General Discussion

MADem

(135,425 posts)

118. I think a lot of people weighed in without asking ATC what actually was going on.

Thu Jul 4, 2013, 03:54 AM

Jul 2013

I think the pilots may have been slow to explain the full dimensions of the difficulty to Evo, as well, which would account for his initial fit of pique, followed by pleasantries with the Austrian leadership and his mugging for the press:

I have had some experience with air traffic control in Europe. They don't "do" deviations well at all. Unless the pilot was declaring an emergency (and he wasn't), they aren't going to let just anyone land anywhere.

I think there is more to this story, but I don't think it has to do with Big Bad America. It could well be that European nations, for their own reasons--the main one being that they view Snowden as a little shit, a hot potato, a guy with little actual "news" but a lot of hubris--as way more trouble than he is worth, AND that they (initially) regarded Evo's request as a subterfuge to try and dump Snowden off on them--and they weren't having it.

Evo, for his part, wanted the 'rispetto' accorded to a head of state, and initially took umbrage at not being accorded it and being viewed as an actor in the Snowden drama. I'm guessing after he thought about it, he realized that his jokes in Moscow about the guy had been noted, and lightened up. He managed to increase his Q Score on the world stage, so it ended up being a Big Win for him.

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Claims Bolivian Presidential Plane Denied Airspace Is Bullshit. IT HAD FUEL GAUGE PROBLEMS [View all] KittyWampus Jul 2013 OP

Those silly French! LondonReign2 Jul 2013 #1

The actual evidence shows what happened. KittyWampus Jul 2013 #2

What!!!1 No poutrage justified? Buzz Clik Jul 2013 #3

If so, it's not in THAT trashy article with the slanted, yellow-journalistic photo. nt Bonobo Jul 2013 #5

It's all documented� and contains the ACTUAL BOLIVIAN PILOT'S VOICE. LOL! KittyWampus Jul 2013 #7

Do they sound like Jose Jimenez? MannyGoldstein Jul 2013 #18

Carmen Miranda. QC Jul 2013 #31

STOP IT QC Skittles Jul 2013 #125

Maybe she pieced together Taco Bell Chiuahua commercial clips HooptieWagon Jul 2013 #32

WTF? HooptieWagon Jul 2013 #19

Indeed LondonReign2 Jul 2013 #37

LOL! Perhaps just not what they intended. HooptieWagon Jul 2013 #47

So the French President... ljm2002 Jul 2013 #41

Only evidence I see is a highway map of Moscow surrounds. HooptieWagon Jul 2013 #46

There is a link to the flight plan and a representation of the flight in the article. MADem Jul 2013 #83

OP called the map the flight plan, and even described it in detail. HooptieWagon Jul 2013 #90

If you read the article, it is very clear what that pic represents, AND the flight plan IS posted in MADem Jul 2013 #95

It definitely is 'hilarity'. But the French apology shows they were turned back from French airspace muriel_volestrangler Jul 2013 #139

The Portuguese said that the a/c tried to get a refueling authorization in Lisbon. MADem Jul 2013 #144

But our basic facts are: muriel_volestrangler Jul 2013 #149

LOL on the bullseye dig at Tom Friedman. Demit Jul 2013 #158

+1 nashville_brook Jul 2013 #186

Portugal didn't want Evo dumping Snowden off on their tarmac. MADem Jul 2013 #199

They would be denying *any Bolivian plane*, probably even knowing this one was the president's muriel_volestrangler Jul 2013 #205

Morales acknowledged his role in the brouhaha, even as he complained about it. MADem Jul 2013 #218

Having found his actual speech, I don't tihnk the 'regret' was about Snowden at all muriel_volestrangler Jul 2013 #219

Well, you are quoting Putin's news agency, that answers directly to him and is his propaganda arm, MADem Jul 2013 #220

Not quoting RT, apart from the claim that he didn't mention Snowden muriel_volestrangler Jul 2013 #221

And The Guardian has changed the sub-headline to make it clear Morales does not regret muriel_volestrangler Jul 2013 #223

