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cali

(114,904 posts)

60. Oh for pity's sake. Yes, I hate how it works, but largely not for the reasons you assign to me

Wed Jul 10, 2013, 09:20 AM

Jul 2013

I hate the huge amounts of money involved more than anything. I've never called anyone or any group evil.

So yeppers, you're wrong. Not a huge surprise. No surprise at all. I don't look at it so simplistically.

I can't make anyone run. I have no idea whether anyone will run who I will enthusiastically support. I don't look for some "oh so special, truly acceptable, blah, blah blah candidate. I'm a realist. I do not, for instance, support Warren because I don't think she has the experience in politics and campaigning and she's not terribly good at it, she doesn't have that ineffable quality that Bill Clinton and Obama have and she doesn't have the D.C. base she'd need.

so yeppers, you're not just wrong. you're completely and utterly wrong, dear.

and as for Hillary? She may or may not run. Looks like she will, but anything can happen. I also think there's more Hillary and Clinton fatigue than is currently apparent- though I have nothing to back that up.

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If she runs, I will Support Hillary Clinton from start to finish in 2016 [View all] Pretzel_Warrior Jul 2013 OP

she should be challenged in the primary by more progressive candidates bigtree Jul 2013 #1

Who have you got? brooklynite Jul 2013 #86

well, you're on the right track about the money and organization bigtree Jul 2013 #105

Warren and Greyson..... daleanime Jul 2013 #138

They're not "real candidates".... brooklynite Jul 2013 #145

I'll hope for an actual progressive in the primary. MrSlayer Jul 2013 #2

+1. n/t NRaleighLiberal Sep 2013 #257

I will support a candidate that represents Progressive values. nt Bonobo Jul 2013 #3

Yes! We can't get too much of the same! We want even MORE! delrem Jul 2013 #4

WOW! Thank the lord we already have a Hillary Clinton group. We'll need it. Pretzel_Warrior Jul 2013 #5

maybe your lord will send us a progressive or liberal instead nt msongs Jul 2013 #7

If she won the primary, I'd support her, but I hope to vote for someone else. David__77 Jul 2013 #6

I wouldn't. If there were nothing better I'd pass. delrem Jul 2013 #8

Can you really be sure of such a thing? David__77 Jul 2013 #10

You would refuse to vote? If it is not too personal, what state do you live in? Pretzel_Warrior Jul 2013 #110

Any person is allowed to make that choice... Agschmid Jul 2013 #184

I predict Hillary will win 500 electoral votes and 125 million Popular votes. Biggest landslide ever graham4anything Jul 2013 #9

I predict Hillary will lose in the primary if she runs, just like she did in 2008. cali Jul 2013 #15

Hillary didn't lose in 2008. She won big time. Because she won the 45th. graham4anything Jul 2013 #24

OK, this is taking rewriting history to such an absurd length that it's jaw dropping cali Jul 2013 #27

Sorry, but I have supported Obama since 2004..Hillary would have beaten McCain and Mitt...in fact... graham4anything Jul 2013 #32

lol. I think it's a riot that you think that if Hillary is the nom, she'll win Mississippi and cali Jul 2013 #37

I'm not sure if she'd even win Arkansas, Art_from_Ark Jul 2013 #39

Oh, I think we can safely say she wouldn't. Your state is lost to dems cali Jul 2013 #44

Yup, I'm afraid you're right Art_from_Ark Jul 2013 #48

Such negativity. Positive vibes=positive results. Think of the little engine graham4anything Jul 2013 #50

It's not negativity. It's reality. cali Jul 2013 #57

R.I.P. graham4anything BOG PERSON Jul 2013 #156

Post removed Post removed Jul 2013 #166

He can't answer because he is no longer a member. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #76

here you go cali Autumn Jul 2013 #79

whoa. thanks, autumn. any idea why? cali Jul 2013 #84

"Troll", according to Skinner. (nt) NYC_SKP Jul 2013 #111

That poster was a real oddball with all the goofy hype. DCBob Jul 2013 #116

Seriously? davidpdx Jul 2013 #208

Me, either! Suich Jul 2013 #213

He started crap in the hosts forum and that is why he was removed. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #253

what do you mean when you say "she won the 45th"? What is "the 45th"? Ken Burch Jul 2013 #53

He can't answer because he is no longer a member. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #75

Finally. idwiyo Jul 2013 #80

He went too far on an issue in the hosts forum and he was removed. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #81

