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mokawanis

(4,488 posts)

26. I think a fire extinguisher makes more sense

Mon Jun 24, 2013, 01:26 AM

Jun 2013

I think I'm much more likely to have a kitchen fire than I am to need to shoot someone. I've never been the victim of a violent crime, at least not anything involving deadly weapons or extreme violence, but I have started a few small fires in the kitchen in my time.

If I fuck up and accidentally discharge the extinguisher I'm not going to put holes in people. I get that people feel they need a gun in the house, but the odds are they're never going to have to use it for self-defense.

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Guns used for self-defense vs. acts of violence [View all] BainsBane Jun 2013 OP

The problem with Jenoch Jun 2013 #1

This is an assessment of homicide BainsBane Jun 2013 #2

YOU ARE the OP. Jenoch Jun 2013 #3

False. Unused firearms are irrelevant to either side of the gun debate. Gravitycollapse Jun 2013 #5

Please provide Jenoch Jun 2013 #99

Only for those who consider human life less important than guns BainsBane Jun 2013 #7

What about the lives Jenoch Jun 2013 #100

Everyone's life counts BainsBane Jun 2013 #119

If it's about me, why not link to this? BainsBane Jun 2013 #8

A thread about Brazil Jenoch Jun 2013 #101

This thread has zilch to do with CCW BainsBane Jun 2013 #124

Yes, but I thought Jenoch Jun 2013 #125

I'm the OP BainsBane Jun 2013 #117

Are you saying this thread Jenoch Jun 2013 #127

So anything about guns relates to any other thing ever said about guns? BainsBane Jun 2013 #129

You don't have to keep track like you suggest Jenoch Jun 2013 #137

I do care about human life, especially my own. GreenStormCloud Jun 2013 #153

That's not how it's labeled. Lizzie Poppet Jun 2013 #98

It is mislabled, I agree BainsBane Jun 2013 #118

And in the spectrum of gun crime in general violence and homocide geckosfeet Jun 2013 #4

Isn't it nice of the NRA and gun proponents BainsBane Jun 2013 #6

No. Not really. Kind of surprised you would think so. geckosfeet Jun 2013 #12

Yet gungeoneers rally around expanding concealed carry BainsBane Jun 2013 #20

So? geckosfeet Jun 2013 #28

It shows little concern about keeping guns out of the hands of criminals. BainsBane Jun 2013 #29

Better no law than a bad law. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #39

again, more proof that you all oppose background checks BainsBane Jun 2013 #44

You seem to have an odd sense of proof. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #48

saying they don't work BainsBane Jun 2013 #49

Not useless but badly implemented. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #52

Or maybe it recognizes that the effort would be waste of time and money.... geckosfeet Jun 2013 #40

no, if it were a waste of time they wouldn't spend money opposing it BainsBane Jun 2013 #42

Uhhh. You cannot even entertain the possibility? geckosfeet Jun 2013 #59

When you say something is a waste of time BainsBane Jun 2013 #61

And I feel much the same regarding you and your posts as well. geckosfeet Jun 2013 #85

nothing is a panacea BainsBane Jun 2013 #111

Ok. How is it to be implemented outside of dealer sales and gun shows? geckosfeet Jun 2013 #123

The defeated amendment didn't include that BainsBane Jun 2013 #158

NICS checks as implemented now in guns stores are over the phone and geckosfeet Jun 2013 #159

The defeated amendment DID include that. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #162

We have had the conversation twice... Pelican Jun 2013 #65

What specific problems? BainsBane Jun 2013 #69

Seriously.... Pelican Jun 2013 #84

if you refuse to be specific BainsBane Jun 2013 #109

How many criminals would Jenoch Jun 2013 #102

Obviously the gun lobby fears that criminals would not have access to guns BainsBane Jun 2013 #120

I don't oppose background checks. I have been on record on these threads Jenoch Jun 2013 #131