Well, then everything the Guardian says must be assumed to be suspect, then! MADem Jul 2013 #224

But he looks so cute in all these pictures. I like Evo. And Putin. And Obama. And I liked Hugo. freshwest Jul 2013 #214

Still chortling. :) dkf Jul 2013 #108

It's fucking funny! kentuck Jul 2013 #171

Bingo and there is no way he could have gotten there......... Historic NY Jul 2013 #194

Evo didn't help matters--he was yukking it up in Moscow about giving Eddie a lift. MADem Jul 2013 #198

actual evidence kardonb Jul 2013 #78

Ah The Old Evo Was Just Not Into The USA Canard HangOnKids Jul 2013 #92

Old Evo is into us well enough--we are his largest non-energy sector trading partner. nt MADem Jul 2013 #96

The Austrian press did not report the story you say was reported on the AtlanticWire. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #87

Well, even WAPO backed up key elements of the ATLANTIC story...I think that a couple of MADem Jul 2013 #107

I read the articles in the Austrian and French newspapers. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #113

I think a lot of people weighed in without asking ATC what actually was going on. MADem Jul 2013 #118

Cheese-eating surrender monkeys! MannyGoldstein Jul 2013 #4

Wow. So, it flew directly over the highway? Odd. cherokeeprogressive Jul 2013 #6

Not only wasn't their fuel gauge working LondonReign2 Jul 2013 #9

Jorge? Take the first left, then make another left at the M10. n/t cherokeeprogressive Jul 2013 #15

Morales moonlights as the drive-time flying eye for Radio Moscow muriel_volestrangler Jul 2013 #138

Why is that odd? Rex Jul 2013 #208

They should have said "Hey Austria, we need to land because France... MannyGoldstein Jul 2013 #8

No search for Snowden then? Really? dkf Jul 2013 #10

The article I read said the plane was searched. That is strange. Incitatus Jul 2013 #89

This message was self-deleted by its author LumosMaxima Jul 2013 #11

You are behind LittleBlue Jul 2013 #12

This message was self-deleted by its author HooptieWagon Jul 2013 #13

K&R Cali_Democrat Jul 2013 #14

LOL, awesome LondonReign2 Jul 2013 #28

Lack of facts never stopped them before. HooptieWagon Jul 2013 #36

France apologized. Portugal admitted they refused landing. Please try to keep up. morningfog Jul 2013 #16

Supporting link from the BBC. Pholus Jul 2013 #22

Of course this is the new DU Cali_Democrat Jul 2013 #17

The image in the OP is completely bogus pscot Jul 2013 #23

Oh, it counts. And it comports with Bolivia's account of the incident. morningfog Jul 2013 #25

And you appear to be one of those 'new Democrats'. n/t PoliticAverse Jul 2013 #29

Cali_Democrat, here's the only audio proof that does count: freshwest Jul 2013 #182

Hmmmm.... How many Presidential folk from down-South-America-way have died via spooky air travel? sgtbenobo Jul 2013 #20

To see the ACTUAL flight path, not the diagram showing the location of two of Moscow's airports.... Pholus Jul 2013 #21

Yes. Alleged "flight path" in OP is an obvious fake. HooptieWagon Jul 2013 #27

When the required conclusion is "BULLSHIT" the actual facts might even get in the way. Pholus Jul 2013 #30

This message was self-deleted by its author HooptieWagon Jul 2013 #33

Did you get the memo ? That talking point is 'inoperative'... PoliticAverse Jul 2013 #24

KittyRumpus does another flyover. (nt) Kurovski Jul 2013 #26

So it's only 30 miles from Moscow to Austria, flying north? Scootaloo Jul 2013 #34

stupid is as stupid does. HooptieWagon Jul 2013 #39

The sad part is LondonReign2 Jul 2013 #44

K&R flamingdem Jul 2013 #35

Oh my goodness LondonReign2 Jul 2013 #40

They must have everyone with updates that nullify their talking points on ignore. morningfog Jul 2013 #42

