General Discussion

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)

52. If they didn't already have this information, wouldn't Russia and China

Tue Jun 25, 2013, 04:04 PM

Jun 2013

be offering the moon and a villa in France for it? Or something Snowden might like? A harem in the south of Russia?

But they aren't. We didn't know the extent and scope of this surveillance. That is why we are, at last I am, stunned by this news.

But the governments of large and powerful countries may have known it for a long time -- or guessed it.

So far, to our knowledge, Russia and China have not offered much at all to Snowden.

Maybe we just don't know about it, but that we haven't heard anything to that effect thus far makes me wonder whether they have known about these programs all along.

I am just speculating, but it is odd that we haven't heard much outrage from these countries. They probably spy on us too. Do you think?

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#Snowden: Amnesty International Knows What Time It Is. [View all] JackRiddler Jun 2013 OP

NSA PRISM Spying The NSA Has No Idea How Much Secret Data Edward Snowden Took ... bemildred Jun 2013 #1

Well, too fucking bad! tavalon Jun 2013 #156

FORMER US OFFICIAL: The NSA Thinks Edward Snowden Copied 'Almost Everything That Place Does' bemildred Jun 2013 #2

Is anyone, especially the deniers, concerned that the "spy" system was so poorly rhett o rick Jun 2013 #4

Some people feel safe when things are tightly controled. zeemike Jun 2013 #9

Alduous Huxley, author of the required-reading-list classic, Brave New World: bemildred Jun 2013 #13

Yep..and we should all read it again. zeemike Jun 2013 #21

man, i was going to post something along those lines.. frylock Jun 2013 #55

Ha....beat you to it... zeemike Jun 2013 #61

Here's their tight control ;-) ReRe Jun 2013 #114

Yes, another concern Snowden has raised siligut Jun 2013 #12

I think it's being sold. And that is the reason why they are panicking. Congress funds sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #110

Have you seen this? ReRe Jun 2013 #118

That is an amazing article, frightening, out of control, and I wonder if it's too late for us? sabrina 1 Jun 2013 #162

You're pointing out the most shocking, and the most overlooked aspect of this story. Democracyinkind Jun 2013 #26

+1000 magellan Jun 2013 #49

This message was self-deleted by its author magellan Jun 2013 #50

I'll offer a third possibility nadinbrzezinski Jun 2013 #99

It's world control and money. ReRe Jun 2013 #112

Yep, power and profit are the motives. nt alsame Jun 2013 #145

Yes, I've been suprised at the lack of amazement that snowden's actions were possible at all sibelian Jun 2013 #130

Thank you. Those are... onyourleft Jun 2013 #37

If they didn't already have this information, wouldn't Russia and China JDPriestly Jun 2013 #52

They probably spy on us too. Do you think? nadinbrzezinski Jun 2013 #103

Precisely. I wonder what they are really looking for? JDPriestly Jun 2013 #104

This is propaganda gold. nadinbrzezinski Jun 2013 #106

This article from Canada tries to put some pieces together -- "Giant Blackmail machine" KurtNYC Jun 2013 #149

i think 'they' and 'us' are pretty intertwined. HiPointDem Jun 2013 #119

Check out this article... ReRe Jun 2013 #116

Have you read this article by James Bamford: ReRe Jun 2013 #113

I have read The Puzzle Palace. bemildred Jun 2013 #140

Please read the Wired article by James ReRe Jun 2013 #141

Don't tell me what to read, and don't whine at me either. bemildred Jun 2013 #142

Wow. ReRe Jun 2013 #143

Good. nt bemildred Jun 2013 #144

Geez, I don't blame you, that was totally uncalled for and rude. kas125 Jul 2013 #164

I find this all so fascinatingly delusional railsback Jun 2013 #3

You may be willing to give up our Constitutional freedoms so you can "feel" safe. Maedhros Jun 2013 #5

LoL. You're NOT giving up your Constitutional 'freedoms' railsback Jun 2013 #7

You are right, we are not giving it up zeemike Jun 2013 #15

Well, no. What's being taken away are things like railsback Jun 2013 #86

And you have every tight to protect yourself from zeemike Jun 2013 #95

Well, no, you can accidentally get pregnant like the Virgin Mary railsback Jun 2013 #100

The right to an abortion is not in the bill of rights. zeemike Jun 2013 #102

The RIGHT to an abortion is the LAW railsback Jun 2013 #108

You are correct...no-one voluntarily gave them up...they were taken... truebrit71 Jun 2013 #17

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I assume you are a Liberal. Maedhros Jun 2013 #19

I wouldn't assume anyone who joined DU, post Bush, is a liberal. kenny blankenship Jun 2013 #44