I wish someone would post the details or PM them.. This troll was so obvious from the beginning, idwiyo Jul 2013 #83

the host forum is blocked to non-hosts so I can't post it. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #85

I know. I should have said 'could'. That's why I didn't ask. Thank you for the tip though! idwiyo Jul 2013 #88

Sorry about that! hrmjustin Jul 2013 #90

Absolutely nothing to be sorry about! Thank you again for letting us know he is gone! idwiyo Jul 2013 #93

Welcome! hrmjustin Jul 2013 #95

Bless that skinner! I don't know why Grahm for whatever drove me so batty cali Jul 2013 #91

I did not expect it but it happened. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #92

It might have been the sheer amount of 'crazy'. He was so definitely overboard it was embarrassing. idwiyo Jul 2013 #96

Yeah, me too. I don't have anyone on ignore, but he was just about to be the first. IMHO, Nay Jul 2013 #228

I can image one that is very sad at this time. Autumn Jul 2013 #149

I can think about several who are really pissed off. Sad. Very sad. idwiyo Jul 2013 #152

check your pm's in a few... Ken Burch Jul 2013 #171

Me too? Logical Jul 2013 #188

Sorry, not you. Ken Burch Jul 2013 #189

Oh, no! Who will create an endless onslaught of "Hillary 45" posts now? BlueStater Jul 2013 #159

Yes indeed davidpdx Jul 2013 #209

Skinner . . . The real 'great equalizer' n/t RZM Jul 2013 #169

graham got 'stoned? Wonder what led to that? Ken Burch Jul 2013 #170

He went to far on an issue in the host forum. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #172

Nothing worse than a sore winner. Beacool Jul 2013 #194

If and only if she is the eventual candidate will I support her Sherman A1 Jul 2013 #11

Blub. East Coast Pirate Jul 2013 #12

Gods, I hope she doesn't run. Apophis Jul 2013 #13

^^^THIS^^^ summer-hazz Jul 2013 #17

You said it. She also brings too much baggage to the table. InAbLuEsTaTe Jul 2013 #183

+1. I'm not even remotely interested in a Hillary candidacy. n/t winter is coming Jul 2013 #247

Whoop de doo! RandiFan1290 Jul 2013 #14

I really would summer-hazz Jul 2013 #16

Why? Motown_Johnny Jul 2013 #18

Excuse me? I firmly oppose Hillary for lots of reasons but she has as much pertinant experience cali Jul 2013 #29

Agree about the experience part, but I don't think the poster was being sexist. Dawgs Jul 2013 #42

So when Republicans sneer that Obama was a 'community Organizer' rather than a state Bluenorthwest Jul 2013 #67

she ran on her first lady experience in '08 Motown_Johnny Jul 2013 #112

she largely ran on her experience as a Senator cali Jul 2013 #115

Like her policies or not, Hillary Clinton is the most qualified American to be the President Yavin4 Jul 2013 #120

Help me with the math, will you? truebluegreen Jul 2013 #178

8 years as First Lady. 8 years as a US Senator. 4 Years as SOS. Yavin4 Jul 2013 #187

I'll discount what I like. truebluegreen Jul 2013 #224

She was held accountable by the congress when she testified Yavin4 Jul 2013 #225

Now do you understand why so many Obama supporters detected racism... Yavin4 Jul 2013 #118

There's no way that Buchanan was worse than shrub Art_from_Ark Jul 2013 #40

Didn't invade anybody, either. Ken Burch Jul 2013 #56

I think you may be thinking about William Henry Harrison Art_from_Ark Jul 2013 #218

Shit...you're right. Sorry. n/t. Ken Burch Jul 2013 #249

OT somewhat, but is Buchanan viewed as 'worse' than say, U.S. Grant or HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #97

My guess is the thinking is he could have done more to avert the Civil War steve2470 Jul 2013 #217

Thanks, Steve. Not my area of expertise, so I'm going to HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #223

That's nice. I will vote for her if she wins the primary, but I strongly hope she doesn't. stillwaiting Jul 2013 #19

I hope Ralph Nader decides not to run. jessie04 Jul 2013 #20

Nader will be 82 on election day. Bluenorthwest Jul 2013 #68

I respect your choice. I will vigorously oppose Ms. Clinton in the primaries should she run cali Jul 2013 #21