You seem completely unable to engage in civil forum discourse flamingdem Jul 2013 #63

Put me on ignore. morningfog Jul 2013 #68

tell 'em, flamingdem bigtree Jul 2013 #207

Great points! And as George says.. flamingdem Jul 2013 #209

Too funny usGovOwesUs3Trillion Jul 2013 #73

Do you actually have something to say? flamingdem Jul 2013 #64

Yes LondonReign2 Jul 2013 #140

Snowden case: France apologises to Bolivia over plane row Douglas Carpenter Jul 2013 #38

That's not a flight path-- it's a road map Art_from_Ark Jul 2013 #43

Because Snowden was in the car! LondonReign2 Jul 2013 #45

But who was phone?! Scootaloo Jul 2013 #52

! QC Jul 2013 #48

So THAT was the Bolivian president's plane Art_from_Ark Jul 2013 #51

LOL :) n/t Tx4obama Jul 2013 #109

DUZY! bananas Jul 2013 #114

ROFL malaise Jul 2013 #128

best post ever. nashville_brook Jul 2013 #168

lol ctsnowman Jul 2013 #190

Oh, man, another traffic jam on a rural highway... What a bummer that is. freshwest Jul 2013 #210

This message was self-deleted by its author myrna minx Jul 2013 #222

I can't recall a bigger epic fail on DU. nt HooptieWagon Jul 2013 #50

FFS, it shows the countries the plane flew over. KittyWampus Jul 2013 #53

Your map shows the Moscow area Art_from_Ark Jul 2013 #57

You sure about that? I can't find Poland or the Czech Republic ANYWHERE on that map... n/t cherokeeprogressive Jul 2013 #58

No it doesn't. It shows Moscows two airports. HooptieWagon Jul 2013 #59

Sweeeet! I get it! This is like one of those 11 dimensional chess things, right? nt Zorra Jul 2013 #60

bwahahahaha usGovOwesUs3Trillion Jul 2013 #76

pffffffffffffff.....nt temmer Jul 2013 #91

map reading skills could use a refresher. nashville_brook Jul 2013 #166

Proceed, governor. ohheckyeah Jul 2013 #196

So the cars driving in Russia were fine and not prevented from crossing French airspace suffragette Jul 2013 #55

In Soviet Russia, car drives YOU! leftstreet Jul 2013 #67

But only in a circle around Moscow! suffragette Jul 2013 #86

That sounds French! boston bean Jul 2013 #231

And some Russian drivers may speak French suffragette Jul 2013 #233

Yeah but what beverages do they serve on re routed planes? boston bean Jul 2013 #234

Ambassador coffee , of course suffragette Jul 2013 #235

almost like the Bomb the Moon threads neverforget Jul 2013 #165

Thank goodness that was cleared up Art_from_Ark Jul 2013 #70

The map makes it all so clear suffragette Jul 2013 #88

On second thought, have you ever seen those Russian car crash videos? Art_from_Ark Jul 2013 #215

Here's video proof it happened! Quantess Jul 2013 #225

LOL Art_from_Ark Jul 2013 #229

you're fucking shitting me, right? frylock Jul 2013 #49

It's as if millions of people facepalmed in awe, and were suddenly ROFL-ing Scootaloo Jul 2013 #54

i just spit pale ale all over my phone frylock Jul 2013 #56

Priceless! nt Bonobo Jul 2013 #71

Well done! TM99 Jul 2013 #112

DUzy! truebluegreen Jul 2013 #129

CLASSIC! DirkGently Jul 2013 #169

causing a great disturbance in The Force nashville_brook Jul 2013 #170

I sense a great disturbance in the Farce. n/t winter is coming Jul 2013 #195

I thought I'd witnessed the most absurd post in DU history earlier today. pa28 Jul 2013 #72

it's positively surreal frylock Jul 2013 #74

No. No. I get it now. pa28 Jul 2013 #84

later? SwampG8r Jul 2013 #232

Heck, I've linked to it a few times Aerows Apr 2016 #236

With Morales driving his plane on Moscow highways.... HooptieWagon Jul 2013 #61

Yep. QC Jul 2013 #62

stop leftstreet Jul 2013 #69

Please explain the actual flight path you've presented. pa28 Jul 2013 #65

Well, you see, there was this French guy named Napoleon and he almost HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #117

this is why i don't use ignore. nashville_brook Jul 2013 #173

The temptation to riff is irresistable. If only Napoleon had used Google Maps. "A map, HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #176

