General Discussion

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)

199. Remember the five stages of grief?

Tue Jun 11, 2013, 12:37 PM

Jun 2013

Denial, anger, bargaining, depression and then acceptance.

Some DUers are still in the denial stage. They just don't believe how bad this one really is. Some are in the anger stage. That's me.

Will we proceed through the other stages? I don't know, because in my view this is a really bad scandal, but it isn't Obama's scandal. It goes way back to right after WWII when our country went out looking for enemies -- and found them.

Cyber-security is a huge issue, but our government should create a secure system for itself with a separate connection that nobody else uses and thus avoid being affected by it. I don't know if that is possible, but I don't think that they should tie into the internet we use for anything that is classified.

And our government should not be collecting personal data on us on such a vast scale. It is completely incompatible with democracy.

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WAIT!!!!!!!! [View all] uponit7771 Jun 2013 OP

Amen!!! mfcorey1 Jun 2013 #1

The more we learn (or don't learn) about Snowden Warpy Jun 2013 #26

Glad I'm not the only one who sees this... GoCubsGo Jun 2013 #74

The real scandal is that the government has not denied that JDPriestly Jun 2013 #85

That, too. GoCubsGo Jun 2013 #99

Eric Cantor had his ass handed to him this morning warrant46 Jun 2013 #106

I appreciate what Snowden is trying to do. avaistheone1 Jun 2013 #118

It seems to be timdog44 Jun 2013 #186

Remember the five stages of grief? JDPriestly Jun 2013 #199

That is a fairly perceptive timdog44 Jun 2013 #203

A lot of people on DU have not yet thought about just how much JDPriestly Jun 2013 #207

I am afraid timdog44 Jun 2013 #208

I wasn't thinking of any sort of Google searches that would JDPriestly Jun 2013 #211

You are talking about several things here. timdog44 Jun 2013 #212

Booz-Allen being involved in any way in our national security JDPriestly Jun 2013 #88

But i thought everyone wanted smaller government and bigger business???? kelliekat44 Jun 2013 #108

Agreed. timdog44 Jun 2013 #187

Also, he abandons ballerinas. sibelian Jun 2013 #190

Apparently he broke both his legs in a training accident in the military Mojorabbit Jun 2013 #202

Interesting. Warpy Jun 2013 #205

I certainly wouldn't trust anybody that donates to a Republican. n/t Cali_Democrat Jun 2013 #2

+1 Money talks, even if I donate 5 dollars on the straight up it's still a sign of support uponit7771 Jun 2013 #3

you mean like Elizabeth Warren? cali Jun 2013 #209

K & R. My response to this rat fucking "scandal": Fuck Ron Paul. n/t FSogol Jun 2013 #4

And so begins another episode of Hair-on-Fire Undeground. JoePhilly Jun 2013 #5

Already been threads about impeachment mcar Jun 2013 #13

Yup. I've seen them. JoePhilly Jun 2013 #16

I like that. timdog44 Jun 2013 #192

The political world is not linear. JoePhilly Jun 2013 #195

Makes it timdog44 Jun 2013 #196

Always. nt JoePhilly Jun 2013 #197

Like this one? G_j Jun 2013 #28

Hahahahaha!!!! Luminous Animal Jun 2013 #31

You don't mean the ones started by sarcastic Obama partisans, do you? DirkGently Jun 2013 #54

Makes me wonder Jamaal510 Jun 2013 #116

That's disingenuous, intheflow Jun 2013 #181

No, what's "sheeplike" Jamaal510 Jun 2013 #184

You are a Constitutional scholar? intheflow Jun 2013 #185

My sentiments EXACTLY eissa Jun 2013 #14

Pretty soon, both the far right and far left will be talking about the FEMA camps. JoePhilly Jun 2013 #17

Are you kidding me? intheflow Jun 2013 #182

Ive added 87 people to my ignore list Floyd_Gondolli Jun 2013 #18

Ahh, essentially doing the equivalent of an O'Reilly "Cut his mic off" act. Fantastic Anarchist Jun 2013 #30

they may not hear you G_j Jun 2013 #37

I could be one of the 87! Fantastic Anarchist Jun 2013 #40

Make that 88 Floyd_Gondolli Jun 2013 #96

Case rested! Fantastic Anarchist Jun 2013 #120

Make that 89. timdog44 Jun 2013 #193

*PLONK* Bobbie Jo Jun 2013 #171

Have you visited any of the camps for illegals, the deportation JDPriestly Jun 2013 #90

At that rate, pretty soon you won't have anyone to converse JDPriestly Jun 2013 #91

