General Discussion

Progressive dog

(7,604 posts)

95. Let's play the reality game

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 08:45 AM

Jun 2013

Marginal tax rates are not set by the president. Under Nixon, they stayed at where they started. Under Obama, they are higher than than where they started.

Obama does not set minimum wage. He has tried to raise it and he has almost 1/2 his Presidency left.

Nixon used WAGE and price controls to slow inflation and it didn't work. It did make most of us poorer. It did cause shortages. The price of gasoline should go up because usage must come down. Nixon did exactly the wrong thing.

Rivers were catching fire when Nixon took office. Obama DELAYED a planned 10 to 15% reduction in ozone emissions, the rules are still in place at 75 ppb rather than 60-70ppb.

Teddy Kennedy killed it. So now we move from accomplishments to proposals.

Nixon started from a different place, before 50 years of conservatives like Nixon. He moved the nation in a more conservative direction.
Obama is now moving in a liberal direction, but starting from a different place.
Obama is much more liberal/progressive than Nixon was.

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Highlight:

To Ralph Nader who said their was no difference between the Democrats and repugs. Citizens United, [View all] still_one Jun 2013 OP

Beat me to it. nt onehandle Jun 2013 #1

2000 changed everything still_one Jun 2013 #2

To the Third Way Democrats who thought we had no place to go Pab Sungenis Jun 2013 #3

Yes, and voting for 3rd party candidates helped cause this. riqster Jun 2013 #6

It only accelerated it. Pab Sungenis Jun 2013 #9

"more right than nixon, and economically more right than reagan" BULLSHIT still_one Jun 2013 #13

More hyperbolic bullshit leftynyc Jun 2013 #26

that's patently false. cali Jun 2013 #31

what bullshit. Whisp Jun 2013 #32

How telling. Pab Sungenis Jun 2013 #51

True dat. n/t 99Forever Jun 2013 #52

FIVE people call you on your bullshit because that's what it is: BULLSHIT!!! Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #59

With nothing to back up your claims. Pab Sungenis Jun 2013 #61

BULLSHIT requires no evidence. That's why it's BULLSHIT!! Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #63

You're the one calling Bullshit. Pab Sungenis Jun 2013 #65

BULLSHIT!!!! BULLSHIT!!!! BULLSHIT!!!! BULLSHIT!!!! BULLSHIT!!!! BULLSHIT!!!! BULLSHIT!!!! BULLSHIT! Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #74

"It's so because I say it's so." Pab Sungenis Jun 2013 #75

+1 DCBob Jun 2013 #98

Interesting that you want them to to substantiate THEIR posts, yet you didn't do that yourself. October Jun 2013 #101

That is totally and completely false Progressive dog Jun 2013 #80

Are you going to back up your claim? Pab Sungenis Jun 2013 #81

Bullshit, see you make a claim you prove it Progressive dog Jun 2013 #83

Under Nixon Pab Sungenis Jun 2013 #91

Let's play the reality game Progressive dog Jun 2013 #95

"So now we move from accomplishments to proposals." Pab Sungenis Jun 2013 #100

The price of gasoline has nothing to do with Presidents Progressive dog Jun 2013 #109

Ralph Nader- THIS is YOUR LEGACY. I have two choice words for you .... ... graham4anything Jun 2013 #4

Agreed Gothmog Jun 2013 #77

The Justices that Obama appointed dissented. n/t ProSense Jun 2013 #5

Nonono, that makes no difference to the "Weft, Twooo Weft". riqster Jun 2013 #8

There is a difference ... Scuba Jun 2013 #7

Today's decision, and the Citizens United decision, more than demonstrate the difference still_one Jun 2013 #20

A twice-elected Democratic President endorsed cutting Social Security .... Scuba Jun 2013 #43

Fuck Nadar, we can do it Jun 2013 #10

I will add the libertarians to my list also. One of the most selfish, self-centered ideologies still_one Jun 2013 #14

Yup self centered little bastards, just like the naderfucktards we can do it Jun 2013 #50

Al Gore ran an abysmal campaign beerandjesus Jun 2013 #11

Yep. He did. But even with that, the math confirms that Nader won Florida for Bush. onehandle Jun 2013 #12

Shrub did not win Floriduh. The SCOTUS selected/appointed him. Read the facts, Egalitarian Thug Jun 2013 #21

That happened After the Ralph Nader effect. onehandle Jun 2013 #30

Doesn't matter. You're trying to argue that Nader exercising his right to run was wrong, and Egalitarian Thug Jun 2013 #38

I thought you said SCOTUS selected him. onehandle Jun 2013 #40

They did. Certification was still required and several House members stood up to object. Egalitarian Thug Jun 2013 #41

Keep believing that if doing so floats your boat. Independent vote counting showed that bluestate10 Jun 2013 #55

Gore would have won with over-votes Gothmog Jun 2013 #79

Nader enabled the SCOTUS to steal the election Gothmog Jun 2013 #78

This is what happens when those charged with doing the nation's business place their Egalitarian Thug Jun 2013 #84

Nader won Florida? That's news to me burnodo Jun 2013 #87

He did just enough in Florida, but his view that their was no difference, history has shown that still_one Jun 2013 #17

There is a difference. Bonobo Jun 2013 #15

So how do you make the difference larger? Skidmore Jun 2013 #16

You fight and work for candidates, or run yourself. You are correct, there is too much bitching still_one Jun 2013 #18

I try to get my viewpoint out and maintain the sense of what is right, Bonobo Jun 2013 #22