:) the is the best thread ever nashville_brook Jul 2013 #178

too many U.S. Americans don't have maps Enrique Jul 2013 #66

You went there! bravenak Jul 2013 #80

I'm laughing so hard I can't even find the spray smilie suffragette Jul 2013 #82

The Iraq HangOnKids Jul 2013 #101

DUZY! bananas Jul 2013 #115

Okay, I *have* to post it now. woo me with science Jul 2013 #134

DUzy Aerows Jul 2013 #141

Why would Bolivia lie? JDPriestly Jul 2013 #75

Thoughtful post, JD. JimDandy Jul 2013 #203

Snowden case: France apologises to Bolivia over plane row Douglas Carpenter Jul 2013 #77

It didn't have fuel gauge problems. It had mapping problems. DisgustipatedinCA Jul 2013 #79

That is NOT an image of the flight path... Spitfire of ATJ Jul 2013 #81

WE HAVE ALWAYS BEEN AT WAR WITH EASTASIA woo me with science Jul 2013 #85

Thread winner by a landslide! - nt HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #119

lol Love it. ctsnowman Jul 2013 #191

That is not an image of the flight path--though you can get that from a link in the article. MADem Jul 2013 #93

.... DeSwiss Jul 2013 #94

I think we can relate this back to education, and how we are continuing to try to strive ... to ... AtheistCrusader Jul 2013 #97

He probably did need to refuel... go west young man Jul 2013 #98

I LOVE THIS THREAD!!! K&R FOR LOL FUNNY! SaveOurDemocracy Jul 2013 #99

Stop this nonsensical bullshit. Marr Jul 2013 #100

it will not stop until 2016 Skittles Jul 2013 #124

The only ones that actually get under my skin Marr Jul 2013 #154

I voted for Obama twice Skittles Jul 2013 #189

For your consideration... Hydra Jul 2013 #102

How dare you screw with the epic media narrative of glorious victory over the evil empire?! What?!! freshwest Jul 2013 #103

This OP is a pathetic and embarrassing attempt at spin. Really stinky. Comrade Grumpy Jul 2013 #104

The audio at the OP link proves they requested to land as a precaution due to the fuel gauge. Tx4obama Jul 2013 #111

The story here isn't why they landed in Vienna . . . markpkessinger Jul 2013 #126

I disagree. I think all the 'facts' are relevant. Because looking at all the facts shows who's not Tx4obama Jul 2013 #127

So Morales' plane was NOT detained . . . markpkessinger Jul 2013 #131

And btw . . . you still haven't answered what it was . . . markpkessinger Jul 2013 #133

As I said upthread LondonReign2 Jul 2013 #142

Correction-- "facts". Marr Jul 2013 #152

It's always the same small core group trying to mislead everyone with bullshit too. Catherina Jul 2013 #146

"Dammmmmn Youuuu, Gooogle Maps..." Warren DeMontague Jul 2013 #105

Can someone please point out to me where Vienna is on this map? Douglas Carpenter Jul 2013 #106

Here is the report in the French newspaper, Le Monde. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #110

So little time, so much fail. nt Democracyinkind Jul 2013 #116

Whether or not it was denied permission to fly over France (and yes dear, it was) . . . markpkessinger Jul 2013 #120

I predict that this post woo me with science Jul 2013 #122

I wish it was entertaining Skittles Jul 2013 #123

Denial. It's not just a river in Egypt. Pathetic. n/t NoodleyAppendage Jul 2013 #121