Absolutely. timdog44 Jun 2013 #194

Well, good to know you've decided to wait and see. enlightenment Jun 2013 #6

"NOT breaking any laws " ProSense Jun 2013 #7

+1 uponit7771 Jun 2013 #10

And, GG won't answer the question about whether the NSA did something Cha Jun 2013 #55

Just because something is "legal" doesn't mean it's right. alarimer Jun 2013 #132

Bush committed "warrantless wiretapping". Do you know what "warrantless" means? False equivalence Tarheel_Dem Jun 2013 #133

+1, whistle blowing is outing someone doing something illegal. Leaking is for the sake of a good sto uponit7771 Jun 2013 #153

Pathetic, isn't it? Whisp Jun 2013 #8

thank you! nt. CitizenLeft Jun 2013 #9

Clapper's lying about it, Obama's defending it, Union Scribe Jun 2013 #11

More sophistry, what does Obama have to "defend"?!?! He doesn't even need a warrant!!!! uponit7771 Jun 2013 #15

You've already stated on DU that you support domestic spying Union Scribe Jun 2013 #19

Amen brother! Phlem Jun 2013 #34

Excellent post. And I am dismayed how many eat up his lying smears about Greenwald. Luminous Animal Jun 2013 #53

Could not have said it any better myself. n/t npk Jun 2013 #59

This is not what I said, you're misrepresenting what I said AGAIN.. not surprised. Regards uponit7771 Jun 2013 #68

Here's the link: Union Scribe Jun 2013 #115

There's no SPYING In that link, again...this is ANOTHER falsehood uponit7771 Jun 2013 #124

So you're in favor of "the President's domestic surveillance of citizens" LondonReign2 Jun 2013 #146

I'm in favor of knowing the difference between SPYING and surveying !! uponit7771 Jun 2013 #152

I'm in favor of you knowing the difference between spying and surveying too LondonReign2 Jun 2013 #154

That's a lot of punctuation. DirkGently Jun 2013 #49

I'm right with you madokie Jun 2013 #12

Obama denounced the IRS issue (wrongly, imo) and had nothing to hide Union Scribe Jun 2013 #21

You might be interested to know ... Laelth Jun 2013 #20

wow Glen Greenwald worked for CATO? he write a paper on drug policy for them as part of a debate azurnoir Jun 2013 #22

But...but...but... BeeBee Jun 2013 #23

Well said question everything Jun 2013 #24

I do not look at these latest revelations to be an attack on the President snappyturtle Jun 2013 #25

Definition of warmonger: : one who urges or attempts to stir up war Luminous Animal Jun 2013 #36

The accusation of war monger was the OP's, not mine. I was meerly pointing out snappyturtle Jun 2013 #43

Everything which does not help the President is an attack on the President! DirkGently Jun 2013 #47

Snowden said that "Hong Kong has a strong tradition of free speech." SunSeeker Jun 2013 #27

Oh my god! Snowden killed the Tiananmen Square guy? DirkGently Jun 2013 #39

No, he didn't kill the Tienanmen Square guy. He just killed his credibility. nt SunSeeker Jun 2013 #44

By going to Hong Kong, a hive of scum & villany? DirkGently Jun 2013 #45

No, by lavishing praise on the "free speech tradition" of Hong Kong. nt SunSeeker Jun 2013 #48

Well they do have a tradition of free speech. DirkGently Jun 2013 #50

Oh yes, Hong Kong, the free speech mecca. SunSeeker Jun 2013 #57

So you'd find him more credible, somehow, if he'd gone to Bermuda? DirkGently Jun 2013 #60

I'd find him more credible if he didn't lavish praise on Chinese "free speech" while bashing the US. SunSeeker Jun 2013 #67

A lot of people "bash" the U.S. Domestic surveillance programs. Including DirkGently Jun 2013 #69

You keep avoiding the point that he praised China, which has terrible abuses. SunSeeker Jun 2013 #75

Hillary Clinton supported the Iraq war. Does she lack credibility? DirkGently Jun 2013 #83

...If she were a winger? YES!! She's NOT a winger like Greenwald and Snowden. uponit7771 Jun 2013 #89

What wing is Greenwald on, again? Not the right, DirkGently Jun 2013 #102

She would if she still supported it after the facts came out. SunSeeker Jun 2013 #92

You tried to equate Tiananmen Square DirkGently Jun 2013 #105

OFFS, Hong Kong is no haven of free speech. I can't believe you are singing its praises. SunSeeker Jun 2013 #119

It's not really relevant to the topic of domestic spying, is the point. DirkGently Jun 2013 #121

About that. Doesn't look like Greenwald did support Iraq. DirkGently Jun 2013 #111

Oh, but he did support Iraq! Not only did he support it, he was Bush fanboy who got duped! Tarheel_Dem Jun 2013 #138

