General Discussion

marions ghost

(19,841 posts)

170. Mamma Mia

Tue Jun 11, 2013, 01:54 PM

Jun 2013

OK read the first paragraph again. It CLEARLY says we can't have a serious debate without ending secret law. He is saying --we need to END it.

"We can’t have a serious debate about how much surveillance of Americans’ communications should be permitted without ending secret law.”

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The second one from Franken is more qualified as he uses the words "protecting national security" which is a key phrase in the debate in Congress. But he's on the side of investigation and review.

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---Whether the court needs to cease to exist can only be determined by opening up this can of worms.
FISA has become an instrument of abuse, and making the process more transparent is one way of dealing with it. I don't think it will solve the problem alone. I think we need more.

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I took off my Obama stickers yesterday [View all] FirstLight Jun 2013 OP

I call it "outrage fatigue...." mike_c Jun 2013 #1

Yeah, we forget that most of this stuff is all bullshit. So, we go ahead and believe it. Buzz Clik Jun 2013 #90

Yeah, we should just shut up and watch reality tv and not worry what that clicking on our telephone sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #245

Did you damage the finish of your car peeling off your stickers? Buzz Clik Jun 2013 #260

I have friends and family members who are, quite literally, too depressed to discuss dgibby Jun 2013 #122

That's how I feel right now... haven't been paying attention budkin Jun 2013 #166

+1000 FirstLight Jun 2013 #171

That's what the GOP hopes you and others will do. JoePhilly Jun 2013 #2

+1 Historic NY Jun 2013 #5

x2 Gus Lammas Jun 2013 #132

Yep, it is definitely a tactic the GOP employs and quite skillfully. n/t RKP5637 Jun 2013 #9

How can people not see this? madokie Jun 2013 #56

Sadly, I think your last sentence sums it all up, they hate the black man RKP5637 Jun 2013 #91

Blinded by hate madokie Jun 2013 #113

And a Dem in that order. WHEN CRABS ROAR Jun 2013 #165

DOUBLE BINGO!!! kelliekat44 Jun 2013 #199

Scott Walker celebrating AnotherWyoDemocrat Jun 2013 #137

So Republicans are forcing Obama and the Dems to NOT do these things? dbackjon Jun 2013 #31

Not what I said. JoePhilly Jun 2013 #52

Yep Andy823 Jun 2013 #115

Agree! JoePhilly Jun 2013 #117

Wisconsin is in a free fall, sadly. SomeGuyInEagan Jun 2013 #191

I think there are several states that are having similar problems davidpdx Jun 2013 #235

And won't the tea party have fun with the NSA? Good thing for them Autumn Jun 2013 #119

Obvious...right? Sheepshank Jun 2013 #133

I don't hate the government but... CincyDem Jun 2013 #60

What did he do wrong here? JoePhilly Jun 2013 #72

I'm not sure he did anything technically "wrong" but it's like so many other things... CincyDem Jun 2013 #83

Wait ... its not "different" enough. JoePhilly Jun 2013 #97

I know he's not God CincyDem Jun 2013 #102

Exactly: spine. levp Jun 2013 #147

+ 1 Mil darkangel218 Jun 2013 #150

you nailed it in your first sentence FirstLight Jun 2013 #174

Overseen by the FISA Court & congress... marions ghost Jun 2013 #88

FISA court was created under Carter. You know that right? JoePhilly Jun 2013 #98

If there was nothing wrong with FISA courts why marions ghost Jun 2013 #106

Let's take a look at two quotes from what you posted ... JoePhilly Jun 2013 #158

Mamma Mia marions ghost Jun 2013 #170

May I point out that the first paragraph you truedelphi Jun 2013 #247

I think I already explained this to you but I'll try again. THEY CHANGED THE FISA BILL sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #246

He didn't stop the program. He could have done this with a pen. He still can. DisgustipatedinCA Jun 2013 #96

