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ProSense

(116,464 posts)
53. That's
Wed Jul 3, 2013, 11:51 AM
Jul 2013

"There is absolutely no such thing as a secret body of law in a democracy."

...likely true in a perfect world or in theory, but the "secret" court was established following the Chuch Committee recommendations.

Introduced in the Senate as S. 1566 by Edward Kennedy (D–MA) on May 18, 1977
Committee consideration by: Senate Select Committee on Intelligence, Committee on the Judiciary
Passed the Senate on March 20, 1978 (95-1)
Passed the House on September 7, 1978 (246-128)
Reported by the joint conference committee on October 5, 1978; agreed to by the Senate on October 9, 1978 (Without objection) and by the House on October 12, 1978 (226-176)
Signed into law by President Jimmy Carter on October 25, 1978


The Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) was introduced on May 18, 1977, by Senator Ted Kennedy and was signed into law by President Carter in 1978. The bill was cosponsored by nine Senators: Birch Bayh, James O. Eastland, Jake Garn, Walter Huddleston, Daniel Inouye, Charles Mathias, John L. McClellan, Gaylord Nelson, and Strom Thurmond.

The FISA resulted from extensive investigations by Senate Committees into the legality of domestic intelligence activities. These investigations were led separately by Sam Ervin and Frank Church in 1978 as a response to President Richard Nixon’s usage of federal resources to spy on political and activist groups, which violates the Fourth Amendment.[4] The act was created to provide Judicial and congressional oversight of the government's covert surveillance activities of foreign entities and individuals in the United States, while maintaining the secrecy needed to protect national security. It allowed surveillance, without court order, within the United States for up to one year unless the "surveillance will acquire the contents of any communication to which a United States person is a party". If a United States person is involved, judicial authorization was required within 72 hours after surveillance begins.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_Intelligence_Surveillance_Act

Remember the vote for the Patriot Act
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022987423

If the Patriot Act is repealed, should the secret FISA Court be abolished?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022999502

Also, Udall and Wyden aren't calling for a repeal of the Patriot Act, they're proposing a fix.

The FISA Accountability and Privacy Protection Act of 2013

June 26, 2013

For Background Purposes

Public revelations about two classified data collection programs have brought renewed attention to the powerful Government surveillance authorities contained in the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA), particularly the impact on law-abiding Americans of provisions in the USA PATRIOT Act and the FISA Amendments Act of 2008. The Director of National Intelligence has acknowledged that they are being conducted pursuant to Section 215 of the USA PATRIOT and Section 702 of FISA. The FISA Accountability and Privacy Protection Act of 2013 will improve the privacy protections and accountability provisions associated with these authorities, and also strengthen oversight and transparency with regard to other provisions of the USA PATRIOT Act. Summarized below are some of the highlights of the bill’s provisions:

New and Shorter Sunset Provisions to Ensure Proper Oversight

  • Shortens the sunset for the FISA Amendments Act from December 2017 to June 2015. The June 2015 sunset would align with expiring USA PATRIOT Act provisions, and enable Congress to address these FISA provisions all at once, instead of in a piecemeal fashion.

  • Adds new June 2015 sunsets on statutes authorizing use of National Security Letters (NSLs).

Higher Standards for PATRIOT Act Surveillance Authorities

  • Elevates the threshold standard for obtaining records through Section 215 of the USA PATRIOT Act by requiring the government to show relevance to an authorized investigation and a link to one of three categories of a foreign agent, power, or group.

  • Requires that the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court approve minimization procedures for data collected under Section 215.

  • Requires the government to provide a statement of the facts and circumstances to justify its belief that the Section 215 records for tangible things, or Pen Register and Trap and Trace Devices (PR/TT) sought are relevant to an authorized investigation to obtain foreign intelligence information.

  • Strikes the one-year waiting period before a recipient can challenge a nondisclosure order for Section 215 orders and strikes the conclusive presumption in favor of the government on nondisclosure.

  • Requires the FBI to retain an internal statement of facts demonstrating the relevance of information sought to its investigation before it can issue a National Security Letter (NSL).

  • For “roving” wiretaps, requires law enforcement to identify “with particularity” the target of a wiretap request under FISA.

Increased Transparency and Public Reporting

  • Expands public reporting on the use of National Security Letters and authorities under the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, including an unclassified report on the impact of the use of these authorities on the privacy of United States persons.

  • Fixes a constitutional deficiency found by the Second Circuit Court of Appeals in Doe v. Mukasey by shifting the burden to the government to seek a court order for an NSL non-disclosure order, and allows the recipient of such a non-disclosure order to challenge it at any time.

Increased Judicial Review and Inspector General Oversight

  • Requires Inspector General audits on the use of Section 215 orders, NSLs, and other surveillance authorities under the USA PATRIOT Act.