The best way to do that is UBC combined with registration, and harsher penalties for jmg257 Jun 2013 #126

I am opposed to gun registration. Jenoch Jun 2013 #132

Firearms registration is a complete non starter for me also. premium Jun 2013 #133

Other then limiting straw purchases and better enforcing UBC. nt jmg257 Jun 2013 #139

Sorry, premium Jun 2013 #140

Understood - we'll disagree then. Registration seems THE best way to ensure UBC. jmg257 Jun 2013 #144

Other then ensuring background checks are much more likely to be carried out, ya mean. jmg257 Jun 2013 #138

...would be quite a deterent for someone looking to deal it Jenoch Jun 2013 #141

They would have to get them from somewhere. Quite a few do so from jmg257 Jun 2013 #142

I fully support Jenoch Jun 2013 #143

Important, if unconditionally true. AnotherMcIntosh Jun 2013 #9

Proven false by Nate Silver BainsBane Jun 2013 #11

If true, then more Democrats were elected to Congress in 1994 than Republicans, AnotherMcIntosh Jun 2013 #15

More pro-gun myths proven false BainsBane Jun 2013 #23

If you perceived your points as valid, maybe you wouldn't be frustrated to the point where you AnotherMcIntosh Jun 2013 #35

voting against background checks is supporting gun proliferation BainsBane Jun 2013 #38

No, it is not. It is voting for the status quo. AnotherMcIntosh Jun 2013 #41

it's voting to keep allowing guns to wind up in the hands of criminals BainsBane Jun 2013 #45

Obviously, the gun bans in Chicago is a reason why gun violence is so low in Chicago. AnotherMcIntosh Jun 2013 #91

as you well know there is no effective gun ban in Chicago BainsBane Jun 2013 #113

That's what I don't get about carrying a weapon around mokawanis Jun 2013 #10

Why keep a fire extinguisher? pipoman Jun 2013 #13

I think a fire extinguisher makes more sense mokawanis Jun 2013 #26

Few of the licensed Jenoch Jun 2013 #103

a gun is designed to kill BainsBane Jun 2013 #31

Each tool is designed to handle the appropriate emergency. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #34

Killed to protect property BainsBane Jun 2013 #47

Those uses would normally be defined as bad/illegal. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #50

This graphic makes clear BainsBane Jun 2013 #51

Yes, it does to, the small extent that it goes. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #53

provide evidence for that point then BainsBane Jun 2013 #54

Which point? That a study of limited scope as a limited use? ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #56

That guns are mostly used for non-lethal self defense BainsBane Jun 2013 #60

You misread my post. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #62

You continue to assert that. I would like to see some data to support that claim. BainsBane Jun 2013 #115

You need to be more specific about "that". ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #151

this BainsBane Jun 2013 #157

There have been multiple studies done. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #160

That cartoon only proves that the cartoonist is anti-gun. N/T GreenStormCloud Jun 2013 #92

The conflation of such things as pipoman Jun 2013 #94

7x more likely is a statistic BainsBane Jun 2013 #116

Hmm...interesting.. pipoman Jun 2013 #155

That is probably the main difference... Pelican Jun 2013 #43

The rational world thinks about killing people? BainsBane Jun 2013 #46

First... Pelican Jun 2013 #55

On one hand you all claim only 1% of gunowners commit a homicide BainsBane Jun 2013 #57

You need a site for this ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #58

Your experience is not born out by the data BainsBane Jun 2013 #64

As accurate as these facts might be, ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #68

Missed that one BainsBane Jun 2013 #70

That one does not support your claim either. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #72

try reading it BainsBane Jun 2013 #73

Yes, they are. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #74

those who carry guns are more likely to involve themselves in altercations and homicides BainsBane Jun 2013 #77

Only if you misread it. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #80

Statistically the point is the same BainsBane Jun 2013 #81

There is the unlikely possibility you might be right. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #82

You're dissecting the text BainsBane Jun 2013 #105

No, I just understand what is, and is not, being said in your sited stats. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #110