Stop doing what exactly? JoePhilly Jun 2013 #99

Spying on millions of Americans. DisgustipatedinCA Jun 2013 #116

Be more specific. Spying could mean many things. JoePhilly Jun 2013 #120

Have you watched the news at all? darkangel218 Jun 2013 #134

Yes ... and the media is all over the map. JoePhilly Jun 2013 #144

Pretty much. darkangel218 Jun 2013 #148

Um, no. Not even close to the same thing. JoePhilly Jun 2013 #160

"There is no one monitoring my calls" darkangel218 Jun 2013 #172

How do you know? tblue Jun 2013 #175

Prove to me there are no Unicorns. JoePhilly Jun 2013 #197

Why did the elephant paint his toenails red? To hide in cherry trees. Wednesdays Jun 2013 #210

And even if it turns out to be truedelphi Jun 2013 #244

How ridiculous treestar Jun 2013 #224

Not stopping spying with an executive order is ridiculous? DisgustipatedinCA Jun 2013 #226

The President is not spying on everyone treestar Jun 2013 #230

I'm not all that fucking stupid, you know. An executive order stopping tyranny is tyranny? DisgustipatedinCA Jun 2013 #232

You really are all that treestar Jun 2013 #234

Post removed Post removed Jun 2013 #236

It could be done with a stroke of his pen. You can stamp your feet Marr Jun 2013 #231

Check the part of the Constitution that describes the processes treestar Jun 2013 #233

That isn't the law. Marr Jun 2013 #240

Ssh! Too many here are in denial about that truedelphi Jun 2013 #243

Sounds like something the Democratic Party might want to do something about, doesn't it? Egalitarian Thug Jun 2013 #124

What they tend to do is ... JoePhilly Jun 2013 #126

Right... 2006, 2008. Egalitarian Thug Jun 2013 #128

Blame who for what? JoePhilly Jun 2013 #130

Please try to keep up... Egalitarian Thug Jun 2013 #131

GOP doesn't have to hope that the working people do anything... They already have the midnight Jun 2013 #135

So let's stay home and accelerate the process!!! JoePhilly Jun 2013 #146

+ 3x kiranon Jun 2013 #140

It's the entire point of Scandalmania. MjolnirTime Jun 2013 #152

This is not about hating the government. The OP's list totodeinhere Jun 2013 #173

Obama isn't running again, and he isn't planning to do anything significant BlueStreak Jun 2013 #186

One is as bad as the other now, but there is another way........ Th1onein Jun 2013 #213

please tell me the difference between the two parties again..... bowens43 Jun 2013 #254

Do you think Mitt Romney would have made you happy, really. Thinkingabout Jun 2013 #3

Where the fuck dd the OP say that? Wow, reading hard for you? n-t Logical Jun 2013 #8

The OP didn't say that Aerows Jun 2013 #20

Read this very slowly, if Obama had not been re-elected in 2012 who would be president today? Thinkingabout Jun 2013 #23

So it is ok then that Obama is screwing us dbackjon Jun 2013 #35

No it's not OK riqster Jun 2013 #45

Welcome to democracy Drale Jun 2013 #46

In which fashion do you feel so screwed? Thinkingabout Jun 2013 #78

Coddling Wall Street dbackjon Jun 2013 #143

+ a brazillion! FirstLight Jun 2013 #177

Read this slowly: LWolf Jun 2013 #69

gee, another condescending n00b.. frylock Jun 2013 #161

But Obama WAS reelected, and the issues listed in the OP DO exist, hence the bike man Jun 2013 #162

That's not the point. Obama did happen to be reelected and now those of us who voted totodeinhere Jun 2013 #180

It's not really necessary to be that nasty. blue neen Jun 2013 #65

... SammyWinstonJack Jun 2013 #70

Playing right into their hands liberal N proud Jun 2013 #4

I'm considering something completely new... Javaman Jun 2013 #6

Good description Aerows Jun 2013 #14

My tipping point came after reading the book "Methland" Javaman Jun 2013 #39

Unfortunately Aerows Jun 2013 #44

"politicians are the only actors that don't care about the audience or their fans." Well said! AnotherMcIntosh Jun 2013 #107

Who was it that said that "Politicians are the folks that truedelphi Jun 2013 #242

+1000! FirstLight Jun 2013 #37

+1 LWolf Jun 2013 #53

... Melinda Jun 2013 #7

This? Puzzledtraveller Jun 2013 #18

Naw, the darn thing's too happy for the kind of hug I'd like to share with the OP. Melinda Jun 2013 #24

not many at all, but if it comforts you, you go ahead and take it. n/t Whisp Jun 2013 #22

