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PA Democrat

(13,428 posts)
26. Gresham's dynamic, not lazy poor people in the US is responsible for the outsourcing of jobs.
Thu Feb 16, 2012, 11:01 AM
Feb 2012

Gresham's dynamics: a process in which bad ethics drive good ethics out of the marketplace. The Gresham's dynamic tilts the world in favor of fraudulent firms operating in fraud-friendly nations. It also tilts the world against workers in the developed world.


From an article on Apple by economist William Black in response to an Apple executive's claim that the US was not producing employees with the skills that Apple needed:


The statement seems to be absurd. The U.S. produces people with the substantive skills to manufacture iPhone and iPad components. Most of the jobs are low skill processes involving tasks learned at the job site by workers with no job experience. America has millions of unskilled workers. The real argument is about our supply of engineers, which is limited. But the kicker is the unusual skills that Apple's suppliers are looking for in their engineers and managers. The suppliers want engineers and managers who will selectively apply their substantive skills. American engineers and managers cannot be counted on to provide the necessary selectivity. Apple's suppliers' often seek managers willing to order their workers to exceed the lawful workweek, to refuse to pay them for significant portions of the wages they have earned, to unlawfully employ child labor, and even to coerce abortions. American managers are often unreliable in terms of their willingness to engage in these forms of illegality. American engineers are generally even more unsuited than American managers for exercising the selectivity required of engineers working for Apple's suppliers. Apple's suppliers must recruit engineers and senior managers who are willing, as the second NYT article illustrated, to produce high quality components, cheaply, with limited regard for worker safety if safety would impair either of the primary goals.

In January 2010, workers at a Chinese factory owned by Wintek, an Apple manufacturing partner, went on strike over a variety of issues, including widespread rumors that workers were being exposed to toxins. Investigations by news organizations revealed that over a hundred employees had been injured by n-hexane, a toxic chemical that can cause nerve damage and paralysis.

The engineer did not order the workers to use the nerve poison because he hated the workers. It was "just business." The nerve poison reduced cleaning time, so an engineer knowingly ordered the workers to use it and scores of other engineers did nothing to prevent the usage. U.S. engineers have the skills to recognize the greater efficiency of forcing workers to use a nerve poison to clean the screens. However, even if motivated solely by concerns about their own health, it is difficult to believe that more than a handful of American engineers would have ordered workers to use a nerve poison to clean the screens.

The second article also gives the example of aluminum dust at two of Apple's suppliers. The Chinese engineers had the technical ability to know that the dust posed a high risk of explosion. The Chinese managers at one of the suppliers were expressly warned that the build-up of aluminum dust posed an immediate risk of explosion. The managers and the engineers refused to act on their expertise, in response to the warning, or even (in the case of the plan with the second explosion), in response to the explosion of aluminum dust. It would have been expensive, however, to close the plants and fix the problem and Apple was demanding the fastest conceivable delivery of the new generation products, so the engineers had to use their expertise to improve the quality of the components and produce them faster while not using their expertise to protect the workers from what could have been catastrophic explosions. Apples' suppliers do not trust American engineers to ignore the risk to workers in order to increase production efficiency.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/william-k-black/congress-threatens-to-sow_b_799016.html