Eh. Those words do not really say that. He admits to briefly DirkGently Jun 2013 #142

Uhhmmm. Okay! Tarheel_Dem Jun 2013 #143

Yes, it's okay your mischaracterization failed. DirkGently Jun 2013 #147

No, probably not. But he also probably doesn't want to live in a country snappyturtle Jun 2013 #46

If he doesn't want to live in a country where there has ever been an atrocity, he's got slim picking SunSeeker Jun 2013 #52

If that's true, the question is, what's YOUR point? DirkGently Jun 2013 #56

It's stupid to go to a country with even worse abuses & lavish praise on it while bashing the US. SunSeeker Jun 2013 #61

Ah...short memory. Never mind. You must be overly stressed. nt snappyturtle Jun 2013 #58

Well, they didn't run him over, did they? AAO Jun 2013 #156

Snowden could have donated money to Pol Pot. BlueCheese Jun 2013 #29

Glenn Greenwald Once Again Proves He is a Hate-Oozing Douche FarCenter Jun 2013 #32

k and r Berlum Jun 2013 #33

zOMg! Tenuous smears & guilt by association! DirkGently Jun 2013 #35

Yeah, lets take the Carlyle Groups, Cato, Rand Paul supports and Bush appoligist at face value... uponit7771 Jun 2013 #70

Well, you're welcomed to explain how your conspiracy theory plays out. DirkGently Jun 2013 #79

Don't have to be a conspiracy to look at the background of those who are telling this story and uponit7771 Jun 2013 #81

But you don't want to explain what you mean by that? DirkGently Jun 2013 #84

IF they supported Bush to a shill level like Glen or Ron Paul like Snow they're NOT to be trusted... uponit7771 Jun 2013 #157

How did the preface of Greenwald's book attacking Bush make him a "shill" for Bush? DirkGently Jun 2013 #159

You're quite hung up on Carlyle LondonReign2 Jun 2013 #95

This is one of those "fill in LOTS of blanks" type theories I think. DirkGently Jun 2013 #107

You didn't want to answer before so let me try again... LondonReign2 Jun 2013 #148

More Bush connections: DevonRex Jun 2013 #38

Hmmmm. Tell us more of this Chinese Bush conspiracy. DirkGently Jun 2013 #42

Oh, people here have called Obama worse than Bush. DevonRex Jun 2013 #66

I'm simply asking you to flesh out your rather exotic conspiracy theory. DirkGently Jun 2013 #73

You Might RobinA Jun 2013 #71

Greenwald had no problem wiretapping for Matt Hale.... msanthrope Jun 2013 #41

thanks for the link, ms. Cha Jun 2013 #62

He loved GW's invasion of Iraq and all his security measures, too. nt DevonRex Jun 2013 #76

Got a link to any of that? DirkGently Jun 2013 #113

You should repost that as its own OP leftynyc Jun 2013 #82

Now that's some ugly shit right there. Can you spell "h-y-p-o-c-r-i-t-e"? Tarheel_Dem Jun 2013 #144

Greenwald's lack of empathy for others tends to come out, doesn't it? nt msanthrope Jun 2013 #145

It does indeed. n/t Tarheel_Dem Jun 2013 #168

Oh and WAIT, some More! GG's been working with ES since FEB! Cha Jun 2013 #51

Edward (SnowEd em) Snowden Eddie Haskell Jun 2013 #63

ods bigtree Jun 2013 #64

And the "hero" volunteered to fight in the Iraq war after believing everything Bush/Cheney said. bushisanidiot Jun 2013 #65

DING DING DING!! Needs to be a Top Post too. When I see a progressive that isn't bashing Obama uponit7771 Jun 2013 #78

Thanks for making sense leftynyc Jun 2013 #72

I'm in w/this OP!!! K&R!! hue Jun 2013 #77

Oh, shit! You done did it now!!! Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #80

thx I need them, gotta look at things plainly sometimes ... don't know why ANYONE is listening to uponit7771 Jun 2013 #87

Didn't realize DU was in the game of shooting the messenger these days Roland99 Jun 2013 #86

...if the messenger was a war mongering, cato institute winger who supported Rand Paul then we shoul uponit7771 Jun 2013 #93

There's enough evidence of that Bobbie Jo Jun 2013 #117

So, this worsening of things Bush started is more of Obama's "chess game" Roland99 Jun 2013 #123

I know he is not a liberal, he is a libertarian, but i did not know he supported the Iraq war still_one Jun 2013 #94

