2013 #149

If the program is not as awful as our worst suspicions, then the JDPriestly Jun 2013 #152

Let's send the plans of our latest military aircraft to the Chinese, too, shall we? MADem Jun 2013 #157

Many people on DU do not understand the legal concept of chilling JDPriestly Jun 2013 #158

I've had a telephone party line, and I've lived in countries where it was assumed that the MADem Jun 2013 #160

If we weren't all freaking out about this NSA thing ... brett_jv Jun 2013 #159

The globe is marching towards biometric identifiers. MADem Jun 2013 #161

And there are at least 279 people in DC that would love something to hang on the administration Trekologer Jun 2013 #173

Yes, you do get to try additional roads jeff47 Jun 2013 #106

That was then. JDPriestly Jun 2013 #142

No, someone very intelligent would realize that was not the case. jeff47 Jun 2013 #165

But with this system, there are no anonymous phone numbers if JDPriestly Jun 2013 #167

No. Again, life is not an action movie. jeff47 Jun 2013 #169

It isn't so simple. JDPriestly Jun 2013 #170

Once again, life is not an action movie. jeff47 Jun 2013 #171

thank you! very thoughtful point of view Voice for Peace Jun 2013 #125

Thank you, I believe you're right. napoleon_in_rags Jun 2013 #126

you are right, it's what makes the most sense. if people stop and use their brains and common sense. Voice for Peace Jun 2013 #131

Thanks for sharing this. napoleon_in_rags Jun 2013 #132

Thank you. JDPriestly Jun 2013 #143

K & R. Love your longer posts. freshwest Jun 2013 #4

I don't agree with everything you write in your op but this is spot on: cali Jun 2013 #5

A related post that I have just put up intaglio Jun 2013 #6

"This shit happens when people don't pay attention to it." Amonester Jun 2013 #7

Great post, Scorpio, thanks. Scuba Jun 2013 #10

Glenn Greenwald lost all credibility with me when he called atheists racists in his defense of Islam GreenEyedLefty Jun 2013 #12

Got a link for that Greenwald quote? nt. druidity33 Jun 2013 #72

This is a excellent overview of that incident. snagglepuss Jun 2013 #78

what a bullshit smear by association bobduca Jun 2013 #122

Obviously you didn`t read anything at the link I provided. snagglepuss Jun 2013 #166

I thought he screwed it when he took money as a CATO Institute consultant and "white paper" writer. MADem Jun 2013 #91

As a former military officer, fasttense Jun 2013 #13

I don't remember much about my debriefing...that was ~39 years ago. HereSince1628 Jun 2013 #26

In my Munificence Jun 2013 #48

Same here. MineralMan Jun 2013 #54

Funny you mentioned Linguist Munificence Jun 2013 #64

How about neither... MrScorpio Jun 2013 #66

I had my final read off and debrief in 2010 ..... oldhippie Jun 2013 #85

Bingo SlimJimmy Jun 2013 #99

You remember incorrectly. Clearances held are a common feature of most defense/state MADem Jun 2013 #124

You hit it right on all points, I think. Thanks for the perspective. randome Jun 2013 #14

years ago my dh had a top security clearance too Duppers Jun 2013 #15

This message was self-deleted by its author BenzoDia Jun 2013 #16

We were a family of clearances TexasProgresive Jun 2013 #17

... Duppers Jun 2013 #19

If this is true, JDPriestly Jun 2013 #147

I have been saying it but no one seems to be listening. 4bucksagallon Jun 2013 #18

Have To Agree To Disagree - The Surveillance State Is Out Of Control - No More Excuses cantbeserious Jun 2013 #20

I agree with you A Little Weird Jun 2013 #25

Just because some ass tweets a pic of their ass doesn't mean everybody has to lose THEIR privacy n2doc Jun 2013 #21

The false equivalency crap going on here is rampant. The DU friends of Agent Mike group... L0oniX Jun 2013 #94

Yeah.. the apologists are arguing in favor bobduca Jun 2013 #113

Then comparing it to the One Ring and suggesting we toss it into Mt. Doom is out of the question? TalkingDog Jun 2013 #22

Thanks for that. timdog44 Jun 2013 #23

"Don't be fucking naive. " greytdemocrat Jun 2013 #24

There was timdog44 Jun 2013 #29

Rationalizing an authoritarian surveillance state is naive. JackRiddler Jun 2013 #123

That was a good read. n/t Whisp Jun 2013 #27

Thank you. K&R n/t OneGrassRoot Jun 2013 #28

I've read the same sentiment severl times. Savannahmann Jun 2013 #30

+1 Vinnie From Indy Jun 2013 #55

THANK YOU! Th1onein Jun 2013 #73

Very well stated! TM99 Jun 2013 #137

Tremendous: thoughtful and insightful alcibiades_mystery Jun 2013 #31

good post, it's so much easier for people to go off emotionally treestar Jun 2013 #32

This message was self-deleted by its author seaglass Jun 2013 #34

That's not all that over-emotional treestar Jun 2013 #36

This message was self-deleted by its author seaglass Jun 2013 #37

If that OP is like that treestar Jun 2013 #38

k&r HappyMe Jun 2013 #33

I'm curious how he got the job and security clearance in the first place auburngrad82 Jun 2013 #35

Good question. HappyMe Jun 2013 #40

Yeah, that was my first take on everything, too. HS dropout to SF dropout to security guard Nay Jun 2013 #42

How do we know he broke both legs? Eddie Haskell Jun 2013 #104

+1, from security guard to INFRASTRUCTURE sys admin?! uponit7771 Jun 2013 #45

Clearance investigations and re-investigations are seriously backlogged Zorro Jun 2013 #46