Thanks for the permission. Melinda Jun 2013 #27

you are welcome. Whisp Jun 2013 #62

Lmao!! darkangel218 Jun 2013 #187

Take a rest for awhile lunatica Jun 2013 #10

You never loved him Aerows Jun 2013 #11

That you put them on was your first mistake. bigwillq Jun 2013 #12

The "true believers" haven't given up hope Puzzledtraveller Jun 2013 #13

Is your paint faded around where the sticker was snooper2 Jun 2013 #15

LOL Puzzledtraveller Jun 2013 #21

Nothing about historic obstruction from Republicans? JaneyVee Jun 2013 #16

Does, "Give him more time" still work as an excuse? Or, "McCain would be worse"? Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2013 #17

omg hahaha!! Whisp Jun 2013 #19

Not cool. darkangel218 Jun 2013 #38

not cool is right. Whisp Jun 2013 #75

!!! Tarheel_Dem Jun 2013 #73

Can we count on you to withhold your Dem votes in 2014 too? CakeGrrl Jun 2013 #25

So, shaming is an acceptable tactic in GOTV? JW2020 Jun 2013 #92

I don't need to rethink anything. If people are too butthurt to vote against the GOP CakeGrrl Jun 2013 #154

The dems have earned it. morningfog Jun 2013 #104

You mean the politicians who have way more money and assets than their constituents? CakeGrrl Jun 2013 #155

I never said shit about 2014 FirstLight Jun 2013 #183

Not big on the big picture, eh? CakeGrrl Jun 2013 #190

I'm not talking about punishment. morningfog Jun 2013 #214

Earned what?? nt babylonsister Jun 2013 #228

GOP wins warrior1 Jun 2013 #26

So we're supposed to support crooked policies just to support the Dems and POTUS?? darkangel218 Jun 2013 #85

Because the Dems are so weak and pathetic. morningfog Jun 2013 #105

Gave up on waiting for that pony huh? lpbk2713 Jun 2013 #28

Did you take off your "I heart congress" ones also? Damn Obama for not being a dictator uppityperson Jun 2013 #29

I never apply bumper stickers Celldweller Jun 2013 #30

I think this is accurate: LWolf Jun 2013 #32

exactly FirstLight Jun 2013 #43

"Hopey-Changey," coined by Progressive thinker, Sarah Palin! emulatorloo Jun 2013 #51

She's pathetic. LWolf Jun 2013 #64

But we need your help getting Obama re-elected!!!! JaneyVee Jun 2013 #67

You ARE joking, right? derby378 Jun 2013 #217

I took em off a long time ago. darkangel218 Jun 2013 #33

Oh the drama! HappyMe Jun 2013 #34

I feel your pain...chin up. nt clarice Jun 2013 #36

Check back here when the GOP fully takes over this country. DCBob Jun 2013 #40

...it's already ugly for many of us FirstLight Jun 2013 #47

yes, I know but think of it in orders of magnitude higher. DCBob Jun 2013 #58

Yes, it's ugly nobodyspecial Jun 2013 #76

Yep. Send us a report with your chisel and stone tablet. TheCowsCameHome Jun 2013 #50

Partly because of such actions, Ohio is now a one-party Reep state riqster Jun 2013 #59

All you have to do is wait 4 to 8 years and the Dems will be back in control. JW2020 Jun 2013 #95

Healthy disagreement at DU is not going to facilitate the GOP taking over. totodeinhere Jun 2013 #184

Never said it would and Im not just talking about DU.. DCBob Jun 2013 #201

You said ... totodeinhere Jun 2013 #212

If enough Democrats leave the party over this bogus issue the GOP will take over. DCBob Jun 2013 #216

No need to insult my intelligence. I understand complicated issues quite well. totodeinhere Jun 2013 #241

Sorry didnt mean to do that. DCBob Jun 2013 #257

Thanks Bob. Actually I agree that people should not bolt the party over this. totodeinhere Jun 2013 #265

ofercrissake get over yourself. lamp_shade Jun 2013 #41

No, you.do that. darkangel218 Jun 2013 #48

You fell for the GOP's "throw shit at the wall and hopes some sticks" machine. They demosincebirth Jun 2013 #42