You get more progressive candidates by engaging early on Skidmore Jun 2013 #23

We agree on that. nt Bonobo Jun 2013 #24

And in the wrong places. n/t Egalitarian Thug Jun 2013 #39

You must have and still have blinders on. The difference is fucking enormous. nt bluestate10 Jun 2013 #56

So you say. Bonobo Jun 2013 #69

Every time the crypt keeper crawls out of his tomb and goes on tv, I change channels. Major Hogwash Jun 2013 #19

The difference between R and Blue Dog is one of degree, not substance. hobbit709 Jun 2013 #25

Actually that is wrong on many issues. Food stamps is just one of them, but more than that, because still_one Jun 2013 #27

Show me the recorded votes on all major issues. hobbit709 Jun 2013 #28

Point taken. However, the party that controls the houses determine the agenda still_one Jun 2013 #33

And when it comes up for a vote? hobbit709 Jun 2013 #35

I said point taken. I also said you need to have the control to have the agenda, and if there are still_one Jun 2013 #42

Bluedogs helped approve Obamacare, helped stop the gross House Farm Bill, with it's bluestate10 Jun 2013 #57

we cant afford dissent in this party markiv Jun 2013 #29

Oh really? BS hobbit709 Jun 2013 #36

We can afford dissent. Good arguments enlighten. But we can't be blind. bluestate10 Jun 2013 #60

R#10 & K nt UTUSN Jun 2013 #34

But when Gore chose Lieberman as his VP, I was sick. mountain grammy Jun 2013 #37

Gawd how I despise Lieberman. Arugula Latte Jun 2013 #66

democratic politicians love Citizens United. It means they get lobby money too. liberal_at_heart Jun 2013 #44

Without Ralph, Al Gore wins Florida. Arkana Jun 2013 #45

+ infinity stevenleser Jun 2013 #49

The blindness of so called progressives stuns me at times. bluestate10 Jun 2013 #62

Context. Before there was Citizens United, there was Gramm-Leach-Bliley. beerandjesus Jun 2013 #46

you need to blame the culprits, namely SCOTUS noiretextatique Jun 2013 #47

Wrong. The SCOTUS didn't elect Bush. Bush won Florida by 1,000 votes. bluestate10 Jun 2013 #64

absolutely ridiculous noiretextatique Jun 2013 #71

Wendy Davis. Jodie Laubenberg NoPasaran Jun 2013 #48

k/r Dawson Leery Jun 2013 #53

Anyone who still believes Nader is fucking hopeless. nt bluestate10 Jun 2013 #54

The "tea party" is the Koch brothers' branch of government through the republicans Fire Walk With Me Jun 2013 #58

Definitely, fuck off, nader. Not to mention Cha Jun 2013 #67

If you lose an election, then you have-- by definition-- employed a losing strategy. Marr Jun 2013 #68

Yep. Fuck Ralph Nader. nt DevonRex Jun 2013 #70

Yep - zealots are typically unable to view the bigger picture BuddhaGirl Jun 2013 #72

What you call "zealots" actually have a more accurate grasp of the "bigger picture" Armstead Jun 2013 #97

LOL BuddhaGirl Jun 2013 #113

Typical false comparison. Armstead Jun 2013 #114

Nader Derangement Syndrome continues RandiFan1290 Jun 2013 #73

I've been waiting to see if anyone would actually explain the current lovefest with Nader. Rex Jun 2013 #76

Argh. Ralphie, go home. nt Hekate Jun 2013 #82

and where is "Ralphie"? burnodo Jun 2013 #88

Dunno, but there has been a spate of Nader postings lately, with lots of responses... Hekate Jun 2013 #89

Nader came close to making this latest SCOTUS ruling impossible. We won by one vote... stevenleser Jun 2013 #85

WTF does anything have to do with Nader? Apophis Jun 2013 #86

Thanks to the lifetime tenure of SCOTUS justices, screwing with one POTUS election can be a big deal stevenleser Jun 2013 #90

And saying that both parties are the same simply isn't so. For better or worse the Democratic Party still_one Jun 2013 #92

This has nothing to do with Nader Maximumnegro Jun 2013 #93

I realize you don't want to accept the truth, but it is the truth. stevenleser Jun 2013 #94

Strange, you seem to be saying Al Gore lost the election. Rex Jun 2013 #102

Nope, those are not mutually exclusive concepts. Gore won, Nader made it possible to steal. nt stevenleser Jun 2013 #103

Nader had nothing to do with it being stolen. Rex Jun 2013 #104

Sure he did. The tactics by Republicans made them x closer to Gore, Nader's siphoned votes got them stevenleser Jun 2013 #105

Okay, I see democracy is only good when it is convenient for some here. Rex Jun 2013 #107

Our electoral vote system only supports two viable candidates at a time. Them's the facts. You need stevenleser Jun 2013 #108

You hit the nail on the head Armstead Jun 2013 #99

Yes let's shoot the messenger Armstead Jun 2013 #96

I disagree with your position Gothmog Jun 2013 #110

Yes there are differences -- Just not enough Armstead Jun 2013 #111

The fact remains that these differences are important Gothmog Jun 2013 #112

I agree they matter Armstead Jun 2013 #115

Nader's run was a vanity exercise based on a flawed premise Gothmog Jun 2013 #116

Hpowe about the better as an improvement over the "not quite as bad" Armstead Jun 2013 #117

Citizens United benefits unions also proud2BlibKansan Jun 2013 #106