General Discussion

LiberalLovinLug

(14,700 posts)

62. Happy Independence Day neighbours!

Thu Jul 4, 2013, 03:30 PM

Jul 2013

neighbours with a U! Because U are all special friends, (and that's the way we spell it in Canada)

I celebrate with you. And that there are still brave Americans who choose to expose the truth over personal freedom and comfort. Ellsberg, Manning, Snowden and others.

We are not perfect up here, especially under our neo-con Prime Minister at present, but it has been disheartening to watch your nation not heeding your past Presidents warning; "the only thing we have to fear is fear itself" and turn xenophobic and choosing to dismantle your civil rights whose struggles and victories we up here included in our history lessons growing up.

But the aforementioned individuals, and the support they have received by many Americans, remind us that our good friends to the south still have courage to fight against tyranny, be it the previous British Empire, or the insidious creep of the Big Brother state.

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On this Independence Day, I'm thankful for Edward Snowden [View all] MannyGoldstein Jul 2013 OP

Wow, you set your sights very low. Thinkingabout Jul 2013 #1

It's an eye catching, kick the hornet's nest headline. Need to read the content to actually get it. gtar100 Jul 2013 #18

I don't think we know yet whether we have to separate the person from the disclosed info. merrily Jul 2013 #21

It seems Cryptoad Jul 2013 #45

We disagree. Besides, I don't think this surveillance is merrily Jul 2013 #50

With a warrant NSA can collect the data and store it in a searchable data base and therefore search Thinkingabout Jul 2013 #52

Warrants under the Constitution and FISA laws are for specific data that a judges agrees warrants a rhett o rick Jul 2013 #71

If the goverment Cryptoad Jul 2013 #77

There are a couple of fallacies in your reasoning. You assume those that are collecting the data rhett o rick Jul 2013 #79

If we,,, Cryptoad Jul 2013 #87

Wow, 'dooooooomed'. You need such hypberole to sell that trash. Bluenorthwest Jul 2013 #93

And tell us exactly Cryptoad Jul 2013 #102

If we need to depend on faith we are doomed. Faith is for those that have no reasoning capacity. rhett o rick Jul 2013 #99

Preservation of Data Cryptoad Jul 2013 #103

Not calling it "surveillance" does not make it right. They are gathering data on us. rhett o rick Jul 2013 #106

Yet you still Cryptoad Jul 2013 #116

Storing massive data on Americans violates the Constitution and the FISA Law. rhett o rick Jul 2013 #117

YOur logic Cryptoad Jul 2013 #118

"If the FISA warrants are Constitutional , then I am standing on the side of our constitution." rhett o rick Jul 2013 #120

There are many laws that I believe to be unjust but Cryptoad Jul 2013 #123

What is this? "These types of arguments are taking the same form as the Tea Party uses."?? rhett o rick Jul 2013 #125

Many of your arguments Cryptoad Jul 2013 #129

This is the problem Th1onein Jul 2013 #83

I am afraid Cryptoad Jul 2013 #88

The "Data Age" is no excuse. Th1onein Jul 2013 #89

If The Government... KharmaTrain Jul 2013 #98

"Scooping" up data Cryptoad Jul 2013 #105

So you'd be okay if law enforcement made a copy of every letter you ever sent.... Th1onein Jul 2013 #113

My understanding is Cryptoad Jul 2013 #115

I'm sorry, but you're not making much sense.... Th1onein Jul 2013 #121

The Constitutionally of Cryptoad Jul 2013 #124

Want to reply in a complete sentence, perhaps? Th1onein Jul 2013 #130

Grammer Police? Cryptoad Jul 2013 #131

@Merrily: "I simply suggest that we wait before making up our minds, one way or the other. " Maedhros Jul 2013 #55

It is unreasonable and rude of any one person to tell others what to do with their Bluenorthwest Jul 2013 #92

Suggesting something is 'emotional imperialism'? Is that a joke? Demit Jul 2013 #111

Since Bush spoke of this in 2005 what has Snowden exposed except the "cause" he thought he which Thinkingabout Jul 2013 #49

Did you know the NSA spied on Obama in 2004? Do you care? think Jul 2013 #51

Did the NSA obtain a warrant to do the wiretapping or was this during the period of time in which Thinkingabout Jul 2013 #57

I don't know. Does it matter as to the facts that the NSA indeed spied on think Jul 2013 #58

You may or may not agree with the Fourth Amendment but after all these years I think it is Thinkingabout Jul 2013 #64

wiretapping doesnt bother because you have nothing hide. so that makes it ok to spy on Obama? think Jul 2013 #66

Yes but it's interesting how much interest the OA has taken in this matter. gtar100 Jul 2013 #61

I think domestic surveillance felix_numinous Jul 2013 #59

K&R. nt wtmusic Jul 2013 #2

Good words of warning, that some here would rather we not heed. RC Jul 2013 #3

K&R Arctic Dave Jul 2013 #4

What exactly did he tell you that you didn't know back in 2006? HipChick Jul 2013 #5

That all my phone calls and emails are likely MannyGoldstein Jul 2013 #10

They photograph our mail, too. Demeter Jul 2013 #14

Agreed 100% MattSh Jul 2013 #25

What a great reminder. truedelphi Jul 2013 #41

You beat me to it... Just read the local paper's carrying that piece yesterday... MrMickeysMom Jul 2013 #95

"Or is everybody asleep?" ljm2002 Jul 2013 #11

We have learned that the Domestic Spying on Americans bvar22 Jul 2013 #28

+ MY household. (And Happy 4th to you bvar.) truedelphi Jul 2013 #43

Nope sorry it was well reported years ago Egnever Jul 2013 #86

I have learned that Obama officials are willing to lie to the face of my US Senator Bluenorthwest Jul 2013 #94