It amazes me Bobbie Jo Jun 2013 #101

It also depends how commited one is to their party. No party is perfect as you know, but what demosincebirth Jun 2013 #225

Ooh, you took your bumperstickers off. Fight the power! w00t!!! nt geek tragedy Jun 2013 #49

ya well, it isn't about the stickers FirstLight Jun 2013 #54

Every politician ever born has disappointed everyone that's supported geek tragedy Jun 2013 #61

How dare you even suggest that! nobodyspecial Jun 2013 #79

Now youre telling the OP that is not about their feelings?? darkangel218 Jun 2013 #80

Even more shocking, it's not about your feelings. geek tragedy Jun 2013 #84

Oh ok. You and i are just puppets with no say? is that it?? darkangel218 Jun 2013 #86

So is "it" about ANYTHING? sibelian Jun 2013 #252

You said a mouth full. One issue voters like many 2nd ammenders are part of voters who always demosincebirth Jun 2013 #227

Don't give up emulatorloo Jun 2013 #66

The conductor does not make the band. The members do. Gregorian Jun 2013 #55

I'm taking my Christmas decorations down as well, TheCowsCameHome Jun 2013 #57

Good thinking! emulatorloo Jun 2013 #71

... Floyd_Gondolli Jun 2013 #63

Good Looking Kid. Yours? HangOnKids Jun 2013 #121

lmao!!!! darkangel218 Jun 2013 #127

I would have, too. Quantess Jun 2013 #68

There are many who agree with you, and some who refuse to admit there is anything bike man Jun 2013 #74

I've read the replies. Savannahmann Jun 2013 #77

That means it's working! n/t savalez Jun 2013 #81

When are you going to start reading the newspapers? Kolesar Jun 2013 #82

Are you refering to yourself perheps? darkangel218 Jun 2013 #87

I am quite well read Kolesar Jun 2013 #94

What do my hidden posts have to do with what you said to the OP? darkangel218 Jun 2013 #100

Its a fact that POTUS has let down a lot of people darkangel218 Jun 2013 #103

LOL! Geez. I'm sorry. But this is just too funny. Buzz Clik Jun 2013 #89

Histrionics 'R Us Floyd_Gondolli Jun 2013 #179

Chained CPI! Kolesar Jun 2013 #200

Oh yes, how could I forget that Floyd_Gondolli Jun 2013 #204

Mission Accomplished. Signed GOP n/t SalviaBlue Jun 2013 #93

Good...Stay Home and enjoy maxrandb Jun 2013 #108

I'll alert the media arely staircase Jun 2013 #109

democracy is hard so I'm giving up Progressive dog Jun 2013 #110

Well said. AnotherMcIntosh Jun 2013 #111

You must feel morally righteous by removing car stickers. n/t cynatnite Jun 2013 #112

Strange, strange. And just think about all of the real problems in the world that need bluestate10 Jun 2013 #238

Yep. Shot in the face or stabbed in the back, your choice. n/t Egalitarian Thug Jun 2013 #114

I understand the burnout, been there, done that life long demo Jun 2013 #118

This message was self-deleted by its author darkangel218 Jun 2013 #123

TeamThink Red Knight Jun 2013 #125

+1million. Thank you for your post darkangel218 Jun 2013 #129

Some posters here have a moral compass and policy preferences that are whatever the party tells them Dragonfli Jun 2013 #178

well said! FirstLight Jun 2013 #261

With Too Many Years Under My Belt, I Am With You - Tired Of This BS cantbeserious Jun 2013 #136

I don't put stickers on my car, but I understand where you're coming from. Autumn Jun 2013 #138

Then you and everyone who recc'd.... zentrum Jun 2013 #139

+ 1 kiranon Jun 2013 #142

You're wasting logical thought on the same ilk that sat at home in 2010 and gave republicans bluestate10 Jun 2013 #239

You're in Cali? Replace it with one of these: ucrdem Jun 2013 #141

Your choice, bye still_one Jun 2013 #145

Thats all it takes to tell someone goodbye on here?? lol darkangel218 Jun 2013 #149