I will not pledge fealty to Ms. Clinton, I will likely be voting AGAINST the clown the Repubs put up corkhead Jul 2013 #22

I'm really getting tired of holding my nose and carrying a barf bag when I vote. hobbit709 Jul 2013 #23

I agree, 100%! Kahuna Jul 2013 #25

do we really need another corporate shill? Wasn't Obama enough? bowens43 Jul 2013 #26

So Obama is a corporate shill ? Pretzel_Warrior Jul 2013 #61

yes. liberal_at_heart Jul 2013 #164

based on what? He didn't single handedly take down all the banks? Pretzel_Warrior Jul 2013 #165

If Obama is a corporate shill, why did the Kochs spend so much money against him? Jamaal510 Jul 2013 #203

She'll get a challenge from the left BeyondGeography Jul 2013 #28

Challenge from "the left" within the party - or from the outside? polichick Jul 2013 #137

Sherrod Brown would fit the description BeyondGeography Jul 2013 #139

Hard to see either of them getting the nomination... polichick Jul 2013 #142

Agreed on both counts BeyondGeography Jul 2013 #151

dr. dean frylock Jul 2013 #155

Remember how the powers-that-be took him down last time... polichick Jul 2013 #161

i do indeed recall that.. frylock Jul 2013 #162

I agree - they are afraid of him... polichick Jul 2013 #167

Dean would be terrific. InAbLuEsTaTe Jul 2013 #182

I'd go for Dean for just that reason -- entrenched party hacks on both sides are terribly Nay Jul 2013 #229

I'd go for him too, but I think he'd get farther outside the party... polichick Jul 2013 #236

Forgot to say that I agree, his grassroots, 50-state plan is brilliant... polichick Jul 2013 #237

In dodging that sniper fire in Bosnia, she MannyGoldstein Jul 2013 #30

by "sniper fire in Bosnia" bigtree Jul 2013 #82

Don't you remember the sniper attack in Bosnia? MannyGoldstein Jul 2013 #127

nope. Just remember the rw nutjobs who parroted the nonsense. bigtree Jul 2013 #148

clearly that video is an elaborate hoax frylock Jul 2013 #157

another booster . . . right on cue bigtree Jul 2013 #219

she made the stupid statement.. frylock Jul 2013 #241

why bigtree Jul 2013 #246

I found the real, real footage of that day... Whisp Jul 2013 #175

Tough as @#$&ing nails, that one MannyGoldstein Jul 2013 #180

For all the complaining in this thread, not one alternative candidate is proposed JoePhilly Jul 2013 #31

why should anyone propose an alternate? It's not our job to find a progressive candidate cali Jul 2013 #33

If the disgruntled don't think its their job to find the better candidate, JoePhilly Jul 2013 #35

Why yes. Yes, I do. Of course dems will be deciding whether or not to run cali Jul 2013 #38

I'm not talking about announcing. JoePhilly Jul 2013 #47

You're right BeyondGeography Jul 2013 #58

Oh for pity's sake. Yes, I hate how it works, but largely not for the reasons you assign to me cali Jul 2013 #60

OK, I'm wrong. JoePhilly Jul 2013 #71

Someone on another thread mentioned Sherrod Brown. DCBob Jul 2013 #43

It would be interesting to see him run. JoePhilly Jul 2013 #73

He would definitely have my support if he did run. BlueStater Jul 2013 #160

My sig doesn't count? nm MannyGoldstein Jul 2013 #45

no. JoePhilly Jul 2013 #72

OK then, a sign you to use next time: MannyGoldstein Jul 2013 #136

Howard Dean, Sherrod Brown, Elizabeth Warren are all good options. Dawgs Jul 2013 #46

Of those ... JoePhilly Jul 2013 #74

I couldn't agree more. Dean is my first choice. I think this is right time for him. Dawgs Jul 2013 #98

At this point yes I will madokie Jul 2013 #34

bless your heart datasuspect Jul 2013 #36

I will not vote for any Turd Way candidate, ever again. 99Forever Jul 2013 #41

Yes, because we need another Scalia at the Supreme Court Evergreen Emerald Jul 2013 #51

Save your guilt trip for the fools. 99Forever Jul 2013 #55

Yes...vote your "principles" as you watch the middle class continue Evergreen Emerald Jul 2013 #59

as if Hillary will stop the death of the middle class mick063 Jul 2013 #62

This board often forgets that her husband signed NAFTA, Welfare "Reform," HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #99