Taking a screen shot of this Epic FAIL, before you delete it. Thank You for the entertainment!!! idwiyo Jul 2013 #130

This thread is beyond... demmiblue Jul 2013 #132

My take: The fuel problems were claimed in order to prevent Austria from denying landing rights. Democracyinkind Jul 2013 #135

Aside from which dipsydoodle Jul 2013 #136

Very well possible. nt Democracyinkind Jul 2013 #137

That's what I am thinking. Thank you. djean111 Jul 2013 #153

Breaking - new flight plan for Morales haters: muriel_volestrangler Jul 2013 #143

This is fucking embarrassing. Taking shit totally out of context for such an incredible #FAIL Catherina Jul 2013 #145

This entire thread Aerows Jul 2013 #147

well Americans do suck at geography neverforget Jul 2013 #167

And don't have enough maps Aerows Jul 2013 #175

Oh, right. These after-the-fact "technical glitches" are soooooo reliable (Hello, TWO 800!). WinkyDink Jul 2013 #148

Remind me not to let Kitty be in charge of the map Generic Other Jul 2013 #150

You are not allowed to post that while I have coffee in HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #181

Rec. That flight path is the smoking gun. The Link Jul 2013 #151

Something's definitely being smoked here. DirkGently Jul 2013 #179

Here's a more detailed image of the flight path. Marr Jul 2013 #155

Instant classic! My awe for your comedic skills knows no bounds - nt HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #183

DUzy! winter is coming Jul 2013 #188

lol Love it. ctsnowman Jul 2013 #192

For the WIN! idwiyo Jul 2013 #200

That plane makes tight turns bobduca Jul 2013 #156

Guess who rec'd this thread? LeftyMom Jul 2013 #157

It needs to be K&R'd for Epic Fail Comedy visibility. SaveOurDemocracy Jul 2013 #159

It's pretty obvious who rec'd for that reason and who lives in an alternate reality. LeftyMom Jul 2013 #160

kicked for epic fail comedy visibility h/t SaveOurDemocracy ^^ nashville_brook Jul 2013 #163

Ha ha ha ha ha! Classic! idwiyo Jul 2013 #201

Then why did the French government apologize? CanonRay Jul 2013 #161

Kick for visibility of the Truthy Mapquest "flight path." DirkGently Jul 2013 #162

DU sooper sleuth KittyWampus launches epic conspiracy theory... nashville_brook Jul 2013 #164

Kitty has left the building! nt Bonobo Jul 2013 #172

"Did he drove or did he flew?" Bonobo Jul 2013 #174

that is awesome Enrique Jul 2013 #227

Sid Dithers! cthulu2016 Jul 2013 #228

Here's an actual map of the flight path magellan Jul 2013 #177

Kick! Puglover Jul 2013 #180

best thread ever. saved to Evernote. i've not laughed so hard in ages. nashville_brook Jul 2013 #184

I so bookmarked it! Puglover Jul 2013 #185

++BOOKMARKED.++ DirkGently Jul 2013 #193

Hmm. I recommend you only use rental cars with the "unlimited miles" option. winter is coming Jul 2013 #187

Lmao!!!!! darkangel218 Jul 2013 #226

Kicking this epic fail for maximum visibility. nt HooptieWagon Jul 2013 #197

Kick for the Epic Fail (tm). Lets make it The Thread That Never Dies! idwiyo Jul 2013 #202

Well, they said they had "fuel gauge problems"... kentuck Jul 2013 #204

only a totalitarian, authoritarian thug would claim that! bigtree Jul 2013 #206

mainly because half the people I was with believed it until I explained the situation to them Dr. Strange Jul 2013 #211

How do you explain this at the Vienna airport... Major Nikon Jul 2013 #212

I guess going by surface street *would* make it easier to refuel. Starry Messenger Jul 2013 #213

Kicking for maximum epic fail. HooptieWagon Jul 2013 #216

kick QC Jul 2013 #217

kick LeftyMom Jul 2013 #230

This is an epic DU thread Aerows Apr 2016 #237