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

"The idea that ultimately the poor must help themselves as social mobility grinds to a halt" MADNESS stockholmer Feb 2012 #1
if money is a 'resource' -- and that 'resource' is becoming more scarce -- xchrom Feb 2012 #2
Money is not a "resource," but a convention--i.e., a set of agreed upon expectations. tblue37 Feb 2012 #49
I put it in quotations for a reason - for ordinary people xchrom Feb 2012 #51
Agreed. nt tblue37 Feb 2012 #52
k n r n2doc Feb 2012 #3
To the contrary...we are seeing a huge movement in the advance of the poor of the world in China dkf Feb 2012 #4
The undeserving poor. Blame the victims. PotatoChip Feb 2012 #5
The number of people China has moved out of poverty equals the entire population of the US. dkf Feb 2012 #7
By whose figures libtodeath Feb 2012 #16
UN program dkf Feb 2012 #18
But it doesnt libtodeath Feb 2012 #21
Well this report is already old and we know Chinese GDP is healthy. dkf Feb 2012 #22
I've got $10,000 that says you wrote that on a Mac. :3 nt sudopod Feb 2012 #29
China's middle class was built by taking jobs from educated Americans. Zalatix Feb 2012 #61
China's internal demand is starting to get to a point that can be sustaining. dkf Feb 2012 #63
Then if this is true we can take our jobs back and save our workers, right? Zalatix Feb 2012 #64
it's the jobs, not education alone eShirl Feb 2012 #8
I do think that Government has a role to play in creating a field that is conducive to hiring. dkf Feb 2012 #12
If government jobs didn't solve economic problems lumberjack_jeff Feb 2012 #41
the poster you're replying to = yet another free trader who finds that NOBODY agrees with him. Zalatix Feb 2012 #62
Right. As if all the farmer peasants in China suddenly got a bacehlors degree in engineering geckosfeet Feb 2012 #10
For those without education, diligence, flexibility and skill can work too. dkf Feb 2012 #15
"Apple's executives" - enough said there. geckosfeet Feb 2012 #17
Aka employer dkf Feb 2012 #19
Yes. Worship and grovel at their feet for a few crumbs. geckosfeet Feb 2012 #20
Crumbs = a job? Is it really that insignificant to you? dkf Feb 2012 #24
The people in China are slaves. So much so the Foxcon site had to put up nets to stop the suicides LiberalLoner Feb 2012 #28
If "made in the usa" isn't a viable option for apple, "sold in the usa" shouldn't either. n/t lumberjack_jeff Feb 2012 #39
If "made in the usa" isn't a viable option for apple, "sold in the usa" shouldn't either. REPEAT!!! Zalatix Feb 2012 #42
Gresham's dynamic, not lazy poor people in the US is responsible for the outsourcing of jobs. PA Democrat Feb 2012 #26
Well said. +1 nt. hifiguy Feb 2012 #31
Stop pitting the poor in China against the middle class here --it's not a zero sum game CreekDog Feb 2012 #38
You deny that our jobs are moving to India and China? Or that it's impoverishing our people? Zalatix Feb 2012 #44
So exactly what kind of education should my severely disabled daughter who is a victim of water jwirr Feb 2012 #46
Hmmph. At some point the poor will help themselves - just not in the way we expect. geckosfeet Feb 2012 #6
So let's say they do take it at a point of uprising... dkf Feb 2012 #9
I do not pretend to know the mindset of the poor. And clearly you have not a clue either. geckosfeet Feb 2012 #11
Yet there but for the Grace of God..... Redstate Bluegirl Feb 2012 #13
Exactly what those who have little themselves but are not yet on the lowest rung SammyWinstonJack Feb 2012 #23
Bingo! GoCubsGo Feb 2012 #66
Demonization (of the poor, public employees, union members, liberals, gays, etc.) a key RW tactic. pampango Feb 2012 #14
K&R Solly Mack Feb 2012 #25
Neither of those disgust me. I am disgusted by bad behavior, no matter who does it, or how much... slackmaster Feb 2012 #27
Well, as long as you are properly disgusted sudopod Feb 2012 #30
Just keep your sudopod off my chitinous exoskeleton and we'll get along fine slackmaster Feb 2012 #32
:) nt sudopod Feb 2012 #33
lol stockholmer Feb 2012 #34
+1 Kellerfeller Feb 2012 #37
K&R PhoenixAbove Feb 2012 #35
K&R woo me with science Feb 2012 #36
It's called Social Darwinism, and it's making a big comeback. Zalatix Feb 2012 #40
k&r n/t RainDog Feb 2012 #43
Of course we are back in the Calvanist era where the poor are sinners being punished for their sins. jwirr Feb 2012 #45
I believe that "disgust" is based on fear. The fear of becoming poor leads to an emotional barrier Uncle Joe Feb 2012 #47
Was about to post the same point and see you already did suffragette Feb 2012 #56
Thanks for those links Uncle Joe malaise Feb 2012 #57
k&r LeftishBrit Feb 2012 #48
k&r Starry Messenger Feb 2012 #50
another K and R etherealtruth Feb 2012 #53
Interesting. Rex Feb 2012 #54
HUGE K & R !!! - Thank You !!! WillyT Feb 2012 #55
K & R ! n/t veness Feb 2012 #58
K&R varelse Feb 2012 #59
There was a placard saying being shared on FB liberalhistorian Feb 2012 #60
K&R dajoki Feb 2012 #65
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