Neofascist dystopia - lol Progressive dog Jun 2013 #58

Ha railsback Jun 2013 #101

A serious overreaction railsback Jun 2013 #64

WTF on you on about? Do I "voluntarily" give up my freedom when I make a phone call? mhatrw Jun 2013 #151

How can they be a liberal if they dont support civil liberties? nm rhett o rick Jun 2013 #72

EXACTLY! they are only monitoring all our electronic communications and that is their prerogative Douglas Carpenter Jun 2013 #83

The 'public' is full of dimwits, dullards, baggers, libertarians.. railsback Jun 2013 #84

we all need to have all our communication monitored by the government or they wouldn't be doing it Douglas Carpenter Jun 2013 #87

Certainly full on Libertarianism railsback Jun 2013 #90

I don't think so. The government has just much a right to stop people from doing that as they have a Douglas Carpenter Jun 2013 #92

You and our leaders what the government spying on us. I don't. mhatrw Jun 2013 #152

Privacy is a Human Right. Spitfire of ATJ Jun 2013 #27

Like the KKK railsback Jun 2013 #54

how long have you been a member? frylock Jun 2013 #60

As long as you have railsback Jun 2013 #66

So you hate the ACLU. We get the picture. n/t mhatrw Jun 2013 #153

Are you an authoritarian? Spitfire of ATJ Jun 2013 #71

Peoples is peoples, right? railsback Jun 2013 #75

In other words, you don't trust the people to do the right thing. Spitfire of ATJ Jun 2013 #78

If we trusted people to do the right thing railsback Jun 2013 #80

Oh, I see,...you're an extremist.... Spitfire of ATJ Jun 2013 #81

How is that being extremist? railsback Jun 2013 #88

That's funny considering you were a control freak a moment ago. Spitfire of ATJ Jun 2013 #93

Well, you're assuming that through sarcasm, I support 4th Amendment rights to the KKK railsback Jun 2013 #96

That's different as the KKK is a terrorist organization.... Spitfire of ATJ Jun 2013 #98

Why don't members of the KKK deserve human rights? mhatrw Jun 2013 #154

Yeah,...to listen to them whine, you'd think they were the victims. Spitfire of ATJ Jun 2013 #160

And it's the 4th Amendment to the Constitution too. ReRe Jun 2013 #146

Republicans only care about #2. But then, they ARE full of shit. Spitfire of ATJ Jun 2013 #161

of course you do RetroLounge Jun 2013 #35

Of course you don't railsback Jun 2013 #53

what do you call it when people have unreasonable assumptions that they will be kept safe.. frylock Jun 2013 #56

What do you call people who unreasonably assume that Big Corp is keeping their info safe? railsback Jun 2013 #68

i volunteer to give my information to Big Corp.. frylock Jun 2013 #69

Yep, with your credit or debit card, address, where you like to ship railsback Jun 2013 #70

I don't recollect granting you the fucking authority... 99Forever Jun 2013 #77

Oh, sorry, didn't know I was speaking to ad hominem master Glenn Greenwald himself! railsback Jun 2013 #79

People who believe the government is spying on them are called... 99Forever Jun 2013 #89

Like Death Panels. In reality, it is like a Death Panel railsback Jun 2013 #91

??????? 99Forever Jun 2013 #94

Ah, so NOT being lame is being paranoid railsback Jun 2013 #97

The Snowden-bashers don't have the "courage" to bash Amnesty Int'l... reformist2 Jun 2013 #6

They're delusional railsback Jun 2013 #8

Ask Bradley Manning how well his human rights are holding up! Civilization2 Jun 2013 #43

Post removed Post removed Jun 2013 #16

Really, you come here and then bash Amnesty? RetroLounge Jun 2013 #38

good for them yurbud Jun 2013 #10

human rights violations? I thought that term was reserved for genocide, starvation, torture... NightWatcher Jun 2013 #11

The Fourth Amendment protects human rights. JackRiddler Jun 2013 #18

Exaclty. They should wait until that starts happening. Dr Fate Jun 2013 #22

This comes off as a pathetically eager swipe at the U.S. BeyondGeography Jun 2013 #30

+1 one_voice Jun 2013 #46

I agree. When someone else posted this same thing yesterday, I actually checked the Amnesty web sit Number23 Jun 2013 #85

I see it completely opposite of you. I see where they Mojorabbit Jun 2013 #107

DUzy. ucrdem Jun 2013 #124

"as-needed, court-approved" = big joke. secret court, no warrant necessary. HiPointDem Jun 2013 #122

Write back when you can document a real-world human rights violation BeyondGeography Jun 2013 #139

spying on the population en masse *is* a human rights violation. and using the internet isn't HiPointDem Jun 2013 #163