OMG BainsBane Jun 2013 #147

It is a nice hypothetical and all. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #150

It's irrelevant BainsBane Jun 2013 #156

Irrelevant to you maybe. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #161

That statement about Texas is a LIE. GreenStormCloud Jun 2013 #89

MJ was hoping you would not notice that. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #108

Well, the issue is in Texas they aren't convincted BainsBane Jun 2013 #112

In Texas every shooting has to go before a grand jury. GreenStormCloud Jun 2013 #122

Stand your ground BainsBane Jun 2013 #149

Who said there is a high risk? Pelican Jun 2013 #63

The most common method for homicide BainsBane Jun 2013 #67

It's like you are reading entirely different posts and then responding to mine... Pelican Jun 2013 #83

Thinking does NOT equate to fantasizing. GreenStormCloud Jun 2013 #93

I refer you to this thread BainsBane Jun 2013 #114

Where, in that thread, is any gungeoner fantasizing about killing someone? N/T GreenStormCloud Jun 2013 #121

the most graphic BainsBane Jun 2013 #148

Not fantasize, but consider. GreenStormCloud Jun 2013 #152

Better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #14

This is an interesting question. geckosfeet Jun 2013 #17

Many automobile manufacturers equip their cars with spare tires. How many car owners actually AnotherMcIntosh Jun 2013 #19

Complete the probability equation. GreenStormCloud Jun 2013 #88

Woah there. This is deaths by firearm. A minority of self-defense uses kill anyone Recursion Jun 2013 #16

Yes, it is about homicide BainsBane Jun 2013 #18

So what's the distribution of those six categories? Are non-lethal self defense uses more or less... Recursion Jun 2013 #22

I don't know BainsBane Jun 2013 #25

the chart is of gun homicides BainsBane Jun 2013 #145

Evidence of non-lethal self defense use of guns is and has always been the missing piece Recursion Jun 2013 #146

"Most self defense protects property" is an interesting statement galileoreloaded Jun 2013 #107

Can't help myself. Define "acts of violence" if you would please. flvegan Jun 2013 #21

In your world, self-defense does not involve violence? How does that work? AnotherMcIntosh Jun 2013 #24

My world? BainsBane Jun 2013 #27

The article is not available to the public. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #32

You could access it from a university library BainsBane Jun 2013 #33

Lucky me that I have one of those within an hour of my house. ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #36

some public libraries as well BainsBane Jun 2013 #37

The chart seems to come from this article: ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #30

And everything on that chart madville Jun 2013 #66

guns don't kill, people do BainsBane Jun 2013 #71

True, but a small number is exponentially higher ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #75

nonetheless true BainsBane Jun 2013 #76

OK, that really was your point? ManiacJoe Jun 2013 #78

Probably around 0.0004% madville Jun 2013 #79

hmm, other gungenoneers have claimed it is one percent BainsBane Jun 2013 #104

An image pulled from Facebook pintobean Jun 2013 #86

Thanks anyway but I'll take my chances. ileus Jun 2013 #87

That graphic is from 1998, do you have anything more recent? n/t tammywammy Jun 2013 #90

Of coarse not.. pipoman Jun 2013 #97

So rrneck Jun 2013 #95

It's a body count distribution, a chart of deaths Nimajneb Nilknarf Jun 2013 #96

I am a bit confused sarisataka Jun 2013 #106

Typical flawed anti rights study. former9thward Jun 2013 #128

anti rights, as though guns are the only rights that matter BainsBane Jun 2013 #130

If I have to provide evidence that me holding a gun will stop you from attacking former9thward Jun 2013 #134

Common sense should be enough evidence. GreenStormCloud Jun 2013 #154

From my vantage, you're doing a fine job, Bains. nt Eleanors38 Jun 2013 #135

Them main use of guns is not for either Suicide, Self-defense, or acts of violence 1-Old-Man Jun 2013 #136