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In reply to the discussion: When Leaders Go Wrong. [View all]

ProSense

(116,464 posts)
14. That Obama quote
Sun Jun 23, 2013, 07:22 PM
Jun 2013

Reposting this:

Another misleading media report implies that warrantless wiretapping is legal.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023026724

Secret to Prism program: Even bigger data seizure
http://bigstory.ap.org/article/secret-prism-success-even-bigger-data-seizure

The entire article is framed to create the impression that warrantless wiretapping is legal, and that Obama approves of it.

The article mentions the Protect America Act, quotes Obama opposing it, and then creates the impression he embraced it when he became President.

From the article:

The Bush administration shut down its warrantless wiretapping program in 2007 but endorsed a new law, the Protect America Act, which allowed the wiretapping to continue with changes: The NSA generally would have to explain its techniques and targets to a secret court in Washington, but individual warrants would not be required.

Congress approved it, with Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., in the midst of a campaign for president, voting against it.

"This administration also puts forward a false choice between the liberties we cherish and the security we provide," Obama said in a speech two days before that vote. "I will provide our intelligence and law enforcement agencies with the tools they need to track and take out the terrorists without undermining our Constitution and our freedom."

<...>

Years after decrying Bush for it, Obama said Americans did have to make tough choices in the name of safety.

There have been a number of media reports using the same Obama quote to basically claim that he once called out Bush, but then embraced the policy. They are intentionally conflating a quote about the PAA with his position on the 2008 FISA amendments, which he voted for. They are not the same thing. The PAA was a Republican effort to absolve Bush.

While the article mentions that Obama voted against the Protect America Act (http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=110&session=1&vote=00309), there is no mention of the fact that the Act expired in early 2008.

Senator Mitch McConnell introduced the act on August 1, 2007, during the 110th United States Congress. On August 3, it was passed in the Senate with an amendment, 60–28 (record vote number 309).[12] On August 4, it passed the House of Representatives 227-183 (roll number 836).[12] On August 5, it was signed by President Bush, becoming Public Law No. 110-055. On February 17, 2008, it expired due to sunset provision.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protect_America_Act_of_2007#Legislative_history


The amendments to FISA made by the Act expire 180 days after enactment, except that any order in effect on the date of enactment remains in effect until the date of expiration of such order and such orders can be reauthorized by the FISA Court.”[38] The Act expired on February 17, 2008.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_Intelligence_Surveillance_Act#Protect_America_Act_of_2007


Here's Bush's statement at the time: http://georgewbush-whitehouse.archives.gov/news/releases/2008/02/20080214-4.html

It's illegal to collect this information on Americans.

Here is information on the FISA law including the 2008 amendments.

Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 Amendments Act of 2008

Specifically, the Act:[19]

  • Prohibits the individual states from investigating, sanctioning of, or requiring disclosure by complicit telecoms or other persons.

  • Permits the government not to keep records of searches, and destroy existing records (it requires them to keep the records for a period of 10 years).

  • Protects telecommunications companies from lawsuits for "'past or future cooperation' with federal law enforcement authorities and will assist the intelligence community in determining the plans of terrorists". Immunity is given by a certification process, which can be overturned by a court on specific grounds.[20]

  • Removes requirements for detailed descriptions of the nature of information or property targeted by the surveillance if the target is reasonably believed to be outside the country.[20]

  • Increased the time for warrantless surveillance from 48 hours to 7 days, if the FISA court is notified and receives an application, specific officials sign the emergency notification, and relates to an American located outside of the United States with probable cause they are an agent of a foreign power. After 7 days, if the court denies or does not review the application, the information obtained cannot be offered as evidence. If the United States Attorney General believes the information shows threat of death or bodily harm, they can try to offer the information as evidence in future proceedings.[21]

  • Permits the Director of National Intelligence and the Attorney General to jointly authorize warrantless electronic surveillance, for one-year periods, targeted at a foreigner who is abroad. This provision will sunset on December 31, 2012.

  • Requires FISA court permission to target wiretaps at Americans who are overseas.

  • Requires government agencies to cease warranted surveillance of a targeted American who is abroad if said person enters the United States. (However, said surveillance may resume if it is reasonably believed that the person has left the States.)

  • Prohibits targeting a foreigner to eavesdrop on an American's calls or e-mails without court approval. [22]

  • Allows the FISA court 30 days to review existing but expiring surveillance orders before renewing them.

  • Allows eavesdropping in emergencies without court approval, provided the government files required papers within a week.

  • Prohibits the government from invoking war powers or other authorities to supersede surveillance rules in the future.

  • Requires the Inspectors General of all intelligence agencies involved in the President's Surveillance Program to "complete a comprehensive review" and report within one year
Effects

  • The provisions of the Act granting immunity to the complicit telecoms create a roadblock for a number of lawsuits intended to expose and thwart the alleged abuses of power and illegal activities of the federal government since and before the September 11 attacks.[citation needed]

  • Allows the government to conduct surveillance of "a U.S. person located outside of the U.S. with probable cause they are an agent of a foreign power" for up to one week (168 hours) without a warrant, increased from the previous 48 hours, as long as the FISA court is notified at the time such surveillance begins, and an application as usually required for surveillance authorization is submitted by the government to FISA within those 168 hours[21]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_Intelligence_Surveillance_Act_of_1978_Amendments_Act_of_2008#Provisions






When Leaders Go Wrong. [View all] 20score Jun 2013 OP
That last quote is quite damning. morningfog Jun 2013 #1
Good one! 20score Jun 2013 #2
You had me pscot Jun 2013 #3
Thanks! 20score Jun 2013 #31
Yeah! I like it! punkin87 Jun 2013 #4
Thanks! 20score Jun 2013 #10
Candidate Obama also said his HC plan was guaranteed to include a "robust public option" Doctor_J Jun 2013 #5
True. 20score Jun 2013 #9
+1 L0oniX Jun 2013 #12
Well done! And it's true. Doesn't come up often, but it's true. suede1 Jun 2013 #6
Thank you! 20score Jun 2013 #8
Where are the people who now hate candidate Obama? suede1 Jun 2013 #7
Yes they are. 20score Jun 2013 #11
Guess one showed up. suede1 Jun 2013 #29
Yes 20score Jun 2013 #30
+1,000! Well thought out! punkin87 Jun 2013 #13
Thank you! 20score Jun 2013 #28
That Obama quote ProSense Jun 2013 #14
What you wrote and quoted doesn't address the post. 20score Jun 2013 #15
Yes, it does. The quote ProSense Jun 2013 #16
Not implying, I said it. 20score Jun 2013 #17
You used the quote out of context, and applied it to the current program. n/t ProSense Jun 2013 #18
No I didn't. It absolutely applies. Damn, you just don't give up no matter what the facts are. 20score Jun 2013 #19
The facts are that the quote isn't about the current program and it's used out of context. n/t ProSense Jun 2013 #20
What he said was unambiguous. He doesn't say or imply that he will spy on us 20score Jun 2013 #21
You have ProSense Jun 2013 #22
The quote speaks for itself. It is not ambiguous and I'm sick of repeating myself. 20score Jun 2013 #24
Points for stamina. sibelian Jun 2013 #34
Thanks for posting marions ghost Jun 2013 #32
Into the "Memory Hole" goes what and who we voted for. He needs to know that.. KoKo Jun 2013 #23
You're right and I hope he listens to your advise. 20score Jun 2013 #25
Absolutely he needs to hear this marions ghost Jun 2013 #33
Perfect! marym625 Jun 2013 #26
Thanks! Very cool! 20score Jun 2013 #27
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