It is. nt ucrdem Jun 2013 #126

Not at all. Union Scribe Jun 2013 #73

the only human rights are not to be starved, tortured or killed? is that the new platform of HiPointDem Jun 2013 #121

It's very silly and damages AI's credibility. nt ucrdem Jun 2013 #125

Yeah. And racism should be reserved for slavery. mhatrw Jun 2013 #155

This was posted ProSense Jun 2013 #14

Oh really? RC Jun 2013 #24

The NSA was created as a spying agency. ProSense Jun 2013 #29

Ever hear of "Mission Creep"? RC Jun 2013 #33

Sure, ProSense Jun 2013 #42

The Universal Declaration of Human Rights reorg Jun 2013 #82

Golly, this was posted! Why am I not a team or a computer JackRiddler Jun 2013 #34

"I repeat my response" RetroLounge Jun 2013 #41

....and of course they bash without link or quote uponit7771 Jun 2013 #74

Posting duplicate threads is only bad when you do it. ucrdem Jun 2013 #129

I think it's a question of degree, ucrdem. sibelian Jun 2013 #134

Exactly. Rounding up the Jews was perfectly lawful. mhatrw Jun 2013 #157

We cheer on another pro-Chinese group attacking President Obama again? Dr Fate Jun 2013 #20

pro-Chinese group ? zeemike Jun 2013 #23

They are defending Hong Kong Eddie are they not? Dr Fate Jun 2013 #25

Who is this Hong Kong Eddie you speak of. zeemike Jun 2013 #32

How Liberal is Obama with all the Republicans he has appointed? RC Jun 2013 #31

A response like that used to qualify obviously... JackRiddler Jun 2013 #36

Yeah. The Chinese just swoon over AI's defense of the Dalai Lama and Aung san suu kyi. Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2013 #39

What's Obama got to do with being liberal? sibelian Jun 2013 #132

Some here only support Amnesty Inter. when it's convenient. Re: Chavez OKNancy Jun 2013 #28

+1 sheshe2 Jun 2013 #47

Are you consistent? JackRiddler Jun 2013 #65

no, they only support amnesty when it's convenient. HiPointDem Jun 2013 #123

Du rec. Nt xchrom Jun 2013 #40

No Human Rights Violations Or Illegal Actions Were Exposed. -eom gcomeau Jun 2013 #45

What about for disclosing sensitive classified information regarding China/Russia? KittyWampus Jun 2013 #48

you said it was old news.. frylock Jun 2013 #62

K&R MotherPetrie Jun 2013 #51

Yep. And, it's "time" for more whistleblowers like Snowden worldwide. Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2013 #57

why do I see this man as a traitor ??? he specifically went out and got a job so he could do this. secondwind Jun 2013 #59

Do what? Expose a treason of 10 years or more? JackRiddler Jun 2013 #63

A long habit of not thinking a thing wrong gives it a superficial appearance of being right. Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2013 #67

It is simple. sibelian Jun 2013 #135

K&R idwiyo Jun 2013 #76

Could be. Or maybe Amnesty is wandering off course here. That happens sometimes struggle4progress Jun 2013 #105

Widney Brown's AI statement is seriously off the hook: ucrdem Jun 2013 #120

My Monthly donation to ACLU at work! bobduca Jun 2013 #109

K&R ReRe Jun 2013 #111

What "human rights violations" did Snowman disclose? As for knowing the time. . . ucrdem Jun 2013 #115

EXACTLY!!Amnesty International are just right-wing shills -ALWAYS HAVE BEEN! Everybody knows that!! Douglas Carpenter Jun 2013 #127

Let's not get carried away. nt ucrdem Jun 2013 #128

"Thanks for exposing Amnesty International as a RW propaganda mill." sibelian Jun 2013 #131

Hi sibelian, in this case at least it appears to be. ucrdem Jun 2013 #133

I call them human rights Nazis!!Trying to force their free speech and privacy rights down everyone's Douglas Carpenter Jun 2013 #136

They are what they do and they appear to be playing partisan politics. ucrdem Jun 2013 #137

No doubt!!! Just ask ANY Tea Party or Right-Wing Republicans - They LOVE Amnesty International Douglas Carpenter Jun 2013 #138

Why stop there? I say we torture them. n/t mhatrw Jun 2013 #159

kr HiPointDem Jun 2013 #117

Wow... ReRe Jun 2013 #147

about two weeks ago - I was in my favorite local bar -a place where some of the movers and shakers Douglas Carpenter Jun 2013 #148

Fair weather friend, I guess... ReRe Jun 2013 #150

Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2013 #158