Run progresive candidates and I'll vote for them. 99Forever Jul 2013 #173

I will vote for whoever the Dem candidate is.. DCBob Jul 2013 #49

It's not like she's the ONLY Dem who can win. Ken Burch Jul 2013 #52

I intend to support her fully! hrmjustin Jul 2013 #54

Imagine my surprise. n/t Le Taz Hot Jul 2013 #63

It says a lot that you got all these replies and only 9 RECs ChangeUp106 Jul 2013 #64

Now go through and count how many alternative candidates are JoePhilly Jul 2013 #77

The 'alternative' to Hillary will be the GOP candidate leftstreet Jul 2013 #117

So there aren't any more progressive alternatives? JoePhilly Jul 2013 #121

It's possible the GOPer could be more progressive leftstreet Jul 2013 #122

Which one? JoePhilly Jul 2013 #123

LOLOL omg you're seriously worried about that? leftstreet Jul 2013 #124

I was mocking you. JoePhilly Jul 2013 #125

Oh good leftstreet Jul 2013 #126

I doubt Hillary is worried at all about a challange from the GOP, JoePhilly Jul 2013 #129

She could be the DLC's undoing leftstreet Jul 2013 #130

I don't see how that can happen ... JoePhilly Jul 2013 #135

You actually have a good point mick063 Jul 2013 #196

Ill vote for any other candidate in the primaries bobduca Jul 2013 #65

I will support a more progressive person in the primary. NCTraveler Jul 2013 #66

is`t there anyone younger? madrchsod Jul 2013 #69

Heads explode Dantheman65 Jul 2013 #70

Me too Pretzel_Warrior, me too! Little Star Jul 2013 #78

I like O'Malley, but we'll see Recursion Jul 2013 #87

She's a fine republican candidate so go ahead olddots Jul 2013 #89

So, Bush-Clinton-Bush-Obama-Clinton? NuclearDem Jul 2013 #94

you have choice, you choose bush or clinton markiv Jul 2013 #102

I think a LOT of ground work will have to happen in this country before your brand of progressive Pretzel_Warrior Jul 2013 #107

And how the hell will electing someone just to the left of Bush NuclearDem Jul 2013 #108

I think that other Mormon (not RMoney) is just to the left of Bush Pretzel_Warrior Jul 2013 #109

"Hillary is progressive." Apophis Jul 2013 #186

George Bush, in pumps nt markiv Jul 2013 #100

Lmao!!!!! darkangel218 Jul 2013 #132

Good for you. I'll continue to hope that a Democrat runs this time... truebrit71 Jul 2013 #101

Do you think today's Dem Party could nominate anyone other than a... polichick Jul 2013 #133

No, sadly I don't... truebrit71 Jul 2013 #147

I agree - so it'll mean voting for the lesser of evils until... polichick Jul 2013 #150

I plan to support a candidate to the left of her, but if she's ultimately the candidate... well, I Ed Suspicious Jul 2013 #103

That would be a mistake. She will be the consumate insider and that won't fly after Obama's record. Coyotl Jul 2013 #104

If the wars are wound down, economy improving Pretzel_Warrior Jul 2013 #106

Women's rights was the reason I voted for Obama in 2012, but it is no longer enough liberal_at_heart Jul 2013 #168

As long as the GOP doesn't successfully cheat, Jamaal510 Jul 2013 #207

Welcome to the adults table William769 Jul 2013 #113

That s nice nadinbrzezinski Jul 2013 #114

So you already know who else is running? KamaAina Jul 2013 #119

I'll support her if she is the most liberal and populist candidate... polichick Jul 2013 #128

Is this the same Hillary that vociferously supported Bush's war and Obama's drones? Tierra_y_Libertad Jul 2013 #131

If she is the Democratic candidate after the convention, MineralMan Jul 2013 #134

I do agree that this is quite early with 2014 just around the corner Pretzel_Warrior Jul 2013 #141

Great idea. My biggest fear is that some Democrats MineralMan Jul 2013 #144

Does this mean you will not be posting "Hillary's Downfall"? AngryAmish Jul 2013 #140

I'll post it or watch it even if it is a bit cliche to do Downfall videos at this point. Pretzel_Warrior Jul 2013 #143

I draw the line at some point. No, no Hillary for me. Not in the Primary, not in the General. 1-Old-Man Jul 2013 #146