  • Provides for a comprehensive review of FISA Amendments Act (Section 702) surveillance by the Inspector General of the Intelligence Community (IC IG).

  • Clarifies the scope of the annual reviews for Section 702 currently required by the law, in order to cover all agencies that have targeting or minimization procedures approved by the FISA Court.
http://www.leahy.senate.gov/press/the-fisa-accountability-and-privacy-protection-act-of-2013


The co-sponsors include Senators Richard Blumenthal, Jon Tester, Mark Udall and Ron Wyden.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

of course, dtom67 Jul 2013 #1
First you have to have a democracy. hobbit709 Jul 2013 #2
Supreme Court: You Can't Challenge Secret Law Because It's Secret PoliticAverse Jul 2013 #3
I got to read that later. TY /nt think Jul 2013 #4
What about in a Representative Republic? NightWatcher Jul 2013 #5
Are secret laws representative? FiveGoodMen Jul 2013 #7
We elect representatives, couldn't they keep secrets from us? NightWatcher Jul 2013 #11
Are you serious? FiveGoodMen Jul 2013 #13
Of course I can. NightWatcher Jul 2013 #14
Secrets and secret LAWS are two different things. FiveGoodMen Jul 2013 #17
If they apply to the citizenry, it'd be nice to know what they are NightWatcher Jul 2013 #19
"it'd be nice to know what they are" FiveGoodMen Jul 2013 #20
admission that secret laws are incompatible with democracy. nashville_brook Jul 2013 #41
Yes nineteen50 Jul 2013 #24
Not if it is secret from our representative. eom Festivito Jul 2013 #23
Ooh! Pedantic hairsplitting! That's always a useful contribution! (nt) Posteritatis Jul 2013 #39
"It is one of the genuine marks of servitude to have the law either concealed or precarious." bemildred Jul 2013 #6
But a Democracy can authorize a secret body of law. nm rhett o rick Jul 2013 #8
You mean a democracy can voluntarily choose to become something else? FiveGoodMen Jul 2013 #9
Senate and House oversight committees jberryhill Jul 2013 #12
Citizens targeted by these secret laws Maedhros Jul 2013 #33
So somebody just decided to make up some laws in secret? Who granted them the authority? Skidmore Jul 2013 #15
A democracy can authorize an agency to operate in secrecy. We do it all the time. rhett o rick Jul 2013 #16
That's not what is implied in the OP. Skidmore Jul 2013 #18
What agency can do that? JDPriestly Jul 2013 #30
Dont get me wrong. I am not advocating for secrecy, nor am I agreeing that rhett o rick Jul 2013 #34
The rules that the FBI is supposed to follow are not that secret. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #42
The key to what you said is that they are "supposed to follow". I think we are learning that these rhett o rick Jul 2013 #43
I just can't argue with you there. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #44
IMO we have a Constitutional Crisis. Laws are on the books today that IMHO clearly rhett o rick Jul 2013 #47
Yes. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #48
Yes nineteen50 Jul 2013 #25
And there isn't one jberryhill Jul 2013 #10
The accusation in your link has NOT been proven yet. tridim Jul 2013 #21
wrong: did you even read the letter? the word 'misinterpreting' isn't even in there. usGovOwesUs3Trillion Jul 2013 #26
Right. There is no doubt at all, and the fearfully defiant international reaction JDPriestly Jul 2013 #49
When I look at the list of Senators who signed it . . . markpkessinger Jul 2013 #37
K & R !!! WillyT Jul 2013 #22
Secret laws, secret courts, secret spying, secret wars = Government of the people? Tierra_y_Libertad Jul 2013 #27
K&R. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #28
I little concerned about people who don't grasp this concept. nt limpyhobbler Jul 2013 #29
It has to be secret for at least one practical reason... Pholus Jul 2013 #31
and this is exactly why the massive spying program is so freaking insidious, and everyone should be NoMoreWarNow Jul 2013 #32
That's the next step. It's coming unless we stop this madness. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #50
The Secret Government warrprayer Jul 2013 #35
I agree Yo_Mama Jul 2013 #36
f'n a - k 'n r nashville_brook Jul 2013 #38
K&R woo me with science Jul 2013 #40
No there isn't, you are correct. But we stopped being a democracy quite a while ago. We tried to sabrina 1 Jul 2013 #45
That's pre-2008 thinking citizen. Your post has been logged. nt Demo_Chris Jul 2013 #46
what's scary is, ignorance of the law is no excuse markiv Jul 2013 #51
you better celebrate your freedom this 4th, because it markiv Jul 2013 #52
That's ProSense Jul 2013 #53
There are, however, secret courts ... FISA ... ahem Bake Jul 2013 #54
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»There is absolutely no su...»Reply #53