No problem, change does not happen overnight, and I do not care for people who throw there arms up still_one Jun 2013 #205

All hail the lame ship Poutrage! MjolnirTime Jun 2013 #151

"Wall St still in business" Spitfire of ATJ Jun 2013 #153

Obama has actually accomplished a lot. Billy Pilgrim Jun 2013 #156

That's what the ones who give up, dwell on .. the negatives. Cha Jun 2013 #221

Good for you. Both parties are screwing us. Let's revolt right now. limpyhobbler Jun 2013 #157

Please pay attention to your local races G_j Jun 2013 #159

I did that in the first term after he caved to the GOP on the extension of the Bush tax cuts budkin Jun 2013 #163

Also... Billy Pilgrim Jun 2013 #164

President Palin President Romney! AWWWK! JoeyT Jun 2013 #167

Perhaps you noticed alot of the stickers were magnetic olddots Jun 2013 #168

Me too. I replaced mine with a "Greenwald for Pulitzer Prize 2013" sticker. great white snark Jun 2013 #169

Sorry, but people like you are the reason we got St. Ronnie instead of Jimmy Carter II. Zen Democrat Jun 2013 #176

I more than agree with this statement! redstatebluegirl Jun 2013 #181

Nope. A bad economy and the Iran hostage crisis is what gave us Reagan. totodeinhere Jun 2013 #188

stop boo hooo....i took off my stickers rtracey Jun 2013 #182

You stop "moaning and groaning" darkangel218 Jun 2013 #185

Weak. Quantess Jun 2013 #196

see rtracey Jun 2013 #203

Yes, but that's the same discussion we've been having for months, now. Quantess Jun 2013 #248

Clinton fatigue deja vu tularetom Jun 2013 #189

Congratulations...? Arkana Jun 2013 #192

I love how so many here think I am saying this because I am POUTING FirstLight Jun 2013 #193

since this got lost in the shuffle FirstLight Jun 2013 #262

I altered the name Obama on my running cap. Peregrine Took Jun 2013 #194

Mine remains on my vehicle n/t Just Saying Jun 2013 #195

On the contrary...Obama has been the MOST SUCCESSFUL PRESIDENT IN US HISTORY!! BanTheGOP Jun 2013 #198

... FirstLight Jun 2013 #202

I do not waste time with folks that give up so easily. I say let em give up, there are plenty of still_one Jun 2013 #207

We've had enough help from California and Illinois, thank you very much derby378 Jun 2013 #219

Boo fucking hoo LuvLoogie Jun 2013 #206

Ain't that the truth still_one Jun 2013 #208

"This place is loaded with punks." CO-SIGN!! Number23 Jun 2013 #222

You never really loved him!! QC Jun 2013 #209

A lot of people feel the same and are getting on with their lives Corruption Inc Jun 2013 #211

THANKS FirstLight Jun 2013 #220

So much butthurt over the truth, here... Daemonaquila Jun 2013 #215

I don't do bumper stickers, political or otherwise. cherokeeprogressive Jun 2013 #218

Yawn treestar Jun 2013 #223

Good for you, I think old political bumper stickers look tacky. tritsofme Jun 2013 #229

I am never get emotionally attached to a politician enough to put that person's sticker on my car. bluestate10 Jun 2013 #237

I found some my old Obama stickers and plastered them on my car. I am having one made that says, mfcorey1 Jun 2013 #249

I never had one to begin with. too right wing for me. nt boilerbabe Jun 2013 #250

Oh, good fucking grief. aquart Jun 2013 #251

you true believers really crack me up. This guy has been a complete disaster. bowens43 Jun 2013 #255

I'm sure Rand Paul will protect your freedoms. aquart Jun 2013 #256

what utter non-sense. DCBob Jun 2013 #258

I removed mine right after the last election..... bowens43 Jun 2013 #253

ya, FirstLight Jun 2013 #266

I Was Gonna Take Mine Off... JimGinPA Jun 2013 #259

Yet here we are, two days later, and he STILL has not resigned from office! 11 Bravo Jun 2013 #263

OMG! I just realized that Obama is doing all of this illegal shit on purpose!! Major Hogwash Jun 2013 #267

wow...so much vitriol... let's reinterate FirstLight Jun 2013 #264