I didn't know the NSA wiretapped Obama, the Supreme court justices, journalists think Jul 2013 #29

LOL, if nothing is new that everyone already knew then why is he in trouble???? n-t Logical Jul 2013 #108

Now that I agree with quinnox Jul 2013 #6

Manny this is not Thanksgiving flamingdem Jul 2013 #7

If you're only thankful one day per year, you may have an empathy deficit. DisgustipatedinCA Jul 2013 #12

+a brazillion! Demeter Jul 2013 #16

Well put BrotherIvan Jul 2013 #19

Thanks to both of you. n/t DisgustipatedinCA Jul 2013 #20

Gratitude is out of place on July 4? Ya wanna think about that for a minute? merrily Jul 2013 #23

You can still take down that embarrassing post. bvar22 Jul 2013 #33

Obamas thank troops during White House barbecue morningfog Jul 2013 #81

Thankfully usGovOwesUs3Trillion Jul 2013 #8

Kicked and recommended pscot Jul 2013 #9

K&R nt Zorra Jul 2013 #13

I'm celebrating ProSense Jul 2013 #15

+ 1 And under President Obama, not President Paul (as Snowden and his Brazilian Master would BlueCaliDem Jul 2013 #32

Here is a quote from you. As context for your emoticons and adjectives... Bluenorthwest Jul 2013 #96

Thank you. n/t QC Jul 2013 #100

Well this will piss off the detractors ...and that's a good thing. L0oniX Jul 2013 #17

K&R! The shit-flingers can kiss my ass! n/t backscatter712 Jul 2013 #22

Happy birthday. merrily Jul 2013 #24

it's independence day, not thanksgiving BOG PERSON Jul 2013 #26

Although I miss 3rd Way Manny think Jul 2013 #27

K&R forestpath Jul 2013 #30

He is the Emile Zola of the 21st Century. J'Accuse Tierra_y_Libertad Jul 2013 #31

fwiw - Zola wrote J'Accuse RainDog Jul 2013 #46

Thanks, RainDog. I've been rereading Les Miserables and had Hugo on my mind. Tierra_y_Libertad Jul 2013 #47

They're both great writers RainDog Jul 2013 #48

Happy FREEDOM Day, Manny. bvar22 Jul 2013 #34

OMG, really? Hydra Jul 2013 #35

Hear, hear! +1 eom Purveyor Jul 2013 #36

HUGE K & R !!! - Thank You !!! WillyT Jul 2013 #37

We do not need to call Snowden devil or angel DonCoquixote Jul 2013 #38

"How Unreasonable Searches of Private Documents Caused the American Revolution" deurbano Jul 2013 #39

Good post. Thanks. (nt) Kurovski Jul 2013 #42

K&R ReRe Jul 2013 #40

K&R. MotherPetrie Jul 2013 #44

Well said, Manny. Particularly enjoy the LibDemAlways Jul 2013 #53

I agree with you. Snowden performed a service for us even if that Cleita Jul 2013 #54

The original patriots sometimes tarred and feathered loyalists Progressive dog Jul 2013 #56

How do you feel about Daniel Ellsberg? MannyGoldstein Jul 2013 #60

Daniel Ellsbereg is neither patriot nor scoundrel. Progressive dog Jul 2013 #63

It's a good read Go Vols Jul 2013 #69

$2 biilion to surveille everything seems like quite a bargain to me Progressive dog Jul 2013 #70

You read the entire article? Go Vols Jul 2013 #72

Yup, I read where they are tapping everything at Utah, with no way Progressive dog Jul 2013 #73

Its part of the same article Go Vols Jul 2013 #74

Do you know what was in Benedict Arnold's letter George Washington read? Bluenorthwest Jul 2013 #97

The letter was not from Arnold, Progressive dog Jul 2013 #112

Happy Independence Day neighbours! LiberalLovinLug Jul 2013 #62

Kicked and recommended. Uncle Joe Jul 2013 #65

Hear, hear! nt woo me with science Jul 2013 #67

As am I. K&R. nt DLevine Jul 2013 #68

I too am glad we now know what we know. Whatever his intentions, the results are the same. liberal_at_heart Jul 2013 #75

Happy 237th birthday of our Revolution! Waiting For Everyman Jul 2013 #76

K&R DeSwiss Jul 2013 #78

Did You Catch This ??? WillyT Jul 2013 #80

Thanks for the link. MannyGoldstein Jul 2013 #85

lol damn you're gonna get the usual suspects braying at the moon now! boilerbabe Jul 2013 #82

You might like this nadinbrzezinski Jul 2013 #84

Hero for sure... ngjtk Jul 2013 #90

Exactly right fasttense Jul 2013 #91

Who do you think is ultimately responsible for these allegedly Treasonous acts? n/t Ian David Jul 2013 #114

Metadata does not belong to you. stonecutter357 Jul 2013 #101

Take two aspirin and go to bed. Fuddnik Jul 2013 #104

It does not belong to the NSA either. But they are taking it anyway! n-t Logical Jul 2013 #109

Here is a cartoon that n2doc posted: kentuck Jul 2013 #107

Hero or scoundrel, it doesn't matter to me. Autumn Jul 2013 #110

Wonderfully stated. Harmony Blue Jul 2013 #119

K&R 99Forever Jul 2013 #122

Me too and all Whistle Blowers who risk everything to warn the people against sabrina 1 Jul 2013 #126

And i know he didn't risk his life for what i'm about to mention, but seeing... allin99 Jul 2013 #127

Agreed on all counts. nm MannyGoldstein Jul 2013 #128