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sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)

13. Far more relevant to this story, a majority of people once thought Daniel Ellsberg was a traitor.

Tue Jun 11, 2013, 12:09 PM

Jun 2013

Your opinion is simply that, I know a lot more about who is running this government today, than I knew yesterday. And so do a whole lot of other people. I'm for transparency in government, we do not need secret governments.

I guess it all depends on how you view this country, and as Snowden himself said, the people should have the information, and if they decide that they want a secretive government that collects their personal information to be used 'later', then that would be their choice. But they should have the information to make that choice.

I sure do not want Clapper and his war profiteers even having my name. But they do and we did not know that.

I like Democracy. I like our Constitution. I never trusted Bush and his war profiteers, I thought we were getting rid of them. Now we know that nothing has changed regarding the influence they have over our government.

Why is Clapper a part of this administration? Can you explain that? Why is Ron Wyden eg, not Director of Intelligence?

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Do you agree with John Boehner that Edward Snowden is a traitor? [View all] Nye Bevan Jun 2013 OP

Don't agree with DiFi either truebluegreen Jun 2013 #1

I think being a traitor requires mens rea. I think Snowden thought he was doing the right thing. stevenleser Jun 2013 #2

Looks like so far, more people view him as a hero. Republicans like Clapper, a war profiteer doesn't sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #11

A majority of People once thought the world was flat, absent objective facts otherwise. stevenleser Jun 2013 #12

Far more relevant to this story, a majority of people once thought Daniel Ellsberg was a traitor. sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #13

The Fact is, FISA has repeatedy been found to be Constitutional. If you like the Constitution stevenleser Jun 2013 #15

Lots of laws have been found to be 'constitutional' our history is replete with them. Thankfully sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #22

This is not a law. This is the Constitution. If you are talking about FISA, do you understand the stevenleser Jun 2013 #31

Do you understand that the 4th Amendment forbids warrantless invasions of people's lives. sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #33

Do you understand that judges interpret what the Constitution means and they do not agree with you stevenleser Jun 2013 #35

Show me 'several decisions' that involved a ruling against probable cause (other than the exception sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #41

Sabrina, trying to pretend a completely different situation's legal rulings apply doesn't work. stevenleser Jun 2013 #47

I point you again to the 4th Amendment, that is all we need to know. Our representatives take an sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #54

ellsberg faced the music and didn't seek refuge in a totalitarian state, bragging on said arely staircase Jun 2013 #20

Agreed on all points. riqster Jun 2013 #30

Ellsberg completely disagrees with you. He sent a message to Snowden thanking him for his courage sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #34

that is why I sad - "regardless of what ellsberg says" arely staircase Jun 2013 #53

Snowden has stated clearly that he knew the consequences of his actions. What court would he have sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #57

but he is unwilling to face the consequences of his actions, unlike ellsberg arely staircase Jun 2013 #59

The only consequences he should face is a public, not secret, investigation into whether or not sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #61

The world is flat DisgustipatedinCA Jun 2013 #44

The fact that Booz Allen is owned by The Carlyle Group dgibby Jun 2013 #17

I think he is being used by traitors. tridim Jun 2013 #3

I think Bush and his 'security' Corps, are traitors. I am glad we have courageous people like this sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #8

Senators Feinstein and Nelson called it "treason." ProSense Jun 2013 #4

Some Dare Call it Treason Smarmie Doofus Jun 2013 #5

Well, all war profiteers will view those who expose them as 'traitors'. But to whom? sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #10

According to my understanding as of now... tarheelsunc Jun 2013 #6

Tssk.. ForeignandDomestic Jun 2013 #7

I would never, in a hundred lifetimes agree with that son of bitch on anything. Autumn Jun 2013 #9

Boehner is a traitor as far as I care. hobbit709 Jun 2013 #14

Can't vote, because usually in situations like this, the truth is someplace in the middle. nt Javaman Jun 2013 #16

Yup. GoCubsGo Jun 2013 #18

I have not decided yet... Ohio Joe Jun 2013 #19

not in the strict legal sense arely staircase Jun 2013 #21

Saw Fox 'news" at the gym and they had the opposite view, calling Snowden a hero. AlinPA Jun 2013 #23

Tssk.. ForeignandDomestic Jun 2013 #24

+1.. SomethingFishy Jun 2013 #25

A lot of John Boehner and Lindsey Graham supporters here lately. ForgoTheConsequence Jun 2013 #26

Nice to see 30% of DU siding with Boehner LittleBlue Jun 2013 #27

Well, the other 70% is siding with StormFront, who thinks he's a hero... SidDithers Jun 2013 #28

How do you know what Stormfront is doing? No one here gives a shit about sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #37

Appeals to bandwagon (Elsberg) and guilt by association (Stormfront) are two sides of the same coin stevenleser Jun 2013 #39

Ellsberg is a respected hero in this country. There was no need to appeal to him. His words have sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #42

Appeals to bandwagon and appeals to authority are logical fallacies for good reasons the same way stevenleser Jun 2013 #46

Well of course if that was the case, you might have a point. The fact is that Ellsberg agrees with sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #58

ROFL. This coming from the poster who tells us what the goons at Conservative Cave are posting... SidDithers Jun 2013 #40

Aw, you're so lovable when you try to play 'gotcha' and fail. But practice makes perfect and who sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #43

Yeah, you tell yourself that, sabrina... SidDithers Jun 2013 #48

And yet you play bobduca Jun 2013 #56

No. I don't agree with traitor Life Long Dem Jun 2013 #29

Yes, but agreeing with BONER has nothing to do with my opinion. nt UTUSN Jun 2013 #32

This is the stupidest fucking piece of shit of a poll I've seen in my life! n/t backscatter712 Jun 2013 #36

I don't think he's a traitor... one_voice Jun 2013 #38

This is one of those cat/buttered toast trick questions! reformist2 Jun 2013 #45

It's a simple question. I probably would have included Ari Fleischer and Peter King sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #60

Good news-- Mitch McConnell also thinks Snowden should be prosecuted. BlueCheese Jun 2013 #49

He's a hero who loves America more than any politician that approves of mass surveillance. nt limpyhobbler Jun 2013 #50

Boehner is a corporatist, pushing legislation which benefits things in which he has $$$ investments. Fire Walk With Me Jun 2013 #51

I really don't know AsahinaKimi Jun 2013 #52

Traitor? In the same way that Daniel Ellsberg is? Or, Ronald Ridenhour? Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2013 #55

just changed my vote to yes to reflect snowden's sharing of info w/chinese arely staircase Jun 2013 #62