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Android3.14

(5,402 posts)
22. Now we are getting somewhere
Mon Jul 8, 2013, 06:05 PM
Jul 2013

So if I understand correctly, you are saying that 1. The government should not spy on innocent people, 2. that spying on a person must include the existence of a file about the person's private life for it to constitute spying, and 3. You have yet to see proof that the government is doing so, beyond what "always goes on."
I'd like to examine point 2 first.
As a school teacher, I would make a sociogram to help me build cooperative groups from the population of my students.
It is a very powerful tool.
I would hand out index cards and ask students to put there name on it, and the names of three people with whom they would like to work on a class project. From the data, I could build a map with the names of the students, (boy's names in squares and girl's in triangles) with lines and arrows connecting those squares and triangles showing me who was the most popular kid (multuiple lines pointing to him), who was the isolated kid (no lines pointing to him, but lines pointing to others), the cliques (kids who have names pointing to each others in a daisy chain that includes few outsiders). That collection of metadata (just four names) would provide me with amazing amounts of information about the individuals in the classroom.
When I took that data and combined it with the school records (think tax records and other government data), I could determine even more information about a student's possible internal landscape, from possible child abuse, neglect, ugly divorces, socioeconomic status, romantic interests and more.
I never kept the map or the cards, except for a list of names to put together in cooperative groups. Yet I would bet there are people out there who could have used that information for purposes that had little to do with protecting the welfare of the child.
All the data on the lives of those kids came from simply examining the small additional information of who they wanted to work with, similar to a list of phone contacts or Facebook "likes".
A file on an individual is unnecessary. The collection of the data is all that needs to happen, because the individual information is within the metadata.

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Excellent article LuvNewcastle Jul 2013 #1
Always attacking people, not the issue treestar Jul 2013 #2
It's plain ridiculous vdogg Jul 2013 #28
I think it has more to do with "Pre emptive Strike" strategy. dtom67 Jul 2013 #3
That's because of idiotic phrases like this. randome Jul 2013 #5
another example of the " pre emptive strike " doctrine... dtom67 Jul 2013 #7
That's the point: there is NO EVIDENCE of ILLEGAL SPYING. Amonester Jul 2013 #31
Privacy moderates are pro security state and anti the 4th amendment as understood byeya Jul 2013 #4
As long as he has another group of people to malign. nt longship Jul 2013 #6
k/r marmar Jul 2013 #8
In other words, if you disagree with the Snowden cultists you suck no matter what. geek tragedy Jul 2013 #9
It's more the starting point than any sort of purist attitude Android3.14 Jul 2013 #11
Might as well ask if I stopped beating my wife. geek tragedy Jul 2013 #13
How about we use the Oxford English definition Android3.14 Jul 2013 #15
Is possession of or access to this information enough to be considered spying? geek tragedy Jul 2013 #16
Still ignoring the essential question Android3.14 Jul 2013 #17
Obviously, having the government create files on people and examine their geek tragedy Jul 2013 #21
Now we are getting somewhere Android3.14 Jul 2013 #22
Point 2 does not represent my thinking. geek tragedy Jul 2013 #23
Then why did you state Android3.14 Jul 2013 #30
That is a starting point. It does not follow that everything else is ok. nt geek tragedy Jul 2013 #32
Are we still trying to agree on terms? Android3.14 Jul 2013 #34
I guess I don't see a great deal of difference between geek tragedy Jul 2013 #36
Rumor? Android3.14 Jul 2013 #37
recording content or recording metadata? geek tragedy Jul 2013 #38
Not rumor Android3.14 Jul 2013 #39
That story has been thoroughly debunked. It's false. geek tragedy Jul 2013 #40
Sorry, but no Android3.14 Jul 2013 #43
Without public oversight or permission, no. nt geek tragedy Jul 2013 #44
Thank you Android3.14 Jul 2013 #45
Likewise. I think there is probably more agreement than geek tragedy Jul 2013 #46
Logic and facts do not matter... kentuck Jul 2013 #10
...yeap, don't trust the government with medical records either uponit7771 Jul 2013 #12
This is a newer tact that seems to be trotted out by some. TheKentuckian Jul 2013 #14
Unless having a heart murmur has a high correlation to domestic terrorism NoOneMan Jul 2013 #20
Sure, don't. NoOneMan Jul 2013 #19
They'll know if you've been treated for addiction. JoePhilly Jul 2013 #24
Depends on how you want to structure your claims department NoOneMan Jul 2013 #25
But why would we expect our totalitarian government to JoePhilly Jul 2013 #26
You can't if you don't demand accountability and privacy NoOneMan Jul 2013 #27
Perhaps not. sibelian Jul 2013 #42
The problem is that Snowden may be a narcissist with ulterior motives who is not championing reform NoOneMan Jul 2013 #18
K&R for attracting the tragically handicapped. n/t Egalitarian Thug Jul 2013 #29
+ + Snowden attracts the slugs doesn't he? byeya Jul 2013 #41
An excellent article! Waiting For Everyman Jul 2013 #33
an excellent article for a reality based assessment of the situation Douglas Carpenter Jul 2013 #35
The problem with the NSA Agitators is… they don't talk about the NSA in any relevant way. Nothing KittyWampus Jul 2013 #47
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