General Discussion
In reply to the discussion: Do you agree with John Boehner that Edward Snowden is a traitor? [View all]sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)when a perp is caught actually committing a crime) being established, or a case won when those steps were skipped?? There are tons of cases where even people who were obviously guilty, had their cases thrown out because the police gathered evidence without a warrant. If the 4th Amendment was not the law of the land, many unfortunate people would be hauled off to jail, charged with crimes they may or may not have committed and probably found guilty. Thank the gods for the 4th Amendment.
But how very sad it is to see people dismiss these checks and balances that were set up so thoughtfully to try to create a fair system of justice, where law enforcement and governments would at least be checked by some means to ensure we did not devolve into a totalitarian state. So far, despite attempts to undermine by would be dictators, they have served this country well.
I will be on the side of every person who respects the law of the land and doesn't attempt, as Bush and his cohorts did, to twist and distort those laws to free them up to commit the war crimes they committed. The FFs anticipated such people one day grabbing the reins of power which is why they wrote the Constitution in the first place.
Of course if you would prefer no law, and we are on our way there considering that we do not prosecute War Criminals or Wall St. criminals, then I won't expect to see you fighting along with those who have been doing so all along.
It's a bad period we are going through, as other countries have in the past, a dark period where criminals managed to get into power for a while, but I have faith it won't last for ever, not as long as we have people like Ellsberg and Snowden and Drake, willing to expose the crimes at great cost to themselves. I have noticed they are increasing in number as the criminals grow bolder, and that is a good thing.
What probable cause was there for Verizon and the NSA to track people's phone records?? The people will be asking to see it along with millions of others before long.
And why did Clapper lie about it?? Because he knows they are doing wrong.