Hillary has made some bad decisions regarding foreign policy. Zen Democrat Jul 2013 #153

She was not against the raid that got Osama. Beacool Jul 2013 #195

no thanks frylock Jul 2013 #154

n/t BOG PERSON Jul 2013 #158

I'll only vote for a liberal. liberal_at_heart Jul 2013 #163

Same here. nt bluestate10 Jul 2013 #174

If she is nominated, I'll be voting for someone else. n/t Egalitarian Thug Jul 2013 #176

Who will you be voting for? Constitution Party? Pretzel_Warrior Jul 2013 #235

It doesn't matter since you guys are working so hard to elect republicans. n/t Egalitarian Thug Jul 2013 #242

If she is the nominee, very reluctantly. bluedigger Jul 2013 #177

+100 truebluegreen Jul 2013 #179

+1000 Nay Jul 2013 #232

Martin O'Malley, our next great Democratic nominee kwassa Jul 2013 #181

I will not support her in any form. Arctic Dave Jul 2013 #185

I will fight this with every fiber of my being. limpyhobbler Jul 2013 #190

my impression from other "liberal" people in DU was that Pretzel_Warrior Jul 2013 #191

loose cannon here. limpyhobbler Jul 2013 #192

loose cannon here too. I just became an independent. liberal_at_heart Jul 2013 #193

oh ok that's cool. limpyhobbler Jul 2013 #198

I am hoping some liberal democrats will run, but I will not vote for democrats who favor liberal_at_heart Jul 2013 #199

Well I can certainly understand why. I hope some better Democrats run too. limpyhobbler Jul 2013 #202

I'm not going to argue with anyone here about 2016. Beacool Jul 2013 #197

yep. I loved hearing that news. She may ultimately decide not to Pretzel_Warrior Jul 2013 #200

Yes, she will. Beacool Jul 2013 #201

Only 20 recs tells you something. n-t Logical Jul 2013 #204

Yeah, it tells you that DU is not the real world. Beacool Jul 2013 #205

I found that out several election cycles ago Pretzel_Warrior Jul 2013 #206

Yeah, that hurt. Beacool Jul 2013 #220

I don't like Hillary Clinton fadedrose Jul 2013 #210

Let's concentrate on 2014 instead of 2016. mimi85 Jul 2013 #211

As a 75-yr old, I totally agree with you... fadedrose Jul 2013 #227

What sucked even more was giving Hillary's MI delegates to Obama. Beacool Jul 2013 #221

Ya know what really sucks? AtomicKitten Jul 2013 #230

As I said, I don't give a crap what Hillary haters have to say. Beacool Jul 2013 #238

Oh, that Michigan thing again. fadedrose Jul 2013 #231

Sorry, don't have time to read it. Beacool Jul 2013 #239

The MI votes were NOT all Hillary's fadedrose Jul 2013 #245

Obama had the nomination by then anyway...and it was wrong for Michigan to break party rules Ken Burch Jul 2013 #255

I am not so sure that she would get the nomination. She was considered a virtual shoe in to get the totodeinhere Jul 2013 #212

This is 8 years later and people now know the score. Beacool Jul 2013 #222

I doubt if the GOP will be able to make many inroads among minority communities. Look at the totodeinhere Jul 2013 #226

Warren won't be ready. Beacool Jul 2013 #240

I disagree. I submit that she will be more qualified than Barack Obama was when he ran in 2008. totodeinhere Jul 2013 #248

Why are they pushing her to run ? fadedrose Jul 2013 #244

I really hope she doesn't run for President. avaistheone1 Jul 2013 #214

Amen.... fadedrose Jul 2013 #243

K & R SunSeeker Jul 2013 #215

an interesting concept ------ olddots Jul 2013 #216

Why not see if somebody in FDR's family is available to run ........nt fadedrose Jul 2013 #233

Damn straight! Shankapotomus Jul 2013 #234

I won't. bigwillq Jul 2013 #250

I'm voting for the best REAL progressive, and she isn't one. So NO, she will not get my vote. Period on point Jul 2013 #251

That wasn't why you started this thread, though. Ken Burch Jul 2013 #252

well, I can see why you'd be so cynical...but no. I saw info about Hillary and got to thinking Pretzel_Warrior Jul 2013 #254

I would like to but, to be honest, I will wait to see who else runs question everything Jul 2013 #256