Backlog is going to be worst now... HipChick Jun 2013 #61

Your timeline is compressed jeff47 Jun 2013 #108

The salary is still very high for the position he is reported to have had Trekologer Jun 2013 #174

According to Salary.com jeff47 Jun 2013 #175

Thank you elfin Jun 2013 #39

Thanks for this Mr. Scorpio davidpdx Jun 2013 #41

Kasamnida, Adashi! nt MrScorpio Jun 2013 #65

As a security person Babel_17 Jun 2013 #43

Let me try to answer your questions as best I can. MrScorpio Jun 2013 #62

"Exercising one's right to protest doesn't represent a threat to them. " reusrename Jun 2013 #68

They're concerned with the people who want to blow us up. The people who are trying to break into okaawhatever Jun 2013 #115

Thanks for taking the time for the detailed reply (nt) Babel_17 Jun 2013 #70

They don't care? NOT YET. Th1onein Jun 2013 #74

No matter how "private" you think things are, there is a room full of analysts somewhere who can see cbdo2007 Jun 2013 #44

R#60 for, EXCELLENT o.p. & here are highlights: UTUSN Jun 2013 #47

Greenwald is in this for himself flamingdem Jun 2013 #49

thanks for the OP. I hadn't been alarmed previously, just pissed. Sheepshank Jun 2013 #50

Just remember -- the capitalists DO have the right to collect all that info for themselves. You Nay Jun 2013 #164

Finally. A voice of reason. BumRushDaShow Jun 2013 #51

Huh? Vinnie From Indy Jun 2013 #52

I'm in the same position you are. MineralMan Jun 2013 #53

The funny thing is that even after leaving all of that shit behind eight years ago... MrScorpio Jun 2013 #57

Once I left the USAF, I left that entire business behind. MineralMan Jun 2013 #60

Top Secret Clearance here also.. HipChick Jun 2013 #58

Agree with you on the Patriot Act marions ghost Jun 2013 #56

Also, just for shits and giggles Vinnie From Indy Jun 2013 #59

k+r Blue_Tires Jun 2013 #63

"Tweeting from their toilets millions of times a day . . ." --- That would be me. Major Hogwash Jun 2013 #67

interview tyler.thetakeaway Jun 2013 #69

No, I'm not doing any interviews MrScorpio Jun 2013 #71

Tyler, you picked a great person/post to approach. Glad you were able to wade through the chum Number23 Jun 2013 #76

HUGE K&R!! "the crying and drama queening about it is just getting way out of hand." Number23 Jun 2013 #75

Best comment about this whole clusterfuck that I've read yet . The Velveteen Ocelot Jun 2013 #77

Just because you drank the Kookaid and need to still justify it... kickysnana Jun 2013 #79

I'm not justifying it, I'm merely breaking the news to you that it exists MrScorpio Jun 2013 #86

Snowden's a patriot and you're a jerk. xtraxritical Jun 2013 #80

Jesus loves ya, baby nt MrScorpio Jun 2013 #83

DOD Secret here at Boeing. longship Jun 2013 #82

My only problem with your OP... RevStPatrick Jun 2013 #84

It you can't get a sip from a fire hose, squandering money to build a spy Niagara Falls is wasteful. AnotherMcIntosh Jun 2013 #88

Thank you for a fascinating read. thucythucy Jun 2013 #89

More false equivalency bullshit. L0oniX Jun 2013 #92

I agree that at some level this is nothing new.... Swede Atlanta Jun 2013 #93

The problem is that it's perfectly legal and shouldn't be. alarimer Jun 2013 #101

Hats off to Mr. Scorpio. Kick. Rec. Hekate Jun 2013 #102

my motto, too n/t grasswire Jun 2013 #111

I was in SIGINT, TS/SI clearance. I'm rolling my eyes at the misinformation. DevonRex Jun 2013 #110

You feel my pain, bro. MrScorpio Jun 2013 #114

Every bit of it. DevonRex Jun 2013 #116

Thanks for writing this OP. Very informative, very rational. Patriot Act Repeal, K&R. emulatorloo Jun 2013 #119

Ah, the cult of national security. backscatter712 Jun 2013 #127

Well said. bluedigger Jun 2013 #128

thank you arely staircase Jun 2013 #129

People who worked in this kind of program are anethisized JDPriestly Jun 2013 #130

'This may seem normal to the CREEPS that run these programs or work for them." DevonRex Jun 2013 #133

I did not say that to the poster. I said that in general. JDPriestly Jun 2013 #140

You seem to be under a misconception. DevonRex Jun 2013 #153

That's even worse. JDPriestly Jun 2013 #155

Seriously bad leap there. LOL. DevonRex Jun 2013 #156

You get no disagreements from me MrScorpio Jun 2013 #134

They got that way because people became afraid to speak up, JDPriestly Jun 2013 #139

Do you have any suggestions felix_numinous Jun 2013 #136

I'm not panicking. I'm just letting my representatives know that they currently do not liberal_at_heart Jun 2013 #141

thank you! great OP Voice for Peace Jun 2013 #144

Post removed Post removed Jun 2013 #145

Are you being facetious? MrScorpio Jun 2013 #150

Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2013 #151

Well, I guess that you weren't being facetious MrScorpio Jun 2013 #154

I don't completely agree with you.... blackspade Jun 2013 #163

There's an entire generation zeeland Jun 2013 #168

I'm an old Army spook. alfredo Jun 2013 #176