He did then tried to claim he didn't uponit7771 Jun 2013 #97

Thanks for the link still_one Jun 2013 #100

That link doesn't even say that. DirkGently Jun 2013 #109

He actually didn't, apparently. DirkGently Jun 2013 #110

Desperate. GoneFishin Jun 2013 #98

Since facts aren't working Maedhros Jun 2013 #101

Could you point out where I'm wrong? Regards uponit7771 Jun 2013 #129

The burden of proof Maedhros Jun 2013 #172

Here you go. Maedhros Jun 2013 #213

Apparently our shipment of ultra-concentrated well poison has come in. JoeyT Jun 2013 #103

There's no telling them it's not all about Obama. It's like fire ants. DirkGently Jun 2013 #122

Slight quibble: He's a Ron Paul supporter. KamaAina Jun 2013 #104

Slight quibble? This OP is hilariously nonsensical. DirkGently Jun 2013 #112

Support Iraq war AND wirte for CATO and is an asshole, and Snow didn't contribute 15 dollars he gave uponit7771 Jun 2013 #125

Got a real link on that Iraq thing? Yours doesn't say that. DirkGently Jun 2013 #127

here uponit7771 Jun 2013 #128

Same one. They just talk in circles. No evidence. DirkGently Jun 2013 #130

I disagree...quote inside uponit7771 Jun 2013 #137

That's him describing his former views in a book denouncing Bush. DirkGently Jun 2013 #149

Irrelevant to the question, the question was did he support Bush's war the answer = YES uponit7771 Jun 2013 #151

No, he was a reporter that started writing to become a Bush critic. DirkGently Jun 2013 #155

REALLY?!?! He even says he gave them the benefit of the doubt!!! I NEVER gave that bastard the uponit7771 Jun 2013 #158

Me neither. But most of America did, for a moment. Doesn't make him a "shill." DirkGently Jun 2013 #160

I agree, if that was the ONLY thing I would agree but it wasn't. Glen is an ass, CATO I contributor uponit7771 Jun 2013 #161

PRISM was operating under an illegal interpretation of the law in 2011. DirkGently Jun 2013 #162

+1 tallahasseedem Jun 2013 #114

YEAH!!!! Tarheel_Dem Jun 2013 #126

Yup, it be froggy. But consider that the media is all we got. Besides memory and brains. freshwest Jun 2013 #131

+1 uponit7771 Jun 2013 #140

"Most significant" leak in history, and likely one of the dumbest. ProSense Jun 2013 #134

+1 uponit7771 Jun 2013 #135

Anyone who calls Greenwald "war mongering" clearly has not read Greenwald Bjorn Against Jun 2013 #136

Same here...I just quoted Greenwald (inside) on another post uponit7771 Jun 2013 #139

And then he became one of the most vocal critics of the Bush Administration Bjorn Against Jun 2013 #141

Yeah after it was seen that Bush was losing!! The SECOND there were no WMDs found guys like Glen uponit7771 Jun 2013 #150

Greenwald was a thorn in the side of the Bush Administration Bjorn Against Jun 2013 #164

I agree, only after the shit hit the fan though...like most kkkons they dropped the Bush admin like uponit7771 Jun 2013 #166

And then they all started blogging extensively and expertly on how Bush's actions Hissyspit Jun 2013 #177

Greenwald responds to your smears re cato, etc. HiPointDem Jun 2013 #163

"I accepted his judgment that American security really would be enhanced by the invasion of this ... uponit7771 Jun 2013 #165

no, you. HiPointDem Jun 2013 #167

no...you uponit7771 Jun 2013 #169

no no, tu. HiPointDem Jun 2013 #170

Although I Tend to Agree With You, On the Road Jun 2013 #173

All these recs for an OP that starts out with two lies in the first sentence Hissyspit Jun 2013 #174

False, both statements here are false uponit7771 Jun 2013 #178

Nope. Hissyspit Jun 2013 #179

bravo kardonb Jun 2013 #175

Washington Post has not only backed away from its initial reporting, it now says that Obama won't Number23 Jun 2013 #176

+1 savalez Jun 2013 #189

Speak to it, #23! Tarheel_Dem Jun 2013 #198

I wish I could agree that screaming that "Obama=Bush" does fuck all. SunSeeker Jun 2013 #204

+ an absolute million. PERFECT post Number23 Jun 2013 #206

+1 uponit7771 Jun 2013 #214

Trolls are everywhere, systematically dividing (thereby destroying) DU. October Jun 2013 #180

tssk... ForeignandDomestic Jun 2013 #183

K&R savalez Jun 2013 #188

"crown the person who leaked it" sibelian Jun 2013 #191

I am open to all the lies we are handed daily WHEN CRABS ROAR Jun 2013 #200

K/R CakeGrrl Jun 2013 #201

Boo. Common lies used by right-wingers and Obamabots to smear Greenwald because of the stuff he says limpyhobbler